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clarkwgriswold

Game 30- Ohio University

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8 minutes ago, AkronAlumnus said:

Groce could be that architect though. He is well respected and seems to be brining in power 5 talent via transfers and recruits. I don't see why Akron can't be similar to schools like VCU or Dayton. 

 

From your mouth to God's ears AkronAlumnus.

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22 minutes ago, AkronAlumnus said:

Groce could be that architect though. He is well respected and seems to be brining in power 5 talent via transfers and recruits. I don't see why Akron can't be similar to schools like VCU or Dayton. 

 

Mark Few is making $1.8 million at Gonzaga and in reality that's with him giving them a discount. Groce is already the highest paid coach in the MAC at $650k. Oats just left Buffalo and they were willing to pay him somewhere in the neighborhood of $800k-$1M. Where is the broke Akron athletic department going to come up $2m/year to pay to retain that level of a coach? Heck we couldn't even match the $1M offer that Duquesne gave Dambrot. 

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3 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

 

Mark Few is making $1.8 million at Gonzaga and in reality that's with him giving them a discount. Groce is already the highest paid coach in the MAC at $650k. Oats just left Buffalo and they were willing to pay him somewhere in the neighborhood of $800k-$1M. Where is the broke Akron athletic department going to come up $2m/year to pay to retain that level of a coach? Heck we couldn't even match the $1M offer that Duquesne gave Dambrot. 

That is the biggest hurtle to becoming a contender. I'm all for cutting funding from less prominent programs and allocating that money to help the basketball team. Esports is frivolous and needs to go. College basketball has the potential to generate more money than any other college sport by far, especially at the mid-major level. 

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11 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

 

Mark Few is making $1.8 million at Gonzaga and in reality that's with him giving them a discount. Groce is already the highest paid coach in the MAC at $650k. Oats just left Buffalo and they were willing to pay him somewhere in the neighborhood of $800k-$1M. Where is the broke Akron athletic department going to come up $2m/year to pay to retain that level of a coach? Heck we couldn't even match the $1M offer that Duquesne gave Dambrot. 

 

I have an idea but rather than staring a dumpster fire on ZipsNation I will keep it to myself!

Edited by clarkwgriswold

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2 minutes ago, AkronAlumnus said:

That is the biggest hurtle to becoming a contender. I'm all for cutting funding from less prominent programs and allocating that money to help the basketball team. Esports is frivolous and needs to go. College basketball has the potential to generate more money than any other college sport by far, especially at the mid-major level. 

 

ESports is one of the main reasons X chose Akron, and could be a catalyst for future recruiting, University growth, etc. It's a BIG deal with this younger group. 

 

Long way to go success wise to be discussing anything regarding keeping Groce long-term. Let's beat PCCC on Friday.

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Gonzaga 2019 Attendance: 17 games, 6,000 per game (100% capacity), 102,000 tickets sold. 

Akron 2019 Attendance: 17 games, 2,610 per game (45% capacity), 44,362 tickets sold.  

Conservatively pricing the "average" ticket of $30:

  • Gonzaga ticket revenue $3,060,000
  • Akron ticket revenue $1,330,860

So about $1.7 million in ticket revenue difference, and that's not taking into account higher prices/demand for Gonzaga nor any tickets "bought" by UA for basketball games.  It's probably safe to say, Gonzaga brings in $2-3 million more per season just in ticket revenue.

 

Then there's this:

image.png

 

There will never be a midmajor on par with Gonzaga and also having to support a football teams.  Sucks, but it's the reality.

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50 minutes ago, Let'sGoZips94 said:

 

ESports is one of the main reasons X chose Akron, and could be a catalyst for future recruiting, University growth, etc. It's a BIG deal with this younger group. 

 

Long way to go success wise to be discussing anything regarding keeping Groce long-term. Let's beat PCCC on Friday.

 

Yeah, Akron is something like 1 of 60 universities competing in ESports. It's a huge growing industry between younger millennials and generation z. After some initial start up costs I can't imagine it costs much to operate, but I do think it will lead some students to pick Akron when they may have went somewhere else instead. Even though we all think it's dumb, it's probably the one thing Akron was forward thinking about and got right.

Edited by kreed5120
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6 minutes ago, RowdyZip said:

 

So about $1.7 million in ticket revenue difference, and that's not taking into account higher prices/demand for Gonzaga nor any tickets "bought" by UA for basketball games.  It's probably safe to say, Gonzaga brings in $2-3 million more per season just in ticket revenue.

