Ohio State and MAC Losses

[zipseuph]

Just to prove that offense is the key to victory and success, BSU and CMU are averaging 37.5 and 32 points per game respectively. A lot of teams fall apart trying to keep up with the scoring onslaught and the panic it creates. 28 ppg would not beat either of these teams and if we averaged 34 points per game, we still wouldn't beat BSU. College football is not the NFL where 24 points should win a game. College football has become a sport where, like it or not, much larger point totals are necessary weekly. Spread offenses are really pouring on points and in order for the Zips to win week in and week out, they have to put up tons of points. I actually like all of the scoring that goes on now...it makes Saturday much more exciting. Big 12 games are wildly exciting because of the scoring.

and BSU's D is only giving up 15.5 while CMU is giving up 26 ( take out the drubbing they got by #2 at the time Georgea and it's 23) 28 points is still enough to win college football games but you have to have a D that could actually hold their own.

[johnnyzip84]

Like the saying goes... Offense sells tickets, but defense wins championships

If this holds true in the MAC this year, then Northern Illinois will eventually win it all. And believe it or not, but that just might happen

[zipseuph]

Like the saying goes... Offense sells tickets, but defense wins championships

If this holds true in the MAC this year, then Northern Illinois will eventually win it all. And believe it or not, but that just might happen

it would be fun as hell to beat them again in the MACC. in the same fashion too

[skip-zip]

Guys....I appreciate all of the comments and interest in this topic. That's why I started it. But, let me ask all of you to get back to why I started this discussion, because it seems that we have drifted a bit.This had NOTHING to do with whether someone should be able to be an OSU and Zips fan simultaneously. My goal here was to point out a couple of things.Now, this post could turn into an argument over whether the season for OSU has been successful, or hasn't. But as Johnnyzip stated, two losses is devastating to them at this point. Especially since several key players in Cowlumbus stayed when they could have gone to the NFL. Do you think they stayed to have a 2-4 loss season? NOT A CHANCE. They thought they had the makings of a national champion, and they failed big time. And regardless of Buckzip's rants about how anything negative about OSU is being "jealous", please read my initial post.....which simply was addressing the issue of the impact of a bad OSU season on Akron football. Nothing more, nothing less. Anyway....here are the couple of things I am pointing out........as far as Akron is concerned...... 1) When the Suckeyes have an unsuccessful season, it can only help Akron in terms of fan interest.Refer back to my comments that I received from a friend who is an OSU fan on Saturday, who inquired about Akron's remaining schedule. Don't think....for second...that at least SOME local sports fans won't take an interest in Akron's season based on OSU now being out of the picture in the national title race this long before the end of the season. 2) When the Suckeyes have an unsuccessful season, it can only help Akron in terms of recruiting. Again, refer back to my original post, and our success recruiting good players from Western PA back in the 80's, when Pitt was a down program. This is not to say that OSU is in some way headed into a downward spiral. But again....also don't be naive enough to think that Akron does not have a shot at more Ohio players in light of the recent failures at OSU.

[zipseuph]

1) OSU has a lot more tradition behind it than PITT so that will keep people coming in no matter what (see Michigan)2) there is only one way for this team to get more attention and that is to win. nothing more nothing less. win win win and they'll come crawling. instead of hoping that one team falls below US how about we hope to rise above THEM.3) you can get more flies with honey then a shotgun. I feel the envy every time I see OSU stuff on campus but to hope that someone changes there mind because you said so isn't going to work. try to get people interested in Akron football by pointing out all the fine things that come with the little attention we get such as cheap games, a knowledgeable fan base, easy access to the games (no huge crowed to fight with) and is a lot closer to home.4) if you don't wanna get people up in arms about this thread I would recommend not using things like "OSWHO Cowlumbus and Suckeyes" even if it is the only way we ever get to hear from SGM (well that and Charlie Frye threads)

[ZippyTuba11]

tOSU and their fans are respectful to us as we are to teams like Malone and Mt. Union. I guarantee that if we were competing with the Big Eleven on the same level and beating them with regularity they would hate us as much as any other team 'from up north.'I honestly do not believe that a down year(s) for the Suckeyes does anything for us. Their recruits are instead going to look at teams like PSU, West Virginia, Mich, and Mich St. The only way for us to get to their level is to win consistently with the talent level we have. When we can beat these teams and get to bowl games every year, then we will benefit from tOSU losing.

