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Assessing Coach Arth (and his staff)

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20 hours ago, clarkwgriswold said:

Let's not act like UA suddenly gave up on winning football or forgot how to field a successful DI program.  From the record since 1987, it is clear they never learned. Since then, no Akron head coach has been successful.  Faust had two winning seasons out of nine.  Owens had three out of nine.  Brookhart had two out of six.  Ianello had none in two years.  Knute Bowden only had two in seven years.

 

I don't know what the answer is.  I suspect it won't be settled on an internet forum.  That type of historical record certainly suggests it's more than just one bad head coach or misguided AD.

The fact that all those guys (less Ianello) each got 6-9 years tells you all that you need to know. Winning programs wouldn't tolerate consistent losers therefore would have moved on much sooner than we did. When you set the tone that 5-7 or 4-8 is good enough, that's what you're going to get.

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12 hours ago, zipsoutsider said:

The same two geniuses still mocking Bowden...when will it occur to you how wrong you have been? I guess it will take 0-24.

 

With every post you confirm the accuracy of your name.

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48 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

The fact that all those guys (less Ianello) each got 6-9 years tells you all that you need to know. Winning programs wouldn't tolerate consistent losers therefore would have moved on much sooner than we did. When you set the tone that 5-7 or 4-8 is good enough, that's what you're going to get.

 

...and so it goes...

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On 11/27/2019 at 1:46 PM, bobbyake said:

What a financial disaster this is. The first mistake was firing Bowden with 2 years left on his contract, $630,000 down the drain. Can we bring him back for next year since we’re still paying him another year?

 

Amen to everything you said in this post.  Dumbest mistake was firing Bowden.

 

On 11/27/2019 at 2:33 PM, John Ward said:

Hold up a minute there Zipsoutsider. Here is a young man, involved with the team ,who is trying to stay positive . Cut him some slack here. Zach you stay positive and ignore the nay sayers. Some just dwell in the past and can’t move on. Better days ahead.

 

This forum drove off most of the young people.  @Balsy posted frequently and was driven off (banned) for posting anti-Arth stuff in the proper thread.  Seems just about the vast majority of the Forum is on board now with what he had been saying.

 

On 11/27/2019 at 2:50 PM, ZipsVoice said:

Yep...still happy.

 

And that makes you a damn fool.

 

On 11/28/2019 at 12:30 PM, clarkwgriswold said:

I don't know what the answer is.  I suspect it won't be settled on an internet forum.  That type of historical record certainly suggests it's more than just one bad head coach or misguided AD.

 

1) It starts with not firing a named legacy coach with 2-years left on his contract.

2) Can we also stop saying things like "it won't be settled on an internet forum"; because it's quite dismissive to the reason a forum exists in the first place. A "Forum" was a literal marketplace/public place in Roman cities that was generally a meeting place for open discussion.  This particular "Forum" is dedicated to open discussion about the Zips.  No one is by any means under any impression that some actual impact is going to be made on the Zips by what is said here...but a forum isn't supposed to enact direct change, just be a place to talk about things...and the things to talk about ARE NOT happy right now.  0-12 is worth of extensive dragging through the mud.

 

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21 hours ago, zipsoutsider said:

The same two geniuses still mocking Bowden...when will it occur to you how wrong you have been? I guess it will take 0-24.

 

It'll take 0-36 and sitting alone holding hands in Infocision to realize it.

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9 hours ago, kreed5120 said:

The fact that all those guys (less Ianello) each got 6-9 years tells you all that you need to know. Winning programs wouldn't tolerate consistent losers therefore would have moved on much sooner than we did. When you set the tone that 5-7 or 4-8 is good enough, that's what you're going to get.

 

I'm sorry, but this is ridiculously fallacious thing to say.  The MAC is not the BIG-10 where schools can afford to fire coaches year-in-year-out. The schools in the MAC DO NOT have the name draw an OSU/Purdue/Minnesota, has.  By virtue of their name recognition alone they can draw in players.  Akron cannot.

If Akron had said 5-7 wasn't good enough and fired Bowden it wouldn't have had it's first 8-win season the following year.  We both know it.  Like seriously, what UNIVERSE are some of you Akron Zips fans living in!?

