Can Akron become the Boise State...

[xu9697]

of the MAC, or similar to the BYU/UTAH programs of the MWC? I think it is pretty clear that these next 2-3 years are HUGE! This year needs to be the building block for the '09 and '10 teams in determining if that type of "domination" is possible. The new stadium is obviously a huge part of this. We live in an age where kids like things that are new, glitzy, etc. Look at UCF and how they are taking off in their new stadium. Akron, Can't State and Miami are truly in the most fertile recruiting grounds within the conference. Miami has obviously been the most solid program over the years (Toledo had their run too), but not dynamic. Though Can't State may have more history with some previous players and coaches, their stadium/location/program is not positioned as well as Akron. 20 years after becoming Division I (whatever they call it now), Akron is truly on the cusp of having the OPPORTUNITY to become a top notch mid-level program. I hope they seize the opportunity.

[GP1]

There are a coupe of holes in the argument:Hole 1...NE Ohio is a fertile recruiting ground. High school football in Ohio is a shell of what it was 20 years ago. Every school is looking outside of Ohio to get players because the players coming out of high school really aren't that good. At this point, Temple has a much better recruiting ground than either UofA, Can't State or Miami.Hole 2...The new stadium will put UofA over the top along with the indoor practice arena. The UCF analogy does not hold with Akron for a couple of reasons. One, UCF stunk when they were in the MAC because kids in Florida did not want to play their games in the north where it is cold and their parents could not go to the games. Two, UCF has made a commitment to having a potential conference winner. Akron is committed to building things. The new stadium is being built out of as much necessity as it is desire to be good.If nice stadiums and recruiting are all it takes to be a good team, Temple will be the best team in the league in a few years. They have everyone in the conference beat by a mile in these two areas.The future of the MAC...The futurre can only be described as bleak. We are less than one month from the last two MAC bowl games and we can not forget what we learned. MAC schools were prison raped in their last two bowl games by teams that are only average in their conference. There is a pretty good chance that the two I-AA finalists would win the MAC. MAC schools will always be where we are for many reasons:1. They have little fan support.2. Little money because they have little fan support and those that do go do not want to pay a lot to see it.3. The BCS is designed to keep them bad (although I think the BCS is a boogey many non-BCS schools use as an excuse for their lack of performance). If money was equal, the BCS schools would rise to the top again because of tradition.4. There are too many MAC schools for a declining northern population to support with good players.5. Since they have no money, they create an unstable coaching atmosphere because they can not pay coaches6. No matter how many stadiums they build or indoor practice arenas, the BCS schools can always build bigger and nicer.7. Athletic Directors are in the same position the coaches are in so there is instability there.8. Athletic Directors are too young and inexperienced to have the know how or maturity to significantly improve the programs. When they do mature, they realize the cause is hopeless and look elsewhere for employment.9. Etc, etc, etc...Lastly, poor product keeps people from going to games and causes the above cycle to continue forever. In the end, the new stadium is not going to matter because we are not the only team in the MAC improving their stadium or practice arena. BGSU now has a new practice arena and Miami will soon have one. Can't has had one for years. The list of teams with new stadiums or practice arenas that stayed bad after the building would be longer than those that improved.While my post was long, it was exceedingly easy and quick to write. It should be for everyone else.

[g-mann17]

While my post was long, it was exceedingly easy and quick to write. It should be for everyone else.

While my post is short, it is exceedingly easy and quick to write. GP1 is the perpetual pessimist. "We will never be any good, ever, ever, ever!!!!"Then why do you even bother to follow the programs?

[xu9697]

While my post was long, it was exceedingly easy and quick to write. It should be for everyone else.

While my post is short, it is exceedingly easy and quick to write. GP1 is the perpetual pessimist. "We will never be any good, ever, ever, ever!!!!"Then why do you even bother to follow the programs?

WOW! Is he always like that? I can't possibly quote his and put everyone through that!GP1:I won't say you don't have any good statements, because you do have at least 1 or 2. But PLENTY of bad ones too. NE Ohio talent may not be as good, but it is still a very fertile region. PLENTY of kids from NE Ohio going to MAJOR programs. Temple has a great facility?!?!?!? Yeah, kids love playing in 66,000 seat stadiums with 10,000 people there. How many great college programs play in pro stadiums? Can't think of one off-hand (and please don't say Pitt), though there might be 1 or 2. USC? OK, well...not really sure where that fits in the scope of pro/college stadiums. Are you the same type of person that gripes about how NE Ohio sucks, we are losing all of our jobs, the weather sucks, etc.