[skip-zip]

zipseuph...we are not going to rise above Ohio State. I'm sorry. At least, not in my lifetime. But we have a chance to recruit more fans and players when Ohio State is performing at less than expected levels. And none of us are comparing Pitt to Ohio State. It's just an example of a once-prominent program that lost recruits during a poor period.

[Buckzip]

I wondered how long this thread wouls stay good."Suckeyes" shows a lot of class.

[zen]

I wondered how long this thread wouls stay good."Suckeyes" shows a lot of class.

LOL don't get too sensitive Buckzip. PPL here say "suckeyes" like they say "sweaters" and "flushes". This was a good thread. Though I think we veered a bit off the main topic, which was whether OSU losses help us.I tend to think it would a little bit, but not a lot. Less in the recruiting side. I tend to agree with those who say that OSU lost recruits would go to other BCS teams. It helps a bit more on the attention side of things, and even that probably not much. Once OSU loses a few games, the sports staff at all the media offices shake their heads a bit as if to finally cast off the dazed spell they were under and realize "Oh, there are other teams to cover... I wonder if I should". But what it really comes down to is having success on the field, and even then, you can't expect anonymous people to congregate at the coffee station and start talking about the zips. What happens is a grassroots growth that takes years... students going to games, building a relationship with the teams, and taking that with them.

[ziptrumpet87]

I tend to agree with those who say that OSU lost recruits would go to other BCS teams.

I know this may putting a log on a different fire, but I think if we were in the BE, we might be able to capitalize on some of those recruits. It should be easier to recruit better players if they know they have a chance (even a small one) to be in a BCS championship game. The down side of being a BE member would be a tougher road for the basketball team.

[3rd&twenty]

tOSU and their fans are respectful to us as we are to teams like Malone and Mt. Union. I guarantee that if we were competing with the Big Eleven on the same level and beating them with regularity they would hate us as much as any other team 'from up north.'I honestly do not believe that a down year(s) for the Suckeyes does anything for us. Their recruits are instead going to look at teams like PSU, West Virginia, Mich, and Mich St. The only way for us to get to their level is to win consistently with the talent level we have. When we can beat these teams and get to bowl games every year, then we will benefit from tOSU losing.

The truth is that when OSU has a down season (which doesn't really happen that often) they may likely lose recruits to other Big 10 or BCS schools. Look what happened to PSU in the late 90's/early this decade. They had a few down years in a row and subsequently lost recruits, mainly to OSU. We're never really going to get any recruit that would/could play at the BCS level. Maybe a couple of kids get overlooked by the bigger schools, but the level is a notch down from those programs. As for fans, the new stadium will help, although I have a feeling a lot of those attending the first game(s) will be people that can't tell a football from a hockey puck. They'll be there just to be seen and to say they've always been a fan. Win and you may keep some of those people who may then become a bit more knowledgeable about the Zips. Continue on this mediocre line and we'll lose them after the first season.

[Buckzip]

tOSU and their fans are respectful to us as we are to teams like Malone and Mt. Union. I guarantee that if we were competing with the Big Eleven on the same level and beating them with regularity they would hate us as much as any other team 'from up north.'I honestly do not believe that a down year(s) for the Suckeyes does anything for us. Their recruits are instead going to look at teams like PSU, West Virginia, Mich, and Mich St. The only way for us to get to their level is to win consistently with the talent level we have. When we can beat these teams and get to bowl games every year, then we will benefit from tOSU losing.

