Darkwaters1122

It is pretty simple -- You directly called someone a "moron" on our board. You then chastised me for name-calling. That is being a hypocrite. It is, in fact, the text-book definition. If you backed off after someone called you out, it doesn't erase your action, or erase the insight into the root of the comment's intent. Also - I called no one an "idiot." Read my post. My text is very clear for all who can read - I stated (summary): ..."anyone who thinks I (CK) am blaming Gerry Faust for the lack of training facilities, or the delapidated Rubber Bowl, is an idiot." That is WAY different than calling someone an idiot. Did I call you "Shallow Puddle?" Yes. If you want to give some 3rd grade level mocking of my board name, then I can certainly follow suit. You set the tone. I'm happy to follow, if that is how you want to roll. Your advice on how to conduct myself on ZN is much appreciated. However, a guy with 28 posts telling someone who: 1.) Founded ZipsNation (along with a few others) 2.) Funds ZipsNation 3.) Has 5,500 posts on ZipsNation how he should conduct him/herself on ZN is pretty egotistical. My advice to YOU, should you want to continue posting on ZN, is as follows - 1.) Stop YOUR name-calling, and 3rd Grade BS 2.) Stop YOUR commentary on any aspect of my, or any other member's, personal life This board was created to discuss Zips athletics. Period. The Moderators here do not have time to deal with your behavior, and will not tolerate it. Warning ( From: Captain Kangaroo ) I don't have time to deal with your personal comments, and I will not tolerate it. This is only the 3rd warning I have issued in the 8 years this board has existed. That speaks volumes. Change how you approach the board. The next warning will be a suspension. Captain Kangaroo is a member of the Moderators group and has 5453 posts. Sent on: Today, 11:03 PM Goodbye

Hey Shallow Puddle -- Google "Bob Keeshan." The Zips mascot is Zippy...it's a kangaroo. Get it? Aren't you the same guy that called someone a "moron" the other day? Now you preach about talking down to people? You crack me up. What a hypocrite. LOL...OMG...PBR. Yes...that was me. And I apologized and changed the post. And that was after a long debate with someone I will no longer debate. You call EVERYONE names who do not agree with your opinions (and think your opinions are fact). And never retract. But I doubt you will see the difference. Yes…although you think I am an idiot, my IQ is high enough to know the kangaroo is our mascot and fondly referred to as Zippy. I will let the rest of your post slide. You seem like a avid Zips fan and that is a good thing...even if we disagree at times. But when you make statements calling anyone who disagrees with you an "idiot" or worse...it is just wrong and intellectually lazy. Maybe it is because of the current political climate of name calling and polarization. I don't know and I don't care. I read other posters complain about the same thing with you and I am willing to bet you have the same issues in your personal life. Just tone it down a little and stop with the name calling and you will not alienate and infuriate people. And remember…people who are here are all fans of the Zips.

Beats me. Tell me who you're referencing? I said I expect the Zips to go 6-6, or better. I always enjoy the poster who fabricates hyperbole. No one stated the Zips should be considered favorites to win a championship. Some ZN members have simply stated the team left for Ianello has some excellent talent. And feel, in a MAC East Division that can hardly be confused with the SEC, if RI is any sort of a decent coach, he can win a respectable amount of games fairly soon. Reading the comments regarding the upcoming season, it heartens me to see that the posters whom I feel have a good knowledge of the program feel that 2010 can be successful for the Zips based upon the returning talent, and our MAC schedule. It further heartens me to see the ones who don't feel the season will be successful (success defined by a .500 record or better in year #1) are either some of our weaker posters, or ones that tycially have a "sky is falling" attitude about everything. RI is the wildcard in whether or not the Zips can go .500, not the talent on the field. And other than stereotypes, there's no tangible evidence that he can, or cannot coach. Nice to hear you are satified with your wife, daughter, job, friends, family achievements and more. I am also satisfied with my wife, son, job, friends, family achievements and more. Of course, that's not all too interesting to ZN members, so I will stick to discussions regarding Zips athletics. I hope your glaucoma brings you a lot of medical marajuana out in Cali, and it gets you through the football season. hey LTGC.... You wrote previously: "The Zips should at least be 6-6 this season. New coach, new offensive and defensive schemes...3 BCS OOC's. I don't expect 10 - 2." "Today's Zips have sufficient talent to compete in the MAC East. I'm tired of 3-year plans." Somewhere between 6-6 and 10-2 and compete for the MAC East Championship. THIS year...not in year 2 or 3. From your post today...you have made a subtle change and LOWERED your expectations. I am sure you will say it is the same. LOL So why did you choose the name "Captain Kangaroo"?? "Captain" was as high as you could achieve?? Or You like talking down to people and treat them like children?? The way you call people names who disagree with you I am betting it is the latter.