[Still-a-zip]

GP1, GP1, GP1! Are you ever gonna learn! You are an idiot! Point blank! I am not gonna point this out everytime I see an idiotic comment from you. But christ o'mighty. You are an idiot! For you to sit here and say NE Ohio is down in talent you are a clueless fu.k! Ohio State has had 15 straight years of signing someone from Stark county alone. That is only one county in NE Ohio and only one Div. 1 school. Let me name a few: Troy Smith, Chris Wells, Barton, Boone, Cie Grant, Kenny Peterson, Maurice Clarrett, Tony Gonzalez, Jamar Martin, Ted Ginn, etc. Those are just to name a few. And those are just Buckeyes. How about Mario Manningham and Prescott Burgess. There is the second Big Ten team, but I am sick of making the argument to someone who doesn't have a clue. Where is your arguement? Where are your statistical facts? I don't even like Ohio State. But I respect the fact they are the dominant program in Ohio. Go start putting your posts there, on Buckeye boards. B/c you are obviously a Buckeye fan. Run with the front runner. You are not a Zip fan and never will be. But when this program awakes from the sleeping giant program that they can be you will be the jack ass fan who will say you were there from the beginning. Do us all a favor and do not post anymore. Why? B/c you are an idiot. Like I said on your last completely idiotic comment: Quit dwelling on the fact you got hurt in pee-wee football and never regained your spot back through high school. Face the fact, that you never stepped foot on a Div 1 football field, let alone remotely have the talent to play flag football in a co-ed league. Bottom line SHUT UP! You make me embarrassed to say I am a Zip fan only because it makes me associated with you! SHUT UP! Wow I feel better now!

[Still-a-zip]

Seriously! Shut up!

[GP1]

Seriously! Shut up!

No.

[GP1]

Face the fact, that you never stepped foot on a Div 1 football field, let alone remotely have the talent to play flag football in a co-ed league.

Really? I have pictures that prove different.

[GP1]

While my post was long, it was exceedingly easy and quick to write. It should be for everyone else.

While my post is short, it is exceedingly easy and quick to write. GP1 is the perpetual pessimist. "We will never be any good, ever, ever, ever!!!!"Then why do you even bother to follow the programs?

I prefer cynic to pessimist.The point is not that we will not ever be any good. The question is, What do we want to be good compared to? I think it is completely in the realm of reality for Akron to be a good MAC school. In fact, we were recently good enough to win the MAC Championship. Becoming a consistent contender for the championship should be a realistic goal.Only one program in the history of the MAC was a Boise State type team and that was Marshall. Miami was a team like that for one year with Roethlisberger when they finished in the Top 10. What has happened to Marshall since getting out of the MAC?.....Complete disaster. The teams in our league are simply not designed to be high level mid major programs.With the current condition of the MAC, a 7-8 win season is a success (8 is actually a huge success). That's what we should be shooting for. It guarantees a bowl game and sets us up for a shot at the MACC. Remember, we were only a QB away from beating Miami and one drive from beating Temple. The Zips could have gone 6-6 last year. There is enough talent on the Zips that a 6-7 win season should not be out of the question next year.

[GP1]

Let me name a few: Troy Smith, Chris Wells, Barton, Boone, Cie Grant, Kenny Peterson, Maurice Clarrett, Tony Gonzalez, Jamar Martin, Ted Ginn, etc. Those are just to name a few. And those are just Buckeyes. How about Mario Manningham and Prescott Burgess.

Every part of the state can say they product BCS talent. The point is that the second level of talent in NE Ohio is not any good. The MAC is getting worse because of that fact.

[GP1]

B/c you are obviously a Buckeye fan. Run with the front runner.

Where did I mention OSU?

[GP1]

Temple has a great facility?!?!?!? Yeah, kids love playing in 66,000 seat stadiums with 10,000 people there. How many great college programs play in pro stadiums?