The truth is that when OSU has a down season (which doesn't really happen that often) they may likely lose recruits to other Big 10 or BCS schools. Look what happened to PSU in the late 90's/early this decade. They had a few down years in a row and subsequently lost recruits, mainly to OSU. We're never really going to get any recruit that would/could play at the BCS level. Maybe a couple of kids get overlooked by the bigger schools, but the level is a notch down from those programs. As for fans, the new stadium will help, although I have a feeling a lot of those attending the first game(s) will be people that can't tell a football from a hockey puck. They'll be there just to be seen and to say they've always been a fan. Win and you may keep some of those people who may then become a bit more knowledgeable about the Zips. Continue on this mediocre line and we'll lose them after the first season.

Exactly. We don't compete with OSU for recruits. If they are being recruited by OSU they are being recruited by many big time football powers.

[tbozeglav]

Take, for example, Tyrelle Pryor. Besides OSU, he was wondering Penn State and M!ch!gan, and a few other marquee BCS schools.Big-time recruits won't fall to us unless they suffered a major injury their senior year and the BCS schools find some reason to not offer them a scholarship.Recruiting for us is just a little harder and requires us to do a little more searching. At OSU, recruits quite literally throw themselves at the program in hopes of getting a scholarship.

[skip-zip]

I think that Zen and Ziptrumpet are seeing the right track here with some of their thoughts. Zen...In my opinion, you have a very good understanding of how this can be a beneficial situation for us. You mentioned how media coverage changes when the Suckeyes are out of the picture for a national championship. Again, yet another factor that can only help our Zips. Ziptrumpet....I like your comments about how getting into a bigger conference would be the biggest boost to recruiting and fan support. You're right. I have said 100 times on this website that being at least in a "perceived position" to compete on a national level would elevate this program more than anything else could. But, unfortunately, I think our road to getting accepted to a conference of that level would be a very difficult sell with our present situation.Please keep one other factor in mind. When the NCAA reduced the number of scholarships a few year back, it helped level the playing field tremendously. More than anything we could have ever done on our own. Just think....every top level program in the country now has 10 fewer players to "stockpile" on their rosters, and instead those players have drifted down to "lower" schools. It certainly doesn't take a mathematician to figure out that when 10 players drop from each of the best teams in the country, it pushes each more potential high level recruits further, and further and further down the chain. Bottom Line...The MAC teams are getting access to much better players than they used to, and again, that can only help our Zips. And Zen...thanks once again for saving me the few keystrokes out of my busy day to once again remind Buckzip that this is an Akron Zips fans website.

[Buckzip]

I think that Zen and Ziptrumpet are seeing the right track here with some of their thoughts. Zen...In my opinion, you have a very good understanding of how this can be a beneficial situation for us. You mentioned how media coverage changes when the Suckeyes are out of the picture for a national championship. Again, yet another factor that can only help our Zips. Ziptrumpet....I like your comments about how getting into a bigger conference would be the biggest boost to recruiting and fan support. You're right. I have said 100 times on this website that being at least in a "perceived position" to compete on a national level would elevate this program more than anything else could. But, unfortunately, I think our road to getting accepted to a conference of that level would be a very difficult sell with our present situation.Please keep one other factor in mind. When the NCAA reduced the number of scholarships a few year back, it helped level the playing field tremendously. More than anything we could have ever done on our own. Just think....every top level program in the country now has 10 fewer players to "stockpile" on their rosters, and instead those players have drifted down to "lower" schools. It certainly doesn't take a mathematician to figure out that when 10 players drop from each of the best teams in the country, it pushes each more potential high level recruits further, and further and further down the chain. Bottom Line...The MAC teams are getting access to much better players than they used to, and again, that can only help our Zips. And Zen...thanks once again for saving me the few keystrokes out of my busy day to once again remind Buckzip that this is an Akron Zips fans website.

Again, you brought it up....When it comes to having a little class, it doesn't matter what site you are on.

