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"Off Week" Debate

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Ok, just because it's the off week, and we're nearing the end of season 2 in the Info with decreasing attendance, I've been thinking about some of the comments last season about pricing, namely the great GP1's assertion that you can't lower prices to nothing and then expect to bring them back up when things turn the corner (which they will at some point).

It's kindof a chicken vs. the egg question .. do the ticket prices need to be lowered, or does the value received need to be increased on a static ticket price?

I've got a thing working now w/ a client where there's ample inventory with established pricing, but they're working on a new direction to improve inventory sales without unnecessarily gutting the price point. So because I'm working through something similar at work on a totally unrelated topic, I'm curious about what the die-hard Zips fans think about the following:

NB: While we're all conscious of the current state of the FB team on the field, and there's myriad opinions on the topic, this isn't meant to be a referendum on that topic .. I'm more interested in these items on a general basis .. probably would have been more timely last season, but oh well.

  1. What season ticket pricing adjustments do you think should be made for 2011?
  2. What can be added to ticket packages to increase value to you, the likely purchaser?
  3. Do you generally renew these things early, or late? How can fans be incentivized to purchase and / or renew tickets early?
  4. Maybe this relates only to single game buys, but should there be a premium game among the six home games? What constitutes a premium game?

Curious to know your thoughts .. maybe something useful will come out of this.

Go Zips!

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namely the great GP1's assertion that you can't lower prices to nothing and then expect to bring them back up when things turn the corner (which they will at some point).

I love this topic. Let me be clear. I never said they could never raise their prices when they turn things around. It is hard to raise prices. It is easy to lower prices.

The biggest problem the Zips have is they rely greatly on season ticket sales. Those tickets are where the "money" is because they involve sales for the entire season whether or not the tickets are used, and they usually involve some sort of donation to the Z-Fund.

How do you expect these people to buy full price season tickets after the following things have happened:

1. The team lost every game.

2. They can wait for prices to drop and then go. The Zips don't sell out games and every seat is a good seat so they can buy a GA seat and have a pretty good seat to watch a game.

The Zips are past the point where there is a "demand" for tickets. Most people know when they go to buy season tickets next year they are doing it out of the goodness of their hearts. Since there is no demand for tickets, why lower price. I will use an example I have used in the past.

Before working for myself, I worked for a large building products manufacturer (try hard to figure it out). A way to create demand in your product was to decrease price (closing plants was a way to increase price by reducing supply but that was not needed during the boom years). It was called "emptying the plant". During the boom years, the plant was going to make 1.3 million square feet of drywall a day. Drywall must be stored in the factory for 24 hours before shipment. Every square foot of that drywall must move to make room for the next day's production. In order to empty the plant if we were already not sold out, the sales manager (that was me) had to call up the best customers and talk them into taking the drywall. The best customers took it as a favor at the price the Great GP1 wanted. You had to give a break to the lesser customers and risk reducing the overall price for the product in the market-place. During the boom years, it didn't matter if you gave a deal to someone. The factories were running at > 87% capacity, which meant every time you farted you could raise your price because the demand was outpacing the capacity. We received junk drywall from China for this reason.

Fast forward to the recession. Multiplication is used to figure capacity and supply and demand. As we all know from grade school math, anything multiplied by zero is zero. Building slows to a halt in the US during the recession. Drywall manufacturers lower prices to try to create demand......nobody buys. They lower prices again....nobody buys. They lower prices again to below cost....nobody buys. Essentially, there was almost zero demand for the product and if they were giving it away, nobody was going to take it into stock. In the middle of the recession, drywall prices went up in order to at least pay for the cost of production. It was unheard of, but everyone should have known that if the demand was zero, then the supply and demand curve would not work because everything becomes zero because that is how math works.

Now let's talk about the Zips. The reason they shouldn't lower prices is because there is no demand for the tickets other than a few good hearted people willing to purchase them because the love the school. Nobody has answered my question as to how many $5 tickes were sold. My guess is an extremely small amout. It isn't going to do anything other than set a low expectation for low prices and piss of the good customers. The Zips should keep their prices where they are.

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Ok, just because it's the off week, and we're nearing the end of season 2 in the Info with decreasing attendance, I've been thinking about some of the comments last season about pricing, namely the great GP1's assertion that you can't lower prices to nothing and then expect to bring them back up when things turn the corner (which they will at some point).