10,000? Temple shattered the single season attendance average for the MAC last year. They drew 69,029 for the PSU game breaking the single game attendance record. With the stadium they have, they could host PSU every other year and Rutgers on off years and draw about that amout for one game each year.If the prevailing line of thinking on this board is correct (new stadiums make teams win), then playing in an NFL stadium would make Temple win. I think it will take more to win, but shattering the league attendance record is a good recruiting advantage. They probably also were able to get a good crowd without having to give away tickets.

[GP1]

Are you the same type of person that gripes about how NE Ohio sucks, we are losing all of our jobs, the weather sucks, etc.

I don't complain about NE Ohio sucking nearly as much as I used to.NE Ohio isn't losing jobs? The weather is great?Have a nice weekend angry NE Ohio people.

[GoZips]

No offense GP1, but a cynic doubts while a pessimist is adamant. Unfortunately I see no doubting. You are quite adamant in your views.Truth be told, GP1 is a a dyed in the wool Zips fan. I have a friend who knows who GP1 is. He claims that GP1 is a former Zip footballer player (probably from theleather helmet and brass knuckles days). GP1 is not going to like this, BUT, he is financially a heavy contributor to the Zips athletic programs. My friend says GP1 is a lot of poiant bluster. Since I like myfriend quite a bit I accept his viewpoint as valid. GP1 you big teddy bear.Ahem, Temple might well draw 69,000 playing Penn State at Veterans Stadium. The rub is that 68,000 are wearing blue and white, Same goes for playing Rutgers.I remember when Akron was an 8,000 student city school. My own Dad tried to get me to accept a scholarship from Akron. I went to "bigger" school instead.Still, today I hold my degree from then lowly Akron. Things have changed. The school has grown tremendously. I am proud of Akron. I support the programswith money and my voice. I believe that GP1 does also. Only he chooses a style that he enjoys.

[GP1]

No offense GP1, but a cynic doubts while a pessimist is adamant. Unfortunately I see no doubting. You are quite adamant in your views.Truth be told, GP1 is a a dyed in the wool Zips fan. I have a friend who knows who GP1 is. He claims that GP1 is a former Zip footballer player (probably from theleather helmet and brass knuckles days). GP1 is not going to like this, BUT, he is financially a heavy contributor to the Zips athletic programs. My friend says GP1 is a lot of poiant bluster. Since I like myfriend quite a bit I accept his viewpoint as valid. GP1 you big teddy bear.Ahem, Temple might well draw 69,000 playing Penn State at Veterans Stadium. The rub is that 68,000 are wearing blue and white, Same goes for playing Rutgers.I remember when Akron was an 8,000 student city school. My own Dad tried to get me to accept a scholarship from Akron. I went to "bigger" school instead.Still, today I hold my degree from then lowly Akron. Things have changed. The school has grown tremendously. I am proud of Akron. I support the programswith money and my voice. I believe that GP1 does also. Only he chooses a style that he enjoys.

Thank you GoZips. You are a gentleman and a wordsmith.The average was set against PSU, but the point is Temple has the ability to draw a team like that to their stadium for a home game. Their stadium can be a huge advantage to them.

[HOLLYWOODZIPPY]

7. Athletic Directors are in the same position the coaches are in so there is instability there.8. Athletic Directors are too young and inexperienced to have the know how or maturity to significantly improve the programs. When they do mature, they realize the cause is hopeless and look elsewhere for employment.Obviously you've never met Mack Rhoades. The man is extremely intelligent and very demanding with his coaches. Obviously at mid major schools such as MAC schools you can't expect to be playing for National Championships every year. The best you can hope for is to win your conference title and get some exposure. But to contradict myself look at some of the other sports in the MAC, Akron soccer was a top 15 team this year and they EXPECT to win a national championship. As much as I hate to admit it Can't Read University up the road has a top 15 maybe a top 10 golf program. And I hear snobby Miami has a top ranked preppy sweater knitting team, although I can't find that in print. Point is, athletic directors in mid-majors have one of the most difficult jobs in that they have the pressure of hiring coaches that they trust to build solid programs, with limited financial resources, because the people in their city (especially their newspapers!) think they have to be a stupid Buckeye fan.