General Patton? "Less than General" Kangaroo seems to think having lower expectations are for losers. I think that is naiveté.

MAC Record / Returning Starters Teams with better record and more returnees: Temple 7-1 19 Can't 4-4 16 Buffalo 3-5 14 Teams with better record and less returnees: Ohio 7-1 13 BG 6-2 7 Teams with worse record and more returnees: Miami 1-7 20 Teams with worse record and less returnees: None Help me out here.... Why is it so obvious that the Zips have the talent to compete for the MAC East Championship??? What am I (and most of the media) missing?? Don't get me wrong....I have high hopes for the Zips this year. But why SHOULD they be considered favorites?? Maybe I am just a loser because I don't have high expectations.....but I am a happy, satisfied one. Satisfied with my wife, daughter, job, friends, family achievements and more. Some of you winners must be really depressed (help me out here....why be satisfied with anything less then General??).

If you really regret saying something about someone on this forum, you can always go back and edit your original post. After all, it's just a sports forum. None of this really matters much in the overall history of the planet, which is less than a grain of sand in the perspective of the universe. You can edit a past post?? Cool. I will do that in the future. I think it may be a little late for that in this case. I was definitely a moron for doing something so rash and irrational. Thanks for the tip.

1. Yes. I believe he will fail. Every Zips football coach since we left the FCS has failed. Ianello will be no different. 2. Akron is not a mediocre program. We're worse than that right now. And the quotes are about teh strentgth of teh coaching hire, not the program. 3. I don't believe that. The quoted source said that. But yes, the coach is responsible. If talent alone won games, we would have been in a bowl game last season. 4. Notre Dame fans had nothing good to say about the assistants Ianello brought with him. Illinois fans rejoiced when we took their DC. If you want to ignore their complaints with blind optimism, after they spent years watching those assistants, be my guest. 5. I believe it. Rasor believes it. Ianello says he has a multi-year plan to win. That usually means he has given himself, or the AD has given him, a few years before he has to win. He has no pressure, and will use this year to build towards his future plan at the expense of winning this year. If you don't believe that, you've already given him an excuse for losing. 6. He has alienated his team. One incident got published across the country. It was more than a mis-fired text, because it indicated that he talked behind his players' backs instead of addressing that player's concerns directly. That's not soemthign you only do once, it's a type of behavior. As for giving him a chance, I can't. I can't because I already gave a coach just like this a chance, and his name was JD Brookhart. I can't because he was not the best coach available, and was chosen more due to his past connection with the AD more than his ability to lead a team. I can't because he's making the same mistakes that got Brookhart fired, and doesn't see a problem with it. I can't because all I see is five years of failure and another coaching search, history repeating. Son...I think you are a moron. Turn out the lights..no one is at home. You and I won't be debating in the future. no reason to get so personal. I understand what you mean, but why call him a moron? The part that seems contradictory to me is that if you have no hope, then why are you even here? If you want to go on record and be bold and make a prediction about the coaching hire being bad, then you have my props. Let's see how it pans out. But you still need to have hope that you are wrong. If you can't handle a challenge, go root for the Yankees Sorry...maybe I went a tad bit overboard. But my point is...I will just ignore ZTZ in the future as I don't believe he is a rational fan. Hopfully I have better things to do.