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Gentlemen (ladies?):

The truth is simple. We were 0-12, blown out in every game.

The absolute WORST D1 program in the United States of America.

It does not matter who or what you blame it on. It is what it is.

We went from a coach who got two bowl games and a conference championship game to a program that is the absolute laughingstock of the Country.

 

I don't know how to fix this. Recruits are not beating down our doors to play for a loser.

Current team members are filling the transfer portal.

Now we talk about what we can "afford". Really? Can we afford to go on like this?

An empty team and an empty stadium.

 

Change must happen, and it must happen NOW. At least give the next loser we hire the time to attempt to build a team.

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9 minutes ago, Zip-Grad '13 said:

 

I'm sorry, but this is ridiculously fallacious thing to say.  The MAC is not the BIG-10 where schools can afford to fire coaches year-in-year-out. The schools in the MAC DO NOT have the name draw an OSU/Purdue/Minnesota, has.  By virtue of their name recognition alone they can draw in players.  Akron cannot.

If Akron had said 5-7 wasn't good enough and fired Bowden it wouldn't have had it's first 8-win season the following year.  We both know it.  Like seriously, what UNIVERSE are some of you Akron Zips fans living in!?

 

All of those guys got extensions at some point in their tenure. You're right this isn't the B10. That being said Akron isn't in a situation like Rutgers or Maryland where they have no chance of succeeding. They play in the MAC East. Hands down the worst division in all of FBS. There are no Ohio State's or Michigan's holding us back. There is no reason Akron can't be a legitimate contender in the MAC.

 

You might be content with being a perennial 5-7 team, but I'm not. Bowden literally had 1 winning season in 7 seasons. Every other FBS school would have fired him as well. 

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2 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

All of those guys got extensions at some point in their tenure. You're right this isn't the B10. That being said Akron isn't in a situation like Rutgers or Maryland where they have no chance of succeeding. They play in the MAC East. Hands down the worst division in all of FBS. There are no Ohio State's or Michigan's holding us back. There is no reason Akron can't be a legitimate contender in the MAC.

 

We were!  We were ONE year removed from a MAC-C game.  Each season of the last 3-4 with Bowden, there was a serious chance for the Zips to be at the Top.  Injuries and some damn bad luck was always a contributor as well.  There are Ohio States and Michigans holding us back: Ohio's and Toledo's.  We're already in the Shadow of Four Big-10 Teams; share the exact same footprint with the entire division we play in; and Ohio/Toledo both have consistent success over us; and have proven success.  

It's ludicrous to expect Akron to have above 500 every year or fire the coach mentality; because that mentality lands us with freaking 0-12.  When Ohio has a down year or two they don't fire the coach.  It's utter stupidity.

 

7 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

You might be content with being a perennial 5-7 team, but I'm not. Bowden literally had 1 winning season in 7 seasons. Every other FBS school would have fired him as well. 


He had two winning seasons, the 7-7 season was a winning season prior to the post-season.  Pretending it's not a "winning season" because they lost the MACC and Bowl game...I'll take that every 2-3 years over 0-12 with no hope or light at the end of the tunnel EVERY SINGLE DAY.

Ever other FBS team not in the MAC?  Sure.  Ohio wouldn't have.  Frank Solich has had down years and they've kept trucking along with him.  And how much succes have those other FBS schools had?  Look at the freaking MAC, and every other conference where teams regularly change over coaches?  Tennessee...Purdue...it's just utter stupidity!  And we don't have 1/100th the name recognition they have!  

Delusional.  Delusional.  Delusional.

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On 11/28/2019 at 9:06 AM, ZipsVoice said:

Oh and you do Lee?  So what's your claim to fame that makes you have "cred", and how dare you to decide what REAL fans are?  A little pomposity my Ashland friend....

Oh, the'ad hominem' attacks start again. I normally do not adress the posters on this site directly. I'ts a waste of time. And since somebody was DETA,I am 68 years old. What the hell is with the 'Ashland friend' stupid comment'? I have no connection to Ashland, Ohio or that college. Please enlighten all of us, since some of you are back to the personal attacks again. If you can tell me my connection to Ashland,Ohio I might want to visit some long lost relatives or friends. I await.

