Marcus Raines

[OLDSCHOOLZIP]

Akron will not be offering Raines.

Whew.........

[Zip Watcher]

Long ago college football ceased being about building quality people and became a business.  If we continue to hide our heads in the sand and pretend it is something other than what it really is, we are simply kidding ourselves.  If we continue to think we can win with nice suburban kids getting good grades, trying hard and not scaring the other suburbanites who come to family day in their mini vans, we are further kidding ourselves.  Let's get some guys that perform well, not try hard.  We have seen enough of that as well.  It's all about results on Saturday.

GP, I respectfully disagree with your sentiment here, and we'll have to agree to disagree. My wanting the U to have good stewards of the Akron community image involved doesn't mean I'm for mediocrity or poor talent. It simply means that I think we should always remember we are talking about:

The UNIVERSITY of Akron.

This isn't the old Akron Pro's of professional football. These are student athletes.

I can't help wondering if some folks wouldn't rather have an all-suburban team because of the ethnic quotient.

Now that simply pisses me off. Branding as racists or xenophobes those on this board that are wary of bringing on someone with a past that includes questionable choices is just ridiculous. Wanting good citizens has nothing to do with where the players come from or what they look like. That comment is a direct insult to the dozens of hard working, hard studying student athletes at UA who happen to come from an urban setting.

I think you guys are reading WAY too much in to peoples reservations and posts here. We ALL want the Zips to be successful. We ALL understand the concept of redemption & personal growth. We ALL understand the concept of risk vs. reward. Many of us remember some of the "risks" taken by Crawford and Faust, and we also remember the "rewards." Simply expressing hesitation about the level of risk involved in certain situations doesn't make people bigots or lovers of mediocrity.

[Captain Kangaroo]

I can't help wondering if some folks wouldn't rather have an all-suburban team because of the ethnic quotient. 

That's flat out weak. How dare you infer that those against this guy's recruitment are racist.

[OLDSCHOOLZIP]

That was one of the most ridiculous statements I've read around here in a while. There's a lot of "suburban" kids with problems who I wouldn't want on our team either. It has nothing to do with race.

But have no fear. I have inside info. Akron won't be offering this kid (thank God)

[Guest Guest]

Regardless of what a message board mod writes this kid is not coming to Akron, period.

Acording to an Insider at Marshall close to recruiting:

Marcus Raines is headed to Akron

[OLDSCHOOLZIP]

Regardless of what a message board mod writes this kid is not coming to Akron, period.

Acording to an Insider at Marshall close to recruiting:

Marcus Raines is headed to Akron

Well trust this insider here close to the Akron coaches....he wasn't and will not be offerred.

[Z.I.P.]

First I accept some of your spanking for my comments of last week. Arguing in a forum with strangers I wouldn't hesitate to make such a comment. In general political terms there IS hesitation to accept athletes from "the other side of the tracks", whether it's Compton or 8-Mile. On the other hand, I broke the first rule of the board, thou shan't accuse a fellow Zip without knowing that Roo. So, please accept my apology, it was nothing personal.

NOW -- we should consider the possibility that both Old School AND the Marshall guru (if that's not an oxymoron) are correct. There's the possibility that JD will or has already invited Raines to be a walk-on, if he pays his own way. Then if he minds his Ps and Qs, he could get a GIA the second year.

Think about it.

[Guest JJ Huddle]

Both Raines and Ray Williams are TOLEDO bound. Amstutz and Co. are taking some big gambles, so much so that if one of these guys screws up it could mean his job.

[Guest ***GUEST_racer***]

i agree with guest zip. it's amazing how judgemental people there.this was a kid in high school.like none of us in high school didnt do anything stupid like fights, driving and drinking. they could have turned out for the worse. we weren't there when it happened to know exactly what went wrong.luckily they didnt .but don't tell me when anyone on this board was 18 they didnt do the same dumb type of things.im not saying to let him have a offer, but everyone on this board wants men of character and go 10-0. if thats the case just recruit all high school honors students, and see how far we go. so i guess we should not have taken bosley back from osu. there are always good ,and bad but i think to judge a kid for something he did at 18 for the rest of his life is s tuff decision to make.

[Guest ***GUEST_Captain Kangaroo***]

(***GUEST_racer*** @ Feb 3 2005, 12:15 PM)

i agree with guest zip. it's amazing how judgemental people there.this was a kid in high school.like none of us in high school didnt do anything stupid like fights, driving and drinking. they could have turned out for the worse. we weren't there when it happened to know exactly what went wrong.luckily they didnt .but don't tell me when anyone on this board was 18 they didnt do the same dumb type of things.im not saying to let him have a offer, but everyone on this board wants men of character and go 10-0. if thats the case just recruit all high school honors students, and see how far we go. so i guess we should not have taken bosley back from osu. there are always good ,and bad but i think to judge a kid for something he did at 18 for the rest of his life is s tuff decision to make.

I will make this very clear:

Marcus Raines killed someone. He killed his teammate. He reared back and kicked his high school teammate in the head, as he lay unconscious in his girlfriend’s arms. That's what killed the kid.

Marcus Raines didn't get a DUI. He didn't steal a car stereo. He didn't get caught with a bag of weed. He killed a teammate of his with essentially his own bare hands (he wasn't drunk in a car).

When I was 18 I never kicked an unconscious kid in the head with such force as to kill him. Never came close.