 

The university has to buy tickets in football to stay FBS compliant. There is no rules in basketball that teams have to sell x-number of tickets therefore the attendance numbers at basketball I feel are an actual representation of the actual number of tickets sold (excluding students obviously). What you have is season ticket holders that just show up for certain games or none at all. My one buddy got season tickets one year and the only game he went to was the Kent game. 

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Comparing 2019-2020 Akron to 2019-2020 Gonzaga isn't the right way to do this. Look at what 2002 or so Gonzaga did to keep Few around

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33 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

 

Yeah, Akron is something like 1 of 60 universities competing in ESports. It's a huge growing industry between younger millennials and generation z. After some initial start up costs I can't imagine it costs much to operate, but I do think it will lead some students to pick Akron when they went somewhere else. Even though we all think it's dumb, it's probably the one thing Akron was forward thinking about and got right.

The ESports is a big thing.  Also, as Kreed or someone else pointed out, if Akron is in a position to worry about keeping Groce ...then amazing things have already happened with the program.  The key is not to make a Jim Christian/Saul Phillips style mistake.  Administration needs to have candidates lined up and ready to go if Groce and his crew (losing Fulford may also be a big deal) are hired away.  Someone on Kittens Attack noted that Groce didn't get a regular season championship for Ohio and another Kitten replied that he was good with what they got instead.  It's the AD's job to have contingency plans in place for this.

Edited by NWAkron
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30 minutes ago, zippy5 said:

Comparing 2019-2020 Akron to 2019-2020 Gonzaga isn't the right way to do this. Look at what 2002 or so Gonzaga did to keep Few around

 

The point is the revenue that is missing.  It was the same story in 2002.  Gonzaga played in a smaller arena, but averaged 99% capacity (4k) every year except '99.

 

2012-13 was the Zips high water mark, just shy of 3800 (65% capacity), in a year where we cracked the top 25 for the first time.

 

I'm not ignorant to some of the high profile wins the Bulldogs have had, but the main difference between Gonzaga and Akron is that when Gonzaga started to win, fans showed up.  Zips are 23-7 and back in first place, yet can't even fill up half the arena.  Apathy is UA's number one enemy.

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I think the argument was based on the hypothetical that we had some sort of sustained success on a bigger stage. That's yet to happen so I'm not going to speculate too much, but I'd imagine staying in the top 25 longer than a week would draw some fans.

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37 minutes ago, zippy5 said:

I think the argument was based on the hypothetical that we had some sort of sustained success on a bigger stage. That's yet to happen so I'm not going to speculate too much, but I'd imagine staying in the top 25 longer than a week would draw some fans.

This was the premise of my argument^^. Either remaining in the top 25 longer than a week or winning tournament games will begin to attract notoriety allowing for the program to take its next step. 

 

Winning will increase attendance, revenue and enrollment. Keep Groce as the catalyst. Had Groce remained at OU, I believe, they would be on the same playing field as Dayton, VCU, Wichita etc. Groce made the mistake of leaving a mid-major to go to a highly politicized Big Ten school. It's unlikely he will make the same mistake twice. 

Edited by AkronAlumnus
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The thing is those fans will jump off the bandwagon quicker than they joined once Akron returns to their mean. Gonzaga has built up enough good will with their fans that they would still sell out even if they had a couple sub par years. Look at the season Buffalo had last season and this year they're only averaging 3,605 fans. There is a huge difference between experiencing a 10 minutes of fame and actually building something sustainable.

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4 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

The thing is those fans will jump off the bandwagon quicker than they joined once Akron returns to their mean. Gonzaga has built up enough good will with their fans that they would still sell out even if they had a couple sub par years. Look at the season Buffalo had last season and this year they're only averaging 3,605 fans. There is a huge difference between experiencing a 10 minutes of fame and actually building something sustainable.

I agree, however, the thing with Buffalo is that their coach and almost all the players left. Buffalo likely wouldn't have had two historic seasons without Groce leaving the MAC. Getting butts in seats will always be difficult in Akron but winning consecutively will do it (in my opinion). 

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OU was dangerously close to it. Caris LeVert was committed.. that's gotta sting if you're a Bobcat fan

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That's all well and good, but at the end of the day it's a state university with an already strapped budget.  As such, they can't afford him if he's that successful.  Also, a great majority of people will take a job with what is viewed as a more prestigious company at a much higher rate of pay.  I wouldn't expect Groce, as much as I like him, to do anything different.