It's kindof a chicken vs. the egg question .. do the ticket prices need to be lowered, or does the value received need to be increased on a static ticket price?

I've got a thing working now w/ a client where there's ample inventory with established pricing, but they're working on a new direction to improve inventory sales without unnecessarily gutting the price point. So because I'm working through something similar at work on a totally unrelated topic, I'm curious about what the die-hard Zips fans think about the following:

NB: While we're all conscious of the current state of the FB team on the field, and there's myriad opinions on the topic, this isn't meant to be a referendum on that topic .. I'm more interested in these items on a general basis .. probably would have been more timely last season, but oh well.

  1. What season ticket pricing adjustments do you think should be made for 2011?
  2. What can be added to ticket packages to increase value to you, the likely purchaser?
  3. Do you generally renew these things early, or late? How can fans be incentivized to purchase and / or renew tickets early?
  4. Maybe this relates only to single game buys, but should there be a premium game among the six home games? What constitutes a premium game?

Curious to know your thoughts .. maybe something useful will come out of this.

Go Zips!

Before I can comment I need clarification on a couple of things. 1. What does your client sell besides inventory? and 2. what's the difference between a price point and a price?

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Its always better to have a high list price for your product. The way to be successful is to inflate prices for a period of time, then offer significant discounts. The discounts should go to your best customers. The guy only coming to 1 game per year should pay full price. Make it a real deal$$$ to be a season ticket holder. Offer season tickets for $25-$30 for GA. Reserved on the edges for $75-$80. Do what ever you need to do to get fans into the stadium and hope that you build a following. If you have success on the field you can slowly lower the amount of discount. Until this program starts to win again, its going to be a tough sell.

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Did someone mention multiplying anything by 0?

I remember taking MUM with Dr Hockman back in the day on the old UA television classroom in Leigh Hall.

He used to tell us they can multiply and divide by 0 at Can't.

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I'm tired of telling UA what to do without getting credit for the idea.

YouTube Tom can hug my freaking nut. He's paid big, 6-figure dollars to run UA Athletics, and he's looking for free help.

Show me you have even the slightest clue what you're doing, and show appreciation for your fans, and I'll help you, Tom. Until then, as GP1 accurately stated, I'll just sit back and watch you step on your next land mine.

What did you promise Proenza when you stepped on campus, Tom? What have you done to meet your promises?

Basketball was secured when you arrived, as was track and soccer. You have awesome football training facilities and a fantastic stadium. And your hand-picked guy kicks field goals when he needs 5 TD's. Fix that, then you can ask for free advice on ticket strategies.

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Show me you have even the slightest clue what you're doing, and show appreciation for your fans, and I'll help you, Tom. Until then, as GP1 accurately stated, I'll just sit back and watch you step on your next land mine.

You have awesome football training facilities and a fantastic stadium. And your hand-picked guy kicks field goals when he needs 5 TD's. Fix that, then you can ask for free advice on ticket strategies.

I think you did just give some free advice.

Show appreciation towards your fans by not allowing other to purchase tickets for less than what the die hards purchased theirs for.

Second, become a marketing wizard like Waddell at Cincy by winning games. It isn't difficult. Put a winning product on the field and fans come. Put crap on the field and fans stay home. There is a reason marketing is the easiest business major....it isn't that hard.

I have a marketing idea for the Zips and if fits the current state of the program. Everyone attending the next two home games will receive a free blue and gold Zips bucket autographed by TW. Fans can use the bucket to throw up in while watching the Zips play. There...I'm done giving out marketing ideas as well.

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Ok, just because it's the off week, and we're nearing the end of season 2 in the Info with decreasing attendance, I've been thinking about some of the comments last season about pricing, namely the great GP1's assertion that you can't lower prices to nothing and then expect to bring them back up when things turn the corner (which they will at some point).

It's kindof a chicken vs. the egg question .. do the ticket prices need to be lowered, or does the value received need to be increased on a static ticket price?