1. Yes. I believe he will fail. Every Zips football coach since we left the FCS has failed. Ianello will be no different. 2. Akron is not a mediocre program. We're worse than that right now. And the quotes are about teh strentgth of teh coaching hire, not the program. 3. I don't believe that. The quoted source said that. But yes, the coach is responsible. If talent alone won games, we would have been in a bowl game last season. 4. Notre Dame fans had nothing good to say about the assistants Ianello brought with him. Illinois fans rejoiced when we took their DC. If you want to ignore their complaints with blind optimism, after they spent years watching those assistants, be my guest. 5. I believe it. Rasor believes it. Ianello says he has a multi-year plan to win. That usually means he has given himself, or the AD has given him, a few years before he has to win. He has no pressure, and will use this year to build towards his future plan at the expense of winning this year. If you don't believe that, you've already given him an excuse for losing. 6. He has alienated his team. One incident got published across the country. It was more than a mis-fired text, because it indicated that he talked behind his players' backs instead of addressing that player's concerns directly. That's not soemthign you only do once, it's a type of behavior. As for giving him a chance, I can't, I can't because I already gave a coach just like this a chance, and his name was JD Brookhart. I can't because he was not the best coach available, and was chosen more due to his past connection with the AD more than his ability to lead a team. I can't because he's making the same mistakes that got Brookhart fired, and doesn't see a problem with it. I can't because all I see is five years of failure and another coaching search, history repeating. Kid...I think you are a irrational and delusional. You and I won't be debating in the future.

You list 31 examples (and Barry Alvarez twice). 26 of those (Miles, Saban, Peterson, Walker, Alvarez, Smith, Petrino, Tiller, Leach, Mangino, Bob Stoops, Friedgen, Pinckel, Pelini, Tuberville, Jones, Schiano, Dantonio, Golden, Mike Stoops, Erickson, Tedford, Richt, Hill, Davis, Edsall) were at least offensive or defensive coordinators before becoming a HC. Something Ianello has never done. 9 of them (Miles, Saban, Petrino, Friedgen, Pelini, Schiano, Hill, Davis, Edsall) coached something in the NFL along with having coordinator experience. 2 of them (Barnett at Fort Lewis College, Davis at Tulsa Rodgers High School) coached as a HC at a lower level first. Out of your list, only Shembechler, Fry, and Neuheisel started off going from a college position coach to a FBS head coach. If you go back and look at the threads that were around during the coaching search, you would find that I was not opposed to hiring someone with coordinator experience but believed that head coaching experience would be the preferred option. At least coordinators deal with half of roster (40 or more players) and call plays in game situations instead of just coaching 8 or 9 guys as a position coach. Ianello has never been more than a position coach. He can recruit for easy-to-recruit schools and he can sort of coach WRs. What he can't do is call plays or recruit for a school that doesn't sell itself. HS HC qualifies???? LOL You are killing me. If you go back and look at my threads you will see that my comments are relevant. NOT. I am responding the comment in the post!!! Not what you said months or years ago. You are starting to scare me. Are you sure you do not go to a school with a lightning bolt on the helmet??? Look...you painted yourself into a corner. You believe: 1. iCoach will fail (and does not deserve a chance and we should work against him) because he does not have HC experience. 2. You believe Akron is a "mediocre football program" and support that with quotes from....somewhere. 3. You believe to "turn Akron into a winner and it is up to Ianello and Ianello alone". You are a "Coacher" and believe it is the coach who is a responsible. 4. you believe he has a weak staff. 5. You believe he has written off this year as a rebuilding year. 6. You believe he has alienated his team. Conclusion....if he has no success you can sit in the bar and say "I told you so". Good for you. But if he has any success it will be all on him. But why do I have this feeling that you will find some way to take away the credit. "JD's guys" "fans intimidated oposing team" "lucky" "full moon" "yada yada yada" He inherited a failed program. Look at our rankings over the last 3 years. I don't read anyone here claiming he is the savior and was a brilliant hire. But...most believe he deserves a chance. Why have you devoted so much time and so many words to try and deny him that?? I remember there were guys critical of the Porter and Dambrot hires too. iCoach deserves a chance and I have yet to see anything he has done that is wrong...and some things that I like. Time will tell. But how you can be so adamant without any facts is laughable. You still have not shown me where BG was "excited" about Meyer. Words are easy... Don Shula says iCoach was one of the most brilliant hires in college over the last 10 years. Mike Holmgren thinks he is innovative and intelligent Bill Parcells thinks he is a good hire. Urban Meyer sees some of the same qualities that made him successful. Jim Tressel believes Ianello will turn the Zips into a rival of Ohio State Woody Hayes says his protege will take the Zips to a National Championship game!! ...without facts the debate gets much easier. Read Dave from Green and take notes.