 

There are the Larry Kehreses of the world that have found the life they want and are content with remaining in a place regardless of other opportunities placed in front of them, but they are pretty damned rare.   Maybe the OU-->Illinois experience will help to give Groce that perspective, but it's unlikely given simple human nature and UA's budget restraints.

 

P.S.  I'd be surprised if he went anywhere after this year.

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Concerning attendance and apathy, and the Akron Beacon Journal, look at the work of Canton Rep sports reporter Mike Popovich.  He covers Stark County high school sports and Mount Union college.  The fact the ABJ has never had anyone cover UA with half as much passion as Mike covers smaller programs is insufferable.  Mike constantly tweets out "hype" for the teams he covers.

 

Btw, Mike is a graduate of UA and was at the Ohio game.  I'd give my left nut if the ABJ would hire him to cover the Zips.

Edited by Blue & Gold
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11 minutes ago, Blue & Gold said:

Concerning attendance and apathy, and the Akron Beacon Journal, look at the work of Canton Rep sports reporter Mike Popovich.  He covers Stark County high school sports and Mount Union college.  The fact the ABJ has never had anyone cover UA with half as much passion as Mike covers smaller programs is insufferable.  Mike constantly tweets out "hype" for the teams he covers.

 

Btw, Mike is a graduate of UA and was at the Ohio game.  I'd give my left nut if the ABJ would hire him to cover the Zips.

 

I would offer to also give up YOUR right nut.

 

GT has been passionate about anything since Star Wars Episode VII: The Force Awakens

Edited by clarkwgriswold
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3 hours ago, kreed5120 said:

The thing is those fans will jump off the bandwagon quicker than they joined once Akron returns to their mean. Gonzaga has built up enough good will with their fans that they would still sell out even if they had a couple sub par years. Look at the season Buffalo had last season and this year they're only averaging 3,605 fans. There is a huge difference between experiencing a 10 minutes of fame and actually building something sustainable.

 

I agree you need sustained success not only in win-loss record but in national perception. The other thing no one has mentioned is the MAC as a conference. If we could get a couple of years consecutively with more than one team being ranked in the Top 25 I think it would help increase attendance league-wide.

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1 hour ago, Blue & Gold said:

Btw, Mike is a graduate of UA and was at the Ohio game.  I'd give my left nut if the ABJ would hire him to cover the Zips.

Here’s a question: could the University pay half his salary for the ABJ to hire him? Or agree to offset it through additional ad revenue?  At the end of the day, it might cost less than adding another head in the university marketing department and the person would have the outreach capability of the newspaper. 

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4 hours ago, pdt1420 said:

Here’s a question: could the University pay half his salary for the ABJ to hire him? Or agree to offset it through additional ad revenue?  At the end of the day, it might cost less than adding another head in the university marketing department and the person would have the outreach capability of the newspaper. 

I’ve thought that myself, but then realized that would be a real conflict of interest because the reporter has to be able to criticize the program when necessary.  I just wish the ABJ would hire someone who feels blessed because he gets to write about sports for a living, instead of someone who generally gives the vibe that he’s simply obligated to.  The different attitudes come through loud and clear.

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And let me add, because I’m a softy, that I don’t really want to pick on GT. I’ve done that too much. He’s an EXCELLENT  pop culture writer and movie/tv critic.  One can simply tell sports aren’t where his heart is.  I’m just perpetually frustrated with the ABJ.  We’ve got a true community treasure that other cities would kill for - a D-1 athletic program - and the Canton Rep has superior sports writers covering high schools and community colleges. It’s batshit crazy.

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22 hours ago, LoyalZIP said:

Attendance issues stem from lazy-ass marketing too. While the local media is bad at showing them appreciation, I see nothing being done by Akron to help with attendance. Just myopic.

It’s because they play in a JAR with uncomfortable seats?

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7 minutes ago, Blue & Gold said:

And let me add, because I’m a softy, that I don’t really want to pick on GT. I’ve done that too much. He’s an EXCELLENT  pop culture writer and movie/tv critic.  One can simply tell sports aren’t where his heart is.  I’m just perpetually frustrated with the ABJ.  We’ve got a true community treasure that other cities would kill for - a D-1 athletic program - and the Canton Rep has superior sports writers covering high schools and community colleges. It’s batshit crazy.

When UA hired Groce, Bob Dyer wrote a nasty hit piece on him and the university.  If the next week goes well, I look forward to reminding him.

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