[zen]

I disagree that the season is lost.

Obviously, if we started winning a lot of games, the season would be more than salvaged.

However, based on how they have performed on the field so far, it is difficult to imagine how things could turn out that drastically. But who knows? I don't stop being a fan when things get rough. I'm here to see how things develop.
The point is, season is technically not lost. Even if it were, what would be the point of burning the red shirt? There are a lot of problems that can't be blamed on the QB. If you think the season is really a waste, let's see what Matt Rogers can do. Let's give him a chance.

[johnnyzip84]

If Nicely is a substantial upgrade at this point, then JD should play him (although I kind of like the idea of saving Patrick's 4 years for the next regime). If the O-line doesn't play better, it probably won't matter a whole lot. But I don't think there is any risk to "ruining his confidence" by playing him regardless. If he has all the tools (physical, mental, emotional) he'll be able to bounce back from some adversity.

[Dr Z]

although I kind of like the idea of saving Patrick's 4 years for the next regime

You are assuming that Patrick doesn't transfer if there is a new "regime"

If the O-line doesn't play better, it probably won't matter a whole lot.

Does anybody think a QB can make a OL look bad, or look better?
Is it possible Patrick could make the line look better by making quicker decisions and having a pocket presence?

[Dr Z]

what would be the point of burning the red shirt?

Winning games would be the only reason.

[johnnyzip84]

although I kind of like the idea of saving Patrick's 4 years for the next regime

You are assuming that Patrick doesn't transfer if there is a new "regime"

If the O-line doesn't play better, it probably won't matter a whole lot.

Does anybody think a QB can make a OL look bad, or look better?
Is it possible Patrick could make the line look better by making quicker decisions and having a pocket presence?

He won't transfer once he sees the throng of quality candidates that I'M lining up

Sure there is a symbiotic relationship betweeb QB and O-line. There may be some help available for the O-line in that regard. If the quick passing game gets going, perhaps that opens up the run a little. I don't think Patrick can help with the consecutive false starts though.

[new yorker]

Start the backups of all the positions where our players fell short and make sure that includes the veteran players (those with more than 2 starts) as well.

[Dave in Green]

I did not say that I was against burning Nicely's redshirt under any circumstances. I've been pretty consistent in saying that Rodgers should be given a fair chance. I do not think the situation Rodgers was thrown into with IU and CMU can reasonably be defined as a "fair chance." It was pretty much a worst case scenario of being thrown into the fire with no warning.

The next couple of games will make my determination. Based on his performance in these games, if it appears to me as if Rodgers cannot consistently lead the team to good performances over the remainder of the season, then I would agree that giving Nicely a shot is the smart thing to do. Even if it didn't produce more wins this year, it would allow Nicely to begin next season with more experience and a better shot at winning more games next season.

But I don't think that either QB can carry the rest of the team and the coaching staff on their shoulders.

[Dave in Green]

At this point it really doesn't matter how bad they looked in those losses.

Sure it does, it's a great indicator of how they will perform in the future if things continue the way they have in the past.

You only quoted half of my point. The second half completes the thought: It only matters if that level of play becomes the norm for the remainder of the season.

Many decades of following sports have taught me that some teams play roughly the same pace all season, some bounce back and forth between good and bad, some start fast and fold at the end, and some start slow and finish fast. We won't know which profile this year's Zips fit until the end of the season.

You are correct that it's a great indicator of how they will perform in the future if things continue the way they have in the past. In fact, anything that continues the way it has in the past will remain about the same. But things don't always continue the way they have in the past.

Wading through all of the semantics, I believe that you and I are in total agreement on this point.

[GP1]

what would be the point of burning the red shirt?

I thought I posted something about this this morning, but it must not have taken. This post has nothing to do with the QB situation.

Prevailing fan logic about red shirts is that they are always good and players are better because of them. When words like "burning" are used, it is being used in a negative manner. When prevailing fan logic is one way, GP1 usually goes the other way. For example, when the fans yell, "Go for it" on fourth and four, GP1 yells, "Punt. Don't listen to the crowd, they've been drinking all day". I always laugh when announcers say, "The fans want them to go for it". Of course they do, they are impaired by alchol.