No. We needed someone who has proven that they know how to run a football program as a head coach. How in love are you with Notre Dame that you believe that Ianello is at all qualified to do that just by virtue of him cleaning Charlie Weis' man-bras? Notre Dame is not what it used to be, it's not some great college football mecca, and hasn't been for 20 years. Stop living in the past. Notre Dame is just a step above the MAC, and a step behind the big Ten. Being at a "big program" just means that they don't understand what it takes to run a program that isn't big. At all his previous jobs, Ianello's recruits were falling over themselves to join a BCS school or Notre Dame. He didn't have to work to get recruits at all. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_Meyer If you do some research, life will be easier for you down the road. But you are young and prone to being rash. But since you are a Zip...I have high hopes for you still!!! ;-) Go Zips!!!! BG took a gamble and got lucky. Meyer excited their fans. Ianello is creating apathy among ours. Actually...I think you are blowing smoke. Show me proof that Meyer "excited" their fan base. iCoach desrves a chance. "No. We needed someone who has proven that they know how to run a football program as a head coach" is really lame. EVERY great coach started with no experiance. Here are more examples: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Les_Miles http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Saban http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Petersen http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Walker_...football_coach) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Alvarez http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_L._Smith http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Petrino http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Barnett http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Alvarez http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Schembechler http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hayden_Fry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Tiller http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Leach_(coach) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Mangino http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Stoops http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Snyder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Friedgen http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Pinkel http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Pelini http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tommy_Tuberville http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butch_Jones http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greg_Schiano http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Dantonio http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Golden_(American_football) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Stoops http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Erickson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Tedford http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rick_Neuheisel http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Richt\ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Hill http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butch_Davis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Edsall All had no HC experiance prior to their first D1 HC job. But...never let the facts get in the way of a good argument.

No. We needed someone who has proven that they know how to run a football program as a head coach. How in love are you with Notre Dame that you believe that Ianello is at all qualified to do that just by virtue of him cleaning Charlie Weis' man-bras? Notre Dame is not what it used to be, it's not some great college football mecca, and hasn't been for 20 years. Stop living in the past. Notre Dame is just a step above the MAC, and a step behind the big Ten. Being at a "big program" just means that they don't understand what it takes to run a program that isn't big. At all his previous jobs, Ianello's recruits were falling over themselves to join a BCS school or Notre Dame. He didn't have to work to get recruits at all. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_Meyer If you do some research, life will be easier for you down the road. But you are young and prone to being rash. But since you are a Zip...I have high hopes for you still!!! ;-) Go Zips!!!! BG took a gamble and got lucky. Meyer excited their fans. Ianello is creating apathy among ours. That is one way to look at it. Or...you could say there is a different fan base??? If you are a hammer...everything looks like a nail. Many Zip fans are negtive about Porter, Dambrot and others. The key word being NEGATIVE. Put on your rose colored glasses...life looks so much better and you walk around wit a smile instead of a frown.

The only undies worth savoring belong to libertarian politicians, right? Dave... I think you are the most unbiased. logical poster on this (or most any) site. I actually look for your posts. Your almost always insightful and rational. You are the one person on this site I would like to actually meet. BUT...I live in the bay area of California. You can't buy cigarettes in Walgreens (soon potato chips as well). You can't buy soda pop in vending machines in SF. You can't smoke ANYWHERE in Hayward except inside your home. Libertarians vs. Liberal Progressives?? LOL not even close. I consider myself a Blue Dog Democrat but if the choice are those 2...put me down for a double dose of Libertarian!!!! And let's be honest...based on what politicians tell us...their shit does not stink anyway. Left or right side of the undies does not matter ;-)

No. We needed someone who has proven that they know how to run a football program as a head coach. How in love are you with Notre Dame that you believe that Ianello is at all qualified to do that just by virtue of him cleaning Charlie Weis' man-bras? Notre Dame is not what it used to be, it's not some great college football mecca, and hasn't been for 20 years. Stop living in the past. Notre Dame is just a step above the MAC, and a step behind the big Ten. Being at a "big program" just means that they don't understand what it takes to run a program that isn't big. At all his previous jobs, Ianello's recruits were falling over themselves to join a BCS school or Notre Dame. He didn't have to work to get recruits at all. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_Meyer If you do some research, life will be easier for you down the road. But you are young and prone to being rash. But since you are a Zip...I have high hopes for you still!!! ;-) Go Zips!!!!