[Zips fan]

The question of whether Akron can ever achieve what Boise State or Utah did-the answer is absolutely! Of course any school can hit that stretch and be up with the BCS schools for awhile. I think the WAC and MWC are bringing in bigger crowds establishing better TV contracts and pulling away from the MAC right now. Our conference, along with CUSA and the Sun Belt, are being overshadowed by our BCS conferences. The MWC is winning fans from across their states. Utah/BYU is a state wide rivalary, New Mexico/New Mexico State, Nevada/UNLV, Boise State/Idaho, and schools like Hawaii are not competing against an established fan base. The B10 and SEC draw an enormous amount of support from their states. If Akron is going to become a real player in DI-A football, they are going to have to show the NE Ohio that they are competitive with the B10 year in and year out. They will need to pull Buckeye fans into our stadium. We need the financial support of 30K strong for a decade to rise to level of elite non-BCS programs.

[Z-P]

No offense GP1, but a cynic doubts while a pessimist is adamant. Unfortunately I see no doubting. You are quite adamant in your views.Truth be told, GP1 is a a dyed in the wool Zips fan. I have a friend who knows who GP1 is. He claims that GP1 is a former Zip footballer player (probably from theleather helmet and brass knuckles days). GP1 is not going to like this, BUT, he is financially a heavy contributor to the Zips athletic programs. My friend says GP1 is a lot of poiant bluster. Since I like myfriend quite a bit I accept his viewpoint as valid. GP1 you big teddy bear.Ahem, Temple might well draw 69,000 playing Penn State at Veterans Stadium. The rub is that 68,000 are wearing blue and white, Same goes for playing Rutgers.I remember when Akron was an 8,000 student city school. My own Dad tried to get me to accept a scholarship from Akron. I went to "bigger" school instead.Still, today I hold my degree from then lowly Akron. Things have changed. The school has grown tremendously. I am proud of Akron. I support the programswith money and my voice. I believe that GP1 does also. Only he chooses a style that he enjoys.

Thank you GoZips. You are a gentleman and a wordsmith.The average was set against PSU, but the point is Temple has the ability to draw a team like that to their stadium for a home game. Their stadium can be a huge advantage to them.

Go Zips is right..............sorry to put the cherry on this sundae, but GP-1 is among the most loyal and dedicated Zips boosters. He once did the Don Quixote in behalf of UAM and The Boss, and tried to rally all FB alum to the cause almost single handedly................sadly, his hard work has fallen apart. He's paid forward the right to say what he wants.Let him rant guys. He's bright., he brings quality content at about the 50% level, and keeps us pissed and posting. We'd miss him if he were gone (pituiy...........did I just say that? :blink: )?

[KSUflash07]

Can't State actually has top 25 Gymnastics, Wrestling and Golf lol... just to make that correction.I like this convo. though. I think the MAC prevents a lot of our schools from advancing. I view the MAC as more of a incubator for teams to do well and leave for bigger and better conferences... unfortunately Marshall couldn't make it outside of the womb.

[Buckzip]

Can't State actually has top 25 Gymnastics, Wrestling and Golf lol... just to make that correction.I like this convo. though. I think the MAC prevents a lot of our schools from advancing. I view the MAC as more of a incubator for teams to do well and leave for bigger and better conferences... unfortunately Marshall couldn't make it outside of the womb.

That is actually a pretty good analogy. Unfortunately it is also an incubator for coaches.

[zen]

The question of whether Akron can ever achieve what Boise State or Utah did-the answer is absolutely! Of course any school can hit that stretch and be up with the BCS schools for awhile. I think the WAC and MWC are bringing in bigger crowds establishing better TV contracts and pulling away from the MAC right now. Our conference, along with CUSA and the Sun Belt, are being overshadowed by our BCS conferences. The MWC is winning fans from across their states. Utah/BYU is a state wide rivalary, New Mexico/New Mexico State, Nevada/UNLV, Boise State/Idaho, and schools like Hawaii are not competing against an established fan base. The B10 and SEC draw an enormous amount of support from their states. If Akron is going to become a real player in DI-A football, they are going to have to show the NE Ohio that they are competitive with the B10 year in and year out. They will need to pull Buckeye fans into our stadium. We need the financial support of 30K strong for a decade to rise to level of elite non-BCS programs.

that is a great analysis. I'm serious. I don't know if I have read it here before, but it makes perfect sense.And the MAC will never step out of the shadow of the BCS big brother conference in the region, but as was brought up before on here in the past, Akron has one outside chance as an individual entity not sharing a specific market, and that is that our BCS team has to cast it's shadow from half a state away. Its an outside shot, but the lightening in a bottle is a culmination of however unlikely events which includes them having down years and us beating the odds.