Save all the bleeding heart cries to "give a kid a chance" for someone who cares. Save your analogies of killing a man to that of stealing a stereo for someone who cares. Save the bullshit cries of bigotry and racism too. He plea-bargained down to a manslaughter charge. He killed a teammate. I don't want that kid on my team.

If you want this kid on your school's team, then where do you draw the line? Murder? Double murder? Is your cut-off point dependent upon how many stars the kid has next to his name on Rivals.com?

Every team in Division 1 that went to a bowl game...that won their conference championship...every one did so without Marcus Raines. Even Marshall declined to recruit this kid. The Zips can win big without him. You just watch.

[Guest ***GUEST_OLDSCHOOLZIP***]

(***GUEST_racer*** @ Feb 3 2005, 12:15 PM)

i agree with guest zip. it's amazing how judgemental people there.this was a kid in high school.like none of us in high school didnt do anything stupid like fights, driving and drinking. they could have turned out for the worse. we weren't there when it happened to know exactly what went wrong.luckily they didnt .but don't tell me when anyone on this board was 18 they didnt do the same dumb type of things.im not saying to let him have a offer, but everyone on this board wants men of character and go 10-0. if thats the case just recruit all high school honors students, and see how far we go. so i guess we should not have taken bosley back from osu. there are always good ,and bad but i think to judge a kid for something he did at 18 for the rest of his life is s tuff decision to make.

I will make this very clear:

Marcus Raines killed someone. He killed his teammate. He reared back and kicked his high school teammate in the head, as he lay unconscious in his girlfriend’s arms. That's what killed the kid.

Marcus Raines didn't get a DUI. He didn't steal a car stereo. He didn't get caught with a bag of weed. He killed a teammate of his with essentially his own bare hands (he wasn't drunk in a car).

When I was 18 I never kicked an unconscious kid in the head with such force as to kill him. Never came close.

Save all the bleeding heart cries to "give a kid a chance" for someone who cares. Save your analogies of killing a man to that of stealing a stereo for someone who cares. Save the bullshit cries of bigotry and racism too. He plea-bargained down to a manslaughter charge. He killed a teammate. I don't want that kid on my team.

If you want this kid on your school's team, then where do you draw the line? Murder? Double murder? Is your cut-off point dependent upon how many stars the kid has next to his name on Rivals.com?

Every team in Division 1 that went to a bowl game...that won their conference championship...every one did so without Marcus Raines. Even Marshall declined to recruit this kid. The Zips can win big without him. You just watch.

Great Post.

[Guest ***GUEST_Z.I.P.***]

I will make this very clear:

Marcus Raines killed someone. He killed his teammate. He reared back and kicked his high school teammate in the head, as he lay unconscious in his girlfriend’s arms. That's what killed the kid.

Marcus Raines didn't get a DUI. He didn't steal a car stereo. He didn't get caught with a bag of weed. He killed a teammate of his with essentially his own bare hands (he wasn't drunk in a car).

When I was 18 I never kicked an unconscious kid in the head with such force as to kill him. Never came close.

Save all the bleeding heart cries to "give a kid a chance" for someone who cares. Save your analogies of killing a man to that of stealing a stereo for someone who cares. Save the bullshit cries of bigotry and racism too. He plea-bargained down to a manslaughter charge. He killed a teammate. I don't want that kid on my team.

If you want this kid on your school's team, then where do you draw the line? Murder? Double murder? Is your cut-off point dependent upon how many stars the kid has next to his name on Rivals.com?

Every team in Division 1 that went to a bowl game...that won their conference championship...every one did so without Marcus Raines. Even Marshall declined to recruit this kid. The Zips can win big without him. You just watch.

Let me start by saying I defend anyone and everyone's right to say their peace, and point of view. My military service was based on that concept. But I couldn't possibly disagree more. Frankly, I don't want to live in a world where no one gets a second chance. Your lucky it was Raines who blew his cool that night, not someone close to you.

The facts stated above also diverge from those described as coming out before and during the trial. The truth is, as has been stated before, that the 17 y.o. Raines did not "kill" the victim. The M.E. determined there was no way to prove the cause of death -- the punch, the collision of the victim's head with the pavement, or the kick to the head. Prosecutors don't "cop a plea" if they can prove murder, and that's what it would have been. INvoluntary manslaughter was the charge, and the point is: he paid his time. Why should his sentence now have added some sort of social shunning by the holier than thou?

If I wanted to go further, and slightly marginal, I'd ask why no one's equally upset about the other party in the crime getting a full ride to Oregon, after the judge reduced it to a misdemeanor. Is this justice? I can't see it.

BTW -- Toledo is not listed as offering a scholarship to Raines -- or to the Cleveland RB (Ray Williams?) who was paroled and supposedly headed to the U of Akron.

That's all I want to say about this. Let's go Zips!

[Zipsrifle]

Good point Z.I.P about the second chance, but I still don't want this kid. If this kid can't keep it together and punches or kickes his teamate hard enough to kill him, or have the pavement kill him, then in my book, he's got problems that UA doesn't need to deal with. The kid made the decision to do what he did, and now he must live with the consequences. He'll have lots of second chances in his life....Football is not his only second chance, remember that!

As for people who argue that lots of other teams have criminals and they are winning, I don't care. You an either look at the way things are and believe that is the only way to do it, or you can believe their is another, better way. As for the ethnic comment...way off base here. I never looked at the picture of this guy and I'm sure it was that way with others. Got to throw a flag on that one.