Neither does this guy at CBSSportsline. You have to wonder if he contacted Razor and Razor alone on this Link Matt Rodgers is a candidate for the starting QB position in much the same way as Ralph Nader has been a presidential candidate. You mean the unpopular choice who is better than the current job holder?? I don't think I agree with you. While I agree with most that Nicely is the best option, he has yet to prove he belongs. I am not sure that either guy is the answer. And I am sure that arm strength and accuracy are the hardest thing to improve or coach up. We can discuss the merits of telemarketing vs. billboards vs. reduced prices vs. lot 9 parking all day. Attendance will not improve until the teams improve on the field and that will not happen without a very good QB. Personally, I don't care who starts as long as they are successful. Hopefully both deserve to start and the competition make them both better. Go Zips!!!!

Agreed. I wish I could change my Steelers #7 jersey into a Giants #57 jersey. Chase is the kind of guy I want to root for. http://www.nflshop.com/product/index.jsp?p...rentPage=family You can get what you want from the golf money saved. :-)

"I think it has more to do with the Texas state legislature being pissed about a possible UT/A&M split. If A&M leaves for the SEC then UT has an excuse to join the PAC. Remember, UT specifically said that they would only join the new big 12 if all ten teams join(that's southern math for ya). " "Texas likely knows A&M is leaving for the SEC, and is stalling to make it look like they were trying to hold things together but A&M bolted so they had no choice but to move to the PAC-16. They don't want to be viewed as the bad guy in all this, even though everyone knows they are." "Texas will only stay if A&M decides to stick it out with the Big 12(whatever). Why would they? A&M will finally be freed from the shadow of big brother and have an equal share of the dough in a much better football conference. Texas knows this and is probably banking on A&M backing out of this 'new' Big 12." ******************************************************************************** Hmmm......at least now I know which prognosticators to ignore..or at least seriously question. ;-)

Both are terrible and boring to watch. Not an opinion held by all...but understandable. Let's keep it as opinion rather than a statement of fact. No need to denigrate or ridicule anyone who likes baseball, soccer, ________ or has an opposing opinion....unless the opinion is in favor Can't State.

You make valid points. But...just because a teams football program drops to Div 1A (or FCS) does not mean all other programs must follow. Dayton went through the same process and the BB team remains Div 1. Also...Dayton's football program gained support after they dropped down. Without any bias...I think some of the MAC schools would benefit dropping to FCS. It may even serve the MAC to facilitate the transition by creating a FCS division. They could then ad many new schools that would love being associated with the MAC. It may require going to 20 schools for other programs. Just a thought... They have a national championship 16 team playoff also...and all the playoff games are on television also...can win a national championship unlike in the FBS...and if all people care about is a winning team and making it far in playoffs, maybe attendance will go up for the Joe Akron? I don't see Akron going to FCS while Proenza is President. I think the Zips will give it more time as they have invested heavily in athletics in hopes of improving the university's image. I am thinking Kentt and BG as well as the directional Michigan schools. Unlike many here, I think the MAC can regain it's lost reputation. How long ago was Ball State in the top 20?? I plan to post an analysis of the conference ratings. In the past...the SEC was the most overrated and the MAC the most underrated. Not sure where that stands the last 3 years. I do think Miami needs to get back on track as it sets the tone for the conference. But I don't see that happening soon with the current coaching staff there. Let's give iCoach and his staff some time before we rush to judgement. Some one wrote that the offense was hindered by having too many OCs...Montgomery, Harris and JD. Did anyone find it unusual that there was no BIo for Montgomery last year?? A D1 OC with no Bio?? Something always seemed wrong with that picture. I just don't think JD ran a tight operation. iCoach may be ruffleing some feathers but I think some of it is due to the stark changes in style. I am willing to see the results before making any criticism.