[Big Zip]

GP1 if I'm correct you have moved from Ohio and don't live here any longer. If this is true I'm happy to say you are one of the few people down on Ohio and NE Ohio to have moved, good for you. The people I have issue with are the negative people who live among us. I like NE Ohio -- I've lived here my whole life, but have recently started looking out of the state if for no other reason than the poor way it is run. The problem with leaving now is getting a decent price for my home, but I digress.The list below is about 1 1/2 years old, but it tells a story.States with Most NFL Players: California 206, Florida 177, Texas 175, Ohio 83, Georgia 80.Based on population estimates Ohio is No. 7 in population and No. 4 in football talent. I know your excuse of this is the top of the heap the next level down isn't as good. So are you telling me it skips a level -- because Mount Union is made up of a lot (almost all) Ohio players and they play for Division Championship almost every year. YSU is a pretty tough Div. 1-AA program with a lot of Ohio and Pa kids too. Logically speaking I don't think your thought process is to believable. I applaud Temple for getting Penn State to play them at home in what I believe is 5 for 2 deal. But the Temple fans aren't what took their attendance to new heights. After making this statement I'm hoping you aren't one of those folks lobbying for the Zips not to play any big money games.

[GP1]

No offense GP1, but a cynic doubts while a pessimist is adamant. Unfortunately I see no doubting. You are quite adamant in your views.Truth be told, GP1 is a a dyed in the wool Zips fan. I have a friend who knows who GP1 is. He claims that GP1 is a former Zip footballer player (probably from theleather helmet and brass knuckles days). GP1 is not going to like this, BUT, he is financially a heavy contributor to the Zips athletic programs. My friend says GP1 is a lot of poiant bluster. Since I like myfriend quite a bit I accept his viewpoint as valid. GP1 you big teddy bear.Ahem, Temple might well draw 69,000 playing Penn State at Veterans Stadium. The rub is that 68,000 are wearing blue and white, Same goes for playing Rutgers.I remember when Akron was an 8,000 student city school. My own Dad tried to get me to accept a scholarship from Akron. I went to "bigger" school instead.Still, today I hold my degree from then lowly Akron. Things have changed. The school has grown tremendously. I am proud of Akron. I support the programswith money and my voice. I believe that GP1 does also. Only he chooses a style that he enjoys.

Thank you GoZips. You are a gentleman and a wordsmith.The average was set against PSU, but the point is Temple has the ability to draw a team like that to their stadium for a home game. Their stadium can be a huge advantage to them.

Go Zips is right..............sorry to put the cherry on this sundae, but GP-1 is among the most loyal and dedicated Zips boosters. He once did the Don Quixote in behalf of UAM and The Boss, and tried to rally all FB alum to the cause almost single handedly................sadly, his hard work has fallen apart. He's paid forward the right to say what he wants.Let him rant guys. He's bright., he brings quality content at about the 50% level, and keeps us pissed and posting. We'd miss him if he were gone (pituiy...........did I just say that? :blink: )?

Thanks Z-P. Since I'm supposed to give up something I really like for Lent, I'm going to give up the board for 40 days starting this Wednesday. This will be very difficult.BTW. I give credit to Gary Bogue for the FB Alumni attempt. I give some credit to Pat Kreger, but he left early on. I give no credit to UAM or The Boss because they were no longer at the school. Blair Danner is trying to get something going. I might be too far away now to pull a Don Quixote again.....my horse won't travel that far. If former players are reading this, you should call Blair and offer to lend a hand. I'll tell you something interesting about myself though....just like Don Quixote had a suit of armor, the great GP1 has always wanted to own a suit of armor I could actually wear. I'd wear it all the time. I'd probably wear it to some Zips games. In fact, I have a reoccurring dream about it. True story....