Here we go. Red shirts are on scout team. Players on scout team do not get much individual attention and do not develop during the season. Being red shirted can stunt their growth and in some ways harm their development when bad habbits are developed, etc. Players develop by playing them in games. When a player is on scout team, there is no telling how he will do in a game. Red shirts are not always good.

If a player can play, then play him. The people of Ohio are paying too much for our guys to go to school not to use them if they can help win.

[ZachTheZip]

Nicely is no longer on the Scout team. He's second string, preparing to start in the case of an injury to Rodgers.

I want to give Rodgers two more games. I think it is a reasonable amount of time for him to show that he is capable of leading the offense, or at least showing some improvement after the bye week. After that, if he hasn't progressed at all you still have half the season for Nicely to come in. It also gives Nicely some time to get prepared as a second stringer before throwing him to the wolves. Remember that he came into this season expecting to redshirt.

[Dr Z]

I want to give Rodgers two more games.

So if we lose to Ohio and Buffalo, THEN you want to bring Nicely in for Syracuse?!?!? I don't understand that thinking.

I am guessing that Rodgers gets a VERY conservative game plan against OU, if we can win without him losing the game, so be it.
If we are hanging around but not winning half way through the third...my guess is that #16 makes an appearance. Same scenario would apply at Buffalo.
After that I would have to reaccess the progress and situation.

PS If we try to run the same type of offense that we have been, and don't "dumb down" the offense for #5, you mind as well start with #16 against OU, because most of us know what is in store. If I were JD, I would find the best 16 plays that you can run with #5 and practice those 16 plays for the next week and a half. If he is successful with those plays, you can add 30% more next week, and so on. Good luck Matt.

[Dave in Green]

Every QB has a different mix of strengths and weaknesses, and the coaching staff is responsible for designing plays that best suit the QB's strengths and avoid his weaknesses. Jacquemain was not much of a runner, and the Zips offense had been built around that fact. I think everyone agrees that Rodgers is a bigger running threat than Jacq. In the two weeks between games, if the coaching staff doesn't add good plays that take advantage of Rodgers' running ability, then for sure all the blame cannot be dumped on the QB.

[baller4life]

Every QB has a different mix of strengths and weaknesses, and the coaching staff is responsible for designing plays that best suit the QB's strengths and avoid his weaknesses. Jacquemain was not much of a runner, and the Zips offense had been built around that fact. I think everyone agrees that Rodgers is a bigger running threat than Jacq. In the two weeks between games, if the coaching staff doesn't add good plays that take advantage of Rodgers' running ability, then for sure all the blame cannot be dumped on the QB.

There is no question that Rodgers is not a D-1 QB, his throwing motion will tell you that, and the running game had better get it together or we are >>>>>> let's all face it Rodgers is a good running QB at best. Akron is in for a world of hurt if they let Rodgers play QB. He's just not a Div. 1 QB ,bottomline. I say are window of opportunity is closing.
Go Zips!!

[M. Patrick]

There is no question that Rodgers is not a D-1 QB, his throwing motion will tell you that, and the running game had better get it together or we are >>>>>> let's all face it Rodgers is a good running QB at best. Akron is in for a world of hurt if they let Rodgers play QB. He's just not a Div. 1 QB ,bottomline. I say are window of opportunity is closing.
Go Zips!!

First Post here - be kind.

I saw Rogers during the spring game make some nice plays, and I thought there was something there. Knowing that the current QB only had a year left (apparently only a game or two in harsh reality) and I had positive thoughts about it. The ball being dropped twice during the CMU game was weather-related (not a great excuse, but I was there, and it was slick). He was quick to react and get the ball back. That being said - the offense did look pretty bad until late in the game. I want to wait to see Rogers play a game after the break, with no weather related excuses to lean on. One thing I think they did WAY too often was the 1-2 yard passes on flat routes. It didn't work and I don't know why they kept trying it for 4 quarters on CMU's defense.

-ZippyGoLucky

[Dave in Green]

Yeah, the sports pages are full of stories about Tim Tebow's "bad throwing motion." Wonder how he ever made it to D1?