I've got a thing working now w/ a client where there's ample inventory with established pricing, but they're working on a new direction to improve inventory sales without unnecessarily gutting the price point. So because I'm working through something similar at work on a totally unrelated topic, I'm curious about what the die-hard Zips fans think about the following:

NB: While we're all conscious of the current state of the FB team on the field, and there's myriad opinions on the topic, this isn't meant to be a referendum on that topic .. I'm more interested in these items on a general basis .. probably would have been more timely last season, but oh well.

  1. What season ticket pricing adjustments do you think should be made for 2011?
  2. What can be added to ticket packages to increase value to you, the likely purchaser?
  3. Do you generally renew these things early, or late? How can fans be incentivized to purchase and / or renew tickets early?
  4. Maybe this relates only to single game buys, but should there be a premium game among the six home games? What constitutes a premium game?

Curious to know your thoughts .. maybe something useful will come out of this.

Go Zips!

Before I can comment I need clarification on a couple of things. 1. What does your client sell besides inventory? and 2. what's the difference between a price point and a price?

Widgets & whatsits in the medical device arena. The model is pretty different than drywall since there's: 1. Growth in the overall industry (not great, but it's there), and 2: Manufacturing is entirely outsourced. So inventory doesn't need to be moved to clear production space, it's already on hand. Also, there's not an intermediary retailer for the stuff, it's pretty much sold right to the consumer.

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Widgets & whatsits in the medical device arena. The model is pretty different than drywall since there's: 1. Growth in the overall industry (not great, but it's there), and 2: Manufacturing is entirely outsourced. So inventory doesn't need to be moved to clear production space, it's already on hand. Also, there's not an intermediary retailer for the stuff, it's pretty much sold right to the consumer.

Who is the consumer? Person at home? Hospital? Nursing home? Doctors office? All of the above?

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What season ticket pricing adjustments do you think should be made for 2011?
None. It won't matter. The tone has been set. Why would someone buy a season ticket next year? Hold on to your premium seat? Donation?

What can be added to ticket packages to increase value to you, the likely purchaser?
There is no value in tickets to see the worst team in Div I football. Unbelievable tailgating atmosphere with good weather....& savings bond maybe.

Note: another great Saturday weather day coming up with no home game.

Do you generally renew these things early, or late? How can fans be incentivized to purchase and / or renew tickets early?
I like to wait to see how many times that Joe guy from the ticket office will call me. We'll see if he can beat his record this year which was close to TEN. I would renew earlier without the harassing phone calls, but now it's a game.

Maybe this relates only to single game buys, but should there be a premium game among the six home games? What constitutes a premium game?
Tough one. The die-hard fan is going to the game no matter what, so I feel they are taking advantage of him. I understand it is to take advantage of the guy that doesn't go to all the games, but it still gives the die-hard a "violated" feeling. A premium game is one that demand will outweigh supply, supply being 25k or so.

-----------------------------------

Good marketing guys can put more butts in the seats no matter if you are winning or losing. Good marketing while you are winning can carry you through the tough times while you are not. The University of Akron has missed most of these opportunities. Let's watch and see if the basketball season is marketed JUST like the football season since some feel that anybody can market a winner. Results always speak for themselves....I'll be watching and waiting for the magic. icon_popcorn.gif

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Widgets & whatsits in the medical device arena. The model is pretty different than drywall since there's: 1. Growth in the overall industry (not great, but it's there), and 2: Manufacturing is entirely outsourced. So inventory doesn't need to be moved to clear production space, it's already on hand. Also, there's not an intermediary retailer for the stuff, it's pretty much sold right to the consumer.

Who is the consumer? Person at home? Hospital? Nursing home? Doctors office? All of the above?

The consumer is the doctor, who can generally dictate to the hospital what to buy. It's shifting, as health care cost pressures come into play, eventually the hospital purchasing guy may have a bigger say .. but thus far, it's still the docs.

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The consumer is the doctor, who can generally dictate to the hospital what to buy. It's shifting, as health care cost pressures come into play, eventually the hospital purchasing guy may have a bigger say .. but thus far, it's still the docs.

Do 80% of your sales come from 20% of your doctors?

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The consumer is the doctor, who can generally dictate to the hospital what to buy. It's shifting, as health care cost pressures come into play, eventually the hospital purchasing guy may have a bigger say .. but thus far, it's still the docs.

Do 80% of your sales come from 20% of your doctors?