[GP1]

GP1 if I'm correct you have moved from Ohio and don't live here any longer. If this is true I'm happy to say you are one of the few people down on Ohio and NE Ohio to have moved, good for you. The people I have issue with are the negative people who live among us. I like NE Ohio -- I've lived here my whole life, but have recently started looking out of the state if for no other reason than the poor way it is run. The problem with leaving now is getting a decent price for my home, but I digress.The list below is about 1 1/2 years old, but it tells a story.States with Most NFL Players: California 206, Florida 177, Texas 175, Ohio 83, Georgia 80.Based on population estimates Ohio is No. 7 in population and No. 4 in football talent. I know your excuse of this is the top of the heap the next level down isn't as good. So are you telling me it skips a level -- because Mount Union is made up of a lot (almost all) Ohio players and they play for Division Championship almost every year. YSU is a pretty tough Div. 1-AA program with a lot of Ohio and Pa kids too. Logically speaking I don't think your thought process is to believable. I applaud Temple for getting Penn State to play them at home in what I believe is 5 for 2 deal. But the Temple fans aren't what took their attendance to new heights. After making this statement I'm hoping you aren't one of those folks lobbying for the Zips not to play any big money games.

The point I am trying to make is that the talent level in NE Ohio is not as good as it used to be. I believe the best football being played in Ohio right now is in the Columbus area and Cincinnati. It's not that there aren't good kids in NE Ohio, there just aren't enough of them since the population is declining and it is growing in Columbus and Cincinnati.I would give you the same advice I would give to anyone wanting to leave NE Ohio.....If there is nothing keeping you there (I'm not native to NE Ohio so that was easy) and you can fulfill all three of Ludwig von Mises' (grm?) criteria for making a change, then move. If not, don't move. The three criteria are:1. Uneasiness or dissatisfaction2. A vision of a better state3. Belief that one is capable of achieving the better state.The hard part is just making the decision to move. Once you do that, if you play your cards right, everything else will fall into place. You may take a little beating on the house at this point, but that's only money. You can earn more money. You can't put a price on happiness. I work for a company that bought my house from me long before the market crashed but was still on the way down. Eight months later, the house is still for sale for much less than what I sold it to the company for. I'd feel bad if Warren Buffett didn't own my company. If you get a buy out, you will make up the loss in paid closing costs, relocation expenses and real estate agent fees. It will work out for the best.As far as where to go, that is up to you. I'd advise a warm weather state. It's very difficult being cold a large part of the year. The Carolinas are BOOMING right now. With the exception of UNC, Wake and Duke, UofA is Harvard compared to the rest. You guys wouldn't believe the amount of really stupid NC State, South Carolina, ECU, UNC Charlotte, etc. graduates there are around making really good livings. I have a guy who works for me who just relocated from Sagamore Hills and his Cleveland State degree makes him smarter than most. People are easy to meet because everyone has something in common....most are form the north. Of the 10 houses immediately around me, 9 of the 10 are families who relocated from the north. In Raleigh, there is a suburb called Cary. The natives call it the Containment Area for Relocated Yankees (CARY).My PM button works. I would help any UofA graduate in any way I could if they asked. The problem is, nobody every asks.

[Lee Adams]

GP1 if I'm correct you have moved from Ohio and don't live here any longer. If this is true I'm happy to say you are one of the few people down on Ohio and NE Ohio to have moved, good for you. The people I have issue with are the negative people who live among us. I like NE Ohio -- I've lived here my whole life, but have recently started looking out of the state if for no other reason than the poor way it is run. The problem with leaving now is getting a decent price for my home, but I digress.The list below is about 1 1/2 years old, but it tells a story.States with Most NFL Players: California 206, Florida 177, Texas 175, Ohio 83, Georgia 80.Based on population estimates Ohio is No. 7 in population and No. 4 in football talent. I know your excuse of this is the top of the heap the next level down isn't as good. So are you telling me it skips a level -- because Mount Union is made up of a lot (almost all) Ohio players and they play for Division Championship almost every year. YSU is a pretty tough Div. 1-AA program with a lot of Ohio and Pa kids too. Logically speaking I don't think your thought process is to believable. I applaud Temple for getting Penn State to play them at home in what I believe is 5 for 2 deal. But the Temple fans aren't what took their attendance to new heights. After making this statement I'm hoping you aren't one of those folks lobbying for the Zips not to play any big money games.

from one who was born and raised in Akron but left and returned...see the rest of the world while you have a chance...have something to compare this place to before you decide what its like...if you still like it,fine if not, good for you...i am glad i got out for a while...plan on leaving again as soon as i retire..