[zipseuph]

zipseuph...we are not going to rise above Ohio State. I'm sorry. At least, not in my lifetime. But we have a chance to recruit more fans and players when Ohio State is performing at less than expected levels. And none of us are comparing Pitt to Ohio State. It's just an example of a once-prominent program that lost recruits during a poor period.

you compared this situation with the PITT situation and are claming that we would gain more recruits because of this current season. I pointed out that your argument doesn't hold water because of the tradition and history Ohio State has going for it. No maybe we will not rise above them in our life time but attempting to do so is far more productive then sitting around hoping they fall on their faces for us. how about we focus on OUR team and try to recruit more fans to OUR stadium insted of crying about OSU.

[zen]

I think that Zen and Ziptrumpet are seeing the right track And Zen...thanks once again for saving me the few keystrokes out of my busy day to once again remind Buckzip that this is an Akron Zips fans website.

Again, you brought it up....When it comes to having a little class, it doesn't matter what site you are on.

All I am saying is that it's a context thing.Yes there may infact be a few people with some genuine vitriol toward OSU, but for the most part, the words are more of a jab.It's the difference between me giving you an elbow nudge in the ribs and with a hint of a chuckle saying that "the suckeyes toss" compared to furling my brow and pointing my finger in your face and shouting "DIE SUCKEYE". Completely different context. Sure, neither one are complimentary nor the height of classiness, but then again, I think of this forum more like a sports bar than I do it being the smoking room in the oxford yacht club..

[skip-zip]

zipseuph.....I love your passion for our Zips. We both have the same goal...for the Zips to have a better program. And in that respect, I'll take any advantage we can get at this point. Truthfully, a lot of things need to change to turn this thing around, but relying on the few of us diehards to recruit our friends to the games has not had much impact on attendance in the last 3 decades in which I have supported this program, and neither has providing every incentive in the world for fans to attend. And some of the winning season we've had at the I-A level have not translated into many changes the following year, even after the MAC championship year. Will several winning seasons in a row have an impact? Maybe so, but long, sustained dominance by one team is not something that is common in the MAC. However, a Marshall situation is certainly possible. And don't think that recruiting staffs don't look at opportunities to steal players from areas where the big program is showing signs of weakness on a national level, as per my example. But, I respect your opinion. We certainly need to continue to try to take care of our own business to make this work as well. Don't think I am being negative here. I've just seen many efforts tried and failed over 30 years. This is why any situation that looks to provide some sort of help for us is reason for optimism. Let's hope the new stadium provides us with the spark we need to help gain some kind of momentum as well, and start us on the road to getting this program to another level.Go Zips!!

[skip-zip]

Very well said Zen. I have plenty of friends and family who are OSU fans, and they completely understand the rhetoric. But for some reason, a few select others seem to be offended. Once again....FYI....an Akron fan site will produce fans that are partial to Akron. I'm sure OSU has plenty fo fan chat sites of their own.

[ZippyTuba11]

Again, you brought it up....When it comes to having a little class, it doesn't matter what site you are on.

Go on any Sucks website and start talking about Michigan, USC, Florida, Texas, LSU, Michigan St., Penn St, Miami (fl), etc etc etc and see how class fairs.Again, tOSU fans are only respectful to us because we do not beat them. They do not consider us to be of any threat or anywhere near their level. I have numerous friends and co-workers who are tOSU fans and all day they trash talk with each other how bad the 'other' team* is.So get off your white horse about Akron fans putting down the Suckeyes. I commend your respect for UA, but I will attest that the rest of their fan base hardly shares your insight. If the day comes that Akron beats them, god knows what little respect for us they have will be gone.*Whereas the 'other' team is any team tOSU happens to be playing that day or has ever played in the past.

[3rd&twenty]

Again, you brought it up....When it comes to having a little class, it doesn't matter what site you are on.

Go on any Sucks website and start talking about Michigan, USC, Florida, Texas, LSU, Michigan St., Penn St, Miami (fl), etc etc etc and see how class fairs.Again, tOSU fans are only respectful to us because we do not beat them. They do not consider us to be of any threat or anywhere near their level. I have numerous friends and co-workers who are tOSU fans and all day they trash talk with each other how bad the 'other' team* is.So get off your white horse about Akron fans putting down the Suckeyes. I commend your respect for UA, but I will attest that the rest of their fan base hardly shares your insight. If the day comes that Akron beats them, god knows what little respect for us they have will be gone.*Whereas the 'other' team is any team tOSU happens to be playing that day or has ever played in the past.