Good question. I don't think I have visibility on the data to answer with a high degree of confidence. I'm guessing that no, it's probably not that top heavy. Maybe 80% comes from 50%. WAG.

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Show me you have even the slightest clue what you're doing, and show appreciation for your fans, and I'll help you, Tom. Until then, as GP1 accurately stated, I'll just sit back and watch you step on your next land mine.

You have awesome football training facilities and a fantastic stadium. And your hand-picked guy kicks field goals when he needs 5 TD's. Fix that, then you can ask for free advice on ticket strategies.

I think you did just give some free advice.

Show appreciation towards your fans by not allowing other to purchase tickets for less than what the die hards purchased theirs for.

Second, become a marketing wizard like Waddell at Cincy by winning games. It isn't difficult. Put a winning product on the field and fans come. Put crap on the field and fans stay home. There is a reason marketing is the easiest business major....it isn't that hard.

I have a marketing idea for the Zips and if fits the current state of the program. Everyone attending the next two home games will receive a free blue and gold Zips bucket autographed by TW. Fans can use the bucket to throw up in while watching the Zips play. There...I'm done giving out marketing ideas as well.

Something everyone could use. Sounds perfect. :lol:

Seriously though, simple supply and demand should determine pricing. And I don't know the right solution, but I'd think that we're spinning our wheels trying to sell tickets for these prices when a few thousand people are in attendance.

And as a fan, I'd opt for seeing people walking in the gates for free right now, if that's what it takes to get some excitement in that place.

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Something everyone could use. Sounds perfect. :lol:

Seriously though, simple supply and demand should determine pricing. And I don't know the right solution, but I'd think that we're spinning our wheels trying to sell tickets for these prices when a few thousand people are in attendance.

And as a fan, I'd opt for seeing people walking in the gates for free right now, if that's what it takes to get some excitement in that place.

Even as you sit on a seat you paid hard earned recession cash to reserve?

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And as a fan, I'd opt for seeing people walking in the gates for free right now, if that's what it takes to get some excitement in that place.

If they allow people to go to games for free, they my as well close up the stadium and end the program. Free means there is zero value in watching the Zips play. As bad as they are, there is still a value to watching them.

Supply and demand only works if there is a real demand and not just people buying tickets out of the goodness of their hearts. Right now, there is such little demand for the Zips that it my as well be zero.

The should keep prices where they are and put a team on the field worthy of those prices.

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Ok, just because it's the off week, and we're nearing the end of season 2 in the Info with decreasing attendance, I've been thinking about some of the comments last season about pricing, namely the great GP1's assertion that you can't lower prices to nothing and then expect to bring them back up when things turn the corner (which they will at some point).

It's kindof a chicken vs. the egg question .. do the ticket prices need to be lowered, or does the value received need to be increased on a static ticket price?

I've got a thing working now w/ a client where there's ample inventory with established pricing, but they're working on a new direction to improve inventory sales without unnecessarily gutting the price point. So because I'm working through something similar at work on a totally unrelated topic, I'm curious about what the die-hard Zips fans think about the following:

NB: While we're all conscious of the current state of the FB team on the field, and there's myriad opinions on the topic, this isn't meant to be a referendum on that topic .. I'm more interested in these items on a general basis .. probably would have been more timely last season, but oh well.

  1. What season ticket pricing adjustments do you think should be made for 2011?
  2. What can be added to ticket packages to increase value to you, the likely purchaser?
  3. Do you generally renew these things early, or late? How can fans be incentivized to purchase and / or renew tickets early?
  4. Maybe this relates only to single game buys, but should there be a premium game among the six home games? What constitutes a premium game?

Curious to know your thoughts .. maybe something useful will come out of this.

Go Zips!

Before I can comment I need clarification on a couple of things. 1. What does your client sell besides inventory? and 2. what's the difference between a price point and a price?

Widgets & whatsits in the medical device arena. The model is pretty different than drywall since there's: 1. Growth in the overall industry (not great, but it's there), and 2: Manufacturing is entirely outsourced. So inventory doesn't need to be moved to clear production space, it's already on hand. Also, there's not an intermediary retailer for the stuff, it's pretty much sold right to the consumer.