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24 minutes ago, Zip-Grad '13 said:

 

We were!  We were ONE year removed from a MAC-C game.  Each season of the last 3-4 with Bowden, there was a serious chance for the Zips to be at the Top.  Injuries and some damn bad luck was always a contributor as well.  There are Ohio States and Michigans holding us back: Ohio's and Toledo's.  We're already in the Shadow of Four Big-10 Teams; share the exact same footprint with the entire division we play in; and Ohio/Toledo both have consistent success over us; and have proven success.  

It's ludicrous to expect Akron to have above 500 every year or fire the coach mentality; because that mentality lands us with freaking 0-12.  When Ohio has a down year or two they don't fire the coach.  It's utter stupidity.

 


He had two winning seasons, the 7-7 season was a winning season prior to the post-season.  Pretending it's not a "winning season" because they lost the MACC and Bowl game...I'll take that every 2-3 years over 0-12 with no hope or light at the end of the tunnel EVERY SINGLE DAY.

Ever other FBS team not in the MAC?  Sure.  Ohio wouldn't have.  Frank Solich has had down years and they've kept trucking along with him.  And how much succes have those other FBS schools had?  Look at the freaking MAC, and every other conference where teams regularly change over coaches?  Tennessee...Purdue...it's just utter stupidity!  And we don't have 1/100th the name recognition they have!  

Delusional.  Delusional.  Delusional.

We played Toledo twice in 2017 and lost by a combined score of 93-49. We then went onto being embarrassed 50-3 by FAU. We were consistently blown out each time we faced real MAC contenders those last 3-4 years so not sure what makes you think we were close to being at the top. If there was an OSU of the MAC it would be Miami, but they haven't been consistently good for 20+ years. MAC schools typically cycle whose at the top. Even Kent had a season or 2 of being pretty great. All MAC schools play in B10 shadow so that isn't unique to us.

 

In 2017 we finished 7-7 so that is indeed not >.500. If you prefer I'd say Bowden finished with a losing record 5 out of 7 seasons that's fine. I never said we have to finish every season over .500, but 1 or even 2 out of 7 isn't good enough. 

 

In Frank's 1st 7 seasons he had a 10-4 season, 2 9-5 seasons, and 1 8-5 season. Bowden had 1 8-5 season. Bowden wasn't anywhere close to Frank.

 

Those schools play in conferences that compete against Alabama, LSU, Georgia, Ohio State, Florida, Michigan, Penn State, etc. In the MAC you can literally go from worst to first. CMU went 1-11 last year and will be the favorite in the MAC title game this season. Those kind of opportunities don't exist in the B10 or SEC. Ohio fired Brian Knorr after 4 seasons to hire Frank Solich. Figured I'd use that as my example since you already name dropped him.

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1 hour ago, Zip-Grad '13 said:

 

We were!  We were ONE year removed from a MAC-C game.  Each season of the last 3-4 with Bowden, there was a serious chance for the Zips to be at the Top.  Injuries and some damn bad luck was always a contributor as well.  There are Ohio States and Michigans holding us back: Ohio's and Toledo's.  We're already in the Shadow of Four Big-10 Teams; share the exact same footprint with the entire division we play in; and Ohio/Toledo both have consistent success over us; and have proven success.  

It's ludicrous to expect Akron to have above 500 every year or fire the coach mentality; because that mentality lands us with freaking 0-12.  When Ohio has a down year or two they don't fire the coach.  It's utter stupidity.

 


He had two winning seasons, the 7-7 season was a winning season prior to the post-season.  Pretending it's not a "winning season" because they lost the MACC and Bowl game...I'll take that every 2-3 years over 0-12 with no hope or light at the end of the tunnel EVERY SINGLE DAY.

Ever other FBS team not in the MAC?  Sure.  Ohio wouldn't have.  Frank Solich has had down years and they've kept trucking along with him.  And how much succes have those other FBS schools had?  Look at the freaking MAC, and every other conference where teams regularly change over coaches?  Tennessee...Purdue...it's just utter stupidity!  And we don't have 1/100th the name recognition they have!  

