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I know a lot of guys are going to get their shorts in a bunch whenever someone mentions dropping down, but it may not be a choice.

What if the governor decides to force all non-(actual) revenue producing football programs (everybody but tOSU) to Division FCS?

Akron. Bowling Green. Ken+. Miami. Ohio. Toledo. That's half of the MAC...

If most or all non-tOSU programs are downgraded, there goes the travel cost argument. One might argue that would help with travel expenses by saving the state university in Youngstown piles of money by not travelling to North and South Dakota for league games. Dayton isn't s atate school but they travel to Florida and California for conference games...

Sound far fetched? Our attendance was just 1k above the FCS average http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/football_records/Attendance/2014.pdf

It would be interesting to compare attendance of Zips football during the College Division and Division I-AA eras to the FBS era.

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This one has been sufficiently beaten into the ground. While the question itself is legit, the people that incessantly respond, re-posting their same tired rants, will quickly ruin the thread.

If you want to re-re-re-re discuss the merits of dropping to 1-AA, or how athletics conflicts with the mission of higher education, or whatever non-football subject makes you passionate...please do it in a non-marquee forum such as the "off-topic" one. Or General UA discussion. Let Dave and Balsy and Zip-O-matic type their hearts out there. But not in the Football Forum.

I want the football forum to be held to a higher standard. I'd rather it has zero activity for two straight weeks than have it be consistently populated with people who are trying to, intentionally or unintentionally, bring the program down.

Thread moved. Yet again. Any further threads on this topic, or ones that I feel with quickly be hijacked to tired, non-football rants will be deleted.

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I thought the state making the decision for us (and everyone else) was a different topic, but you're right. It'll just be the same chest thumping and rhetoric.

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I thought the state making the decision for us (and everyone else) was a different topic, but you're right. It'll just be the same chest thumping and rhetoric.

CK is right that this is a subset of the same speculative conversation and doesn't belong in the Football forum, which should be reserved for the current program and past accomplishments on the field. I'm willing to engage in reasonable conversation on just about any subject. But even I get bored when it gets repetitive as it once did with the building process thing.

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The state won't meddle so directly in individual athletic departments as to tell them to drop down to FCS. What will happen is that one day (probably sooner than later) the legislature will pass a law and the Governor will sign it that mandates that any Ohio public university not have an athletic subsidy bigger than x% of the athletic budget and give the schools three or four years to meet this target. This will all be done under the umbrella of affordability and lowering tuition. If that target were say 33%, UA would need to close the deficit--either through revenue or cuts--by $10M.

The day of reckoning, if not already at hand, is coming. To recognize that is not to be anti-UA or want to tear down the football program. It, however, might be wanting what's best for UA (the university) and the taxpayers of Ohio.

Agree though that this shouldn't be in the football forum. Possibly one thread on athletic department issues (budget and so on) and one thread on overall university positioning and rebranding and the overall USO. I think that's fair for people who care about larger university issues.

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And then it would plummet even lower.

QUIT GO THE ZIPPERS!!!!

\

I don't know about that. YSU averaged over 50% more than UA in attendance last year and isn't too far off the MAC average. They do this while running an athletic department that loses half the money that most Ohio MAC schools do ($10M subsidy).

I bet if you ask the average UA undergraduate what they would prefer, the current situation or a competitive FCS team and $500 a year lower tuition, the majority would vote to downgrade.

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It certainly didn't need another thread, but should be added here. I know some would rather obsess over which college some 17 year old kid they've never met is going to pick or what the second string secondary looks like, but I feel the big picture of what is going on at UA, college athletics and the Ohio university system deserves some debate for those interested. Hell, I didn't even attend UA, but I have ties to both Akron and UA through my wife's family and a strong interest in the reforms and restructuring of Ohio higher ed. I'd love to see Akron grow and thrive as a university during this time of change, and I apologize if some find my commentary on this board unwelcome or unnecessary. I've tried to be constructive.

In any event, this is exactly what I was talking about yesterday and how the downgrading (reigning in?) of athletics is likely to take shape. Under the Virginia model, UA would need to cut over $5M from its annual athletic budget, and I think you could reasonably see something along the lines of a 33% cap down the road.

In Virginia, it's now the law. A bill the governor signed in March caps student and public subsidies to sports at 20 percent for major conference schools, 55 percent for mid-majors and 70 percent for schools that compete at what used to be called the Division I-AA level.

http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2015/07/uncovering_the_cost_of_college.html#incart_river

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  • 2 weeks later...

One point I haven't seen mentioned in the FCS discussion was the news that came out a few months ago that UA and other MAC teams gained nearly $1 million per season in revenue by being FBS instead of FCS:

MAC revenue increased 488% under College Football Playoff

In the last year of the BCS, the MAC got a payout of $2,394,206 from overall BCS revenues. In the first year of the College Football Playoff, that amount increased to an eye-popping $14,088,086, or more than $1 million per football member. The CFP may not be the fairest system, but at least with this small sample size, it's distributing a lot more money to G5 conferences than the BCS ever did.
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I bet if you ask the average UA undergraduate what they would prefer, the current situation or a competitive FCS team and $500 a year lower tuition, the majority would vote to downgrade.

What magic situation would have occurred to allow Tom Wistercill to mastermind a "competitive FCS team"?

If the Zips were 1-AA under Wistercill's 6-year tenure, they'd suck just as bad as they did at the 1-A level, just against suckier teams and with more anonymity/obscurity.

I hope our new AD has a clue. And Bowden stays. If that's the case, this whole "that stadium" issue will soon be forgotten and we'll start drawing respectable football crowds at the 1-A level. And all the 1-AA mongers can go back to spending their days listening to AM radio.

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Under Wistercill's watch the Zips would have been outside the Top 25 in the FCS (according to Jeff Sagarin), and the attendance was just about FCS average.

This season will go a long way to climb out of that funk. Personally I trust Phil Steele and used his guides exclusively when I was covering the MAC for sports websites. He has Akron listed #2 on his list of most improved programs in all of FBS, and predicts the Zips will play in a bowl game and the BG game will determine the East Div champion. :rock:

The OT is about Spin worrying about the state coming down on all money losing FBS programs forcing them to go FCS. Others brought up good points on why that will never happen, and Scar himself has said he sees the value of a competitive FBS football program in the image of the university, including prospective students. Nobody here is advocating dropping down, especially me, I was just concerned the choice might not be ours.

BTW what's the dig with AM radio? Do we have a broadcaster on FM radio? ;) I do like Joe's radio show, nobody else covers the MAC or the Suburban League. I just don't buy into the FCS thing, we have too much potential with TB and a real AD.

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Antiquated technology. Compared to the technology in the last 15 years, content, quality, and availability can't compete. Just like the difference between the two football divisions.

Antiquated yes, but still the best source of local high school, college, and (maybe to a lesser degree) pro sports news and talk. They also stream, but if you're at the game the delay will drive you nuts. They don't podcast, I've brought that up several times.

The audio quality isn't on par with satelite radio or streaming, or even FM radio (although unlike FM you can still follow a weak signal, which is why aviation still uses AM). But you're not going to get the local content or news from the Cleveland or satelite stations.

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