Still cannot respond. The first question was not what type of inventory do you sell, it was what do you sell other than inventory, and I still don't know the difference between a price point and a price. :eek:

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I think $10 is a perfectly fair general admission price for a program in the shape of the Zips right now. That's what people in Akron pay to see AA Baseball at Cannal Park. Start winning? Raise the prices...follow the Jacobs Field Model.

I have made the difficult decision NOT to be back as a football season ticket holder. Perhaps my 3 Reserved seat $$ goes to soccer tickets, or perhaps an upgrade to reserved at the JAR. All I know is that I work way too hard for my money to support a program that I see ZERO progress being made with. It's just my opinion, and I wish I felt differently. Start putting up some Ws and I may catch a game or two next year...and maybe eventually be back to buy for the season. For now, though, I'm content to watch the Zips lose from my comfy couch.

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There is limited to no demand for football tickets. There is, though, demand for futbol tickets. Can you use the demand for one to put butts in the seats for the other?

To answer the questions:

No price change. Season tickets are already a good deal.

What to add to the ticket packages? We will struggle next year to decide whether or not to get season tickets. We're only going to half the games as it is because they're so bad and our schedule keeps us away as well. Enter me in a chance for a trip to the Soccer Final 4 if I buy season tickets, then I'll buy.

I'm an early buyer, but likely won't be next year. The fact that ticket prices were slashed so much this year kind of steams my clams. You penalized me for buying early. Why do it again?

There are no premium games with this team right now. You have to have some big cajones to say that any Akron football game right now is worth a premium.

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For now, though, I'm content to watch the Zips lose from my comfy couch.

I can't blame you. One can only expect so much out of their fans.

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I'm an early buyer, but likely won't be next year. The fact that ticket prices were slashed so much this year kind of steams my clams. You penalized me for buying early. Why do it again?

I don't blame you. Being a season ticket holder is not rewarded. Especially if you are a reserved ticket holder. They treat season ticket holders like crap when they sell reserved tickets for less than face value on the day of the game. It is a stupid, stupid, stupid idea. Even worse, it is lazy to do so.

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Something everyone could use. Sounds perfect. :lol:

Seriously though, simple supply and demand should determine pricing. And I don't know the right solution, but I'd think that we're spinning our wheels trying to sell tickets for these prices when a few thousand people are in attendance.

And as a fan, I'd opt for seeing people walking in the gates for free right now, if that's what it takes to get some excitement in that place.

Even as you sit on a seat you paid hard earned recession cash to reserve?

I know. I've probably never been more unhappy about my mid-summer decision to buy a large group of reserved season tickets.

But I am also so frustrated and tired of looking around at an empty stadium this year that I probably wouldn't care if they just opened up the gates the next two games.

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No price change for tickets.

Stop slashing the price of reserve tickets throughout the season.

Stop giving away free tickets unless there is a purchase on the back end. Give away 4 GA's for the opener if they agree to buy 4 for the second game. e.g.

There will be no premium home games in 2011, although there will be two home winable games, which I like better. Both FIU and VMI are winable games.

Incentive to buy tickets?

Guaranteed parking in the same lot as 2010.

Take the plunge, put up the dough and sell football jerseys to season ticket holders.

Ditto for tailgating tents. How is it that UA doesn't sell blue or gold UA tents? The sea of blue UK tents seen at Kentucky this year was unbelievable.....and they have ONE SEC win.....Make them availavble as well.

Open access to all spring and fall practices held in the stadium - Tell that idiot they hire that harasses anyone that walks by the stadium during a practice to go away. Exaclty what the hell are we hiding, anyway!

Just win baby!!!!

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Going off topic, but Zips Win comment on the tents/canopies prompted this question. Who is responsible at the University or athletic department for "licensing" products like that? A couple of other examples are fatheads, Tervis tumblers, etc. I can go buy these products for other MAC teams...why not us?

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Going off topic, but Zips Win comment on the tents/canopies prompted this question. Who is responsible at the University or athletic department for "licensing" products like that? A couple of other examples are fatheads, Tervis tumblers, etc. I can go buy these products for other MAC teams...why not us?

The athletic Depatment. They are in panic mode down there right now. There have been numerous meetings with other department heads in the last 2 weeks trying to come up with some way to get the students to come to another home game.

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