Delusional.  Delusional.  Delusional.

You are 100% correct, but too many foolishly believe that it just takes hiring some magic guy....without the brains to see truth fir what it is. 

 

The way football continues to be cut at the U, why would anyone want to cone coach here, now?

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2 hours ago, Zip-Grad '13 said:

 



2) Can we also stop saying things like "it won't be settled on an internet forum"; because it's quite dismissive to the reason a forum exists in the first place. A "Forum" was a literal marketplace/public place in Roman cities that was generally a meeting place for open discussion.  This particular "Forum" is dedicated to open discussion about the Zips.  No one is by any means under any impression that some actual impact is going to be made on the Zips by what is said here...but a forum isn't supposed to enact direct change, just be a place to talk about things...and the things to talk about ARE NOT happy right now.  0-12 is worth of extensive dragging through the mud.

 

 

It was said because it's a fact.  The point is that it needs to be settled on a much higher level.  That's not to be dismissive or squelch the discussion.  I just hope that all those that want action to be taken are voicing their opinion at that higher level rather than just on here.  Danny Hoke has given you the info to do it.

 

Also, as I've said a number of times on here, one can be critical of both Bowden and Arth. 

 

As an aside, I also think that many of those now concerned with the budget would be much less concerned if the Zips had a reasonable season rather than the abomination we saw.

 

THANK GOD THE BASKETBALL SEASON IS HERE.    

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11 hours ago, dre22era said:

Adding more salt to the wound 

 

I hope Kent and Sean Lewis get a bowl game. It doesn't take a genius to see that their program has a clear vision and competent leadership. Any marginally competent coach can field a bowl eligible squad in the mac east. 

Edited by ZippyforPresident
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10 hours ago, ZippyforPresident said:

I hope Kent and Sean Lewis get a bowl game. It doesn't take a genius to see that their program has a clear vision and competent leadership. Any marginally competent coach can field a bowl eligible squad in the mac east. 

 

You'd sure hope it was a motivator for someone at UA.

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18 hours ago, kreed5120 said:

Those schools play in conferences that compete against Alabama, LSU, Georgia, Ohio State, Florida, Michigan, Penn State, etc. In the MAC you can literally go from worst to first. CMU went 1-11 last year and will be the favorite in the MAC title game this season. Those kind of opportunities don't exist in the B10 or SEC. Ohio fired Brian Knorr after 4 seasons to hire Frank Solich. Figured I'd use that as my example since you already name dropped him.

 

No Bowden is not Solich.  But he was a hell of a lot closer than any of the other losers we've had here, including Arth.  You can't go from Worst to first if you're Akron.  Especially after an 0-12 season.  Especially after 2-22.  I want whatever you guys are smoking.

Edited by Zip-Grad '13

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19 minutes ago, Zip-Grad '13 said:

 

No Bowden is not Solich.  But he was a hell of a lot closer than any of the other losers we've had here, including Arth.  You can't go from Worst to first if you're Akron.  Especially after an 0-12 season.  I want whatever you guys are smoking.

Central Michigan just did it this year & they was picked for dead last this year, not saying it will be done but it can be done

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48 minutes ago, 94zipgrad said:

Central Michigan just did it this year & they was picked for dead last this year, not saying it will be done but it can be done

 

We were also picked to be middle-of-the-pack to bottom of the MAC when we won the MAC East.  Pre-season polls mean nothing, let's be real here.  Anyone watching CMU knew that there was potential to be better than what their record was.  And this year they beat-up on bottom dwellers (which we did each the year we went to the MAC C).

Like we'll use CMU as an example of going "worst-to-first" but discredit when Akron basically did the same thing.

The Ultimate question is: Will CMU have success beyond this one-year or will they be one-and-done. 

Edited by Zip-Grad '13

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1 hour ago, 94zipgrad said:

 

 

4 hours ago, clarkwgriswold said:

 

 

1 hour ago, Zip-Grad '13 said:

 

 

I will apologize if I'm being too annoying on this point...I'm just so damn frustrated with Zips Football right now.  Thank goodness it's Basketball season.

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