You make valid points. But...just because a teams football program drops to Div 1A (or FCS) does not mean all other programs must follow. Dayton went through the same process and the BB team remains Div 1. Also...Dayton's football program gained support after they dropped down. Without any bias...I think some of the MAC schools would benefit dropping to FCS. It may even serve the MAC to facilitate the transition by creating a FCS division. They could then ad many new schools that would love being associated with the MAC. It may require going to 20 schools for other programs. Just a thought...

I think it would it would work. But what about Temple. I don't like that they are Football only. It used to be that the MAC gave out 10 less scholarships that the big boys. The idea was that they were a "academic" conference first and did not want any ideas of challenging for a national championship. That changed in the 70s (I think) when they added 5 more scholarships. Does anyone know where the MAC stands today in regards to the # of scholarships it can gave out for football?? Is it still 5 less than the maximum for D1?? Rather than talk about moving to a bigger conference, I think we should work to regain the reputation on the MAC. If that means putting some on probation or dropping some, so be it. In the long run, it may be easier to fix the MAC that for Akron to wedge it's way into one of the emerging Mega conferences.

Big Ten West Division: Nebraska Missouri Kansas Kansas State Iowa Minnesota Wisconsin Illinois Northwestern East Division: Ohio State Michigan Michigan State Purdue Indiana Notre Dame Penn State Pittsburgh Syracuse Scheduling: Football 8 games in division 2 games other division 2 game out of conference Basketball 16 division games (H/A) 9 other division 6-7 out of conference games Doubt it will happen....but I think 18 is the right # of schools for Mega Conference. Easy scheduling. Will make it even harder for mid-majors like Akron. Unless something drastic happens, eventually Akron will be hurt by this. It will make jumping to a new league even harder and creating a new league impossible. The next year will be interesting to say the least. go Zips!!!

Man...there seem to be a lot of negative people on ZipsNation. Is this the norm??? When reading some post here I am reminded of Sgt Oddball's (Kelly's Heroes) favorite line..."What's with all the negativity!!!" There will be lots of time to criticize after the season if iCoach or the Zips fail. But why now?? Are you guys this jaded in all aspects of life?? We have a new stadium, new coach and new hope. Let's enjoy the ride for a little while at least. Go Zips!!!

Dr Z You criticised Dave in Green for making a "feeling" observation about the a shorter PT roster. Then in a subsequent post you criticise him for making decisions based on statistical facts. It appears you just disagree with Dave in Green. Which is OK...but let's just call it that. About your observation about Jimmy and the possibility of him progressing faster had he gotten more minutes under a shorter PT roster....what do you think would have happened had he gotten less minutes under a shorter PT roster?? When your talent does not separate itself from one another, you will give more kids a shot and reward kids for practice time effort and success. I believe that happened last year. But I also believe KD will play 8-10 kids depending on the circumstances. Bob Huggins was the same way. He wanted kids to earn their time on the floor with maximum effort, intelligent decisions and taking care of the ball. That style will always present opportunities for kids who play with passion and effort. Do you like KD as the coach of the Zips?? KD's biggest problem was not having a true point guard. When they were recruited, it appeared there were at least 1-3 quality PGs but they did not prove to have that ability on the D1 level. I am a stats guy. They seldom lie and personal feelings for a player will not effect the analysis. From my point of view, last year's team was not that good and had many weaknesses. We had no one who could score in traffic like Travis and Boyce, no true point guard, no shut down wing defender and no team leader. I don't see a lot of improvement in those areas for next year..but I hope I am wrong. Dave in Green...keep up the statistical analysis. You seem to have a good feel for it ;-) The following statistics are averages based on playing 40 minutes game. The #s are then comparable after adjusting for time played. .....................Points.......Assists........T/O........Asst/TO.........Pct.... Hitchens____13.3______4.4_____2.7______1.6_______0.358 Roberts_____12.3______2.4_____1.6______1.5_______0.419 McNees_____12.0______3.6_____1.7______2.1_______0.371 Steward_____8.0______3.2_____4.1______0.8_______0.536 Sorry…none are that impressive.