OK, veering off the subject just a bit but I've been to OSU 3 times for games. 2 times for the Akron games and once for a PSU game. Each time I was dressed in the appropriate team wear, and I got more crap while there as a Zips fan than I got as a PSU fan. Much more! About Skip's about having several winning seasons impacting fan support and attendance: does anyone know how CMU draws? They've been pretty decent for the last several years and they have roughly the same circumstance we do. 2 Big 10 schools in-state plus the MAC schools there to divide the fan base.

[Zip Watcher]

Should this topic not find itself back on a discussion pertaining somehow to Zips Football, it will be relocated to Smack.Not locked .. just relocated.Go Zips!

[zipseuph]

Again, you brought it up....When it comes to having a little class, it doesn't matter what site you are on.

Go on any Sucks website and start talking about Michigan, USC, Florida, Texas, LSU, Michigan St., Penn St, Miami (fl), etc etc etc and see how class fairs.Again, tOSU fans are only respectful to us because we do not beat them. They do not consider us to be of any threat or anywhere near their level. I have numerous friends and co-workers who are tOSU fans and all day they trash talk with each other how bad the 'other' team* is.So get off your white horse about Akron fans putting down the Suckeyes. I commend your respect for UA, but I will attest that the rest of their fan base hardly shares your insight. If the day comes that Akron beats them, god knows what little respect for us they have will be gone.*Whereas the 'other' team is any team tOSU happens to be playing that day or has ever played in the past.

OK, veering off the subject just a bit but I've been to OSU 3 times for games. 2 times for the Akron games and once for a PSU game. Each time I was dressed in the appropriate team wear, and I got more crap while there as a Zips fan than I got as a PSU fan. Much more! About Skip's about having several winning seasons impacting fan support and attendance: does anyone know how CMU draws? They've been pretty decent for the last several years and they have roughly the same circumstance we do. 2 Big 10 schools in-state plus the MAC schools there to divide the fan base.

CMU draws by having back to back championships and in the runnings for a third. if we win they will come. why doesn't anyone get that. after the MACC and the MCB in 2005 we had some good crowds. you know when they stoped showing up? after losing our home opener and playing a crap game against can't. plane and simple folks you want the attention and the fans then you need to win. nothing more nothing less just win win win

[ZippyTuba11]

These are last year's totals.Rank/ Name / Accum Attendance / Accum Percent Capacity / Avg Attendance /Games93 / Central Mich. / 93853 / 62.16 / 18771 / 5108 / Akron / 63910 / 45.39 / 15978 / 4Doesn't sound to me like they are drawing too much more even with their success.

[skip-zip]

wow....I certainly regard differences of opinion as being acceptable, but when people don't check their facts, that's another issue.Zipseuph....I'm sorry, but we WON our home opener against N. Texas in 2006, right after our MAC title, and bowl appearance. AND we went into that game having just beaten NC State, our first ever win against a BCS team, a couple of weeks earlier. Do you know what the attendance was that day? It was 16.000 people. If you want the truth, that's actually much LOWER than our attendance at plenty of home openers over the last 30 years....even when we stunk. Let me add one more thing....I know plenty of people who were in the athletic dept. at the time of our MAC championship, and they all acknowledged that it would be unwise for us to expect the huge throng of fans who showed up at the MAC Championship game, and at the bowl game, to continue to show up at the Rubber Bowl the following year for regular season games. That's just the way it is...it's MAC football. ZippyTuba...thanks for the fact check. But those of us who have been around a long time already know that there are not very significant changes in attendance among MAC teams, win or lose. CMU?...on the verge of it's 3rd straight MAC title?...and they draw a couple of thousand more than us? I think that says it all. If we are ever to achieve excellence and attendance, we still have loads of work ahead of us.