CSU and Akron to merge?

[ZippyBoy]

Interesting article in today's Plain Dealer...your thoughts?Merge Cleveland State and U of Akron? That's the buzzPosted by Janet Okoben September 20, 2007 23:42PMCategories: Education, ImpactAn idea to shake up the state's college system could combine Cleveland State University and the University of Akron and bring a medical school to downtown Cleveland.Some of the talk involves moving the Northeastern Ohio Universities Colleges of Medicine and Pharmacy, known as NEOUCOM, from Portage County or expanding its Rootstown-based campus.• Compare the three schools.Combining CSU and UA would eliminate overlapping programs and administrative jobs, and the two schools would then function under a single leader.The two people with the ability to make these ideas happen, Gov. Ted Strickland and his higher-education chancellor, Eric Fingerhut, would not comment Thursday on what others familiar with the discussions say has a real chance of happening.Fingerhut is in the midst of developing a master plan for the state's higher-education system, which was recently named the University System of Ohio.He did acknowledge that big changes are needed here. "There's pretty broad consensus that the status quo in Northeast Ohio is not acceptable," Fingerhut said."The optimal solution will involve some significant changes to what we're currently doing because we're not getting the maximum benefit of the state's investment in higher education in Northeast Ohio."Fingerhut said he's listening to all ideas, but wouldn't talk about specifics."I'm not there yet, and in any event it would be a shared vision, not my own vision, because the only way to be successful is for it to be a shared vision among civic leaders and higher education leaders and community leaders in Northeast Ohio, so I work on it every day," Fingerhut said. "We're a ways off from having any recommendations."A state-funded public medical school could share research dollars and talent with the medical school at Case Western Reserve University, a private institution. It could build on the region's already strong hospitals and medical services.CSU President Michael Schwartz and UA President Luis Proenza both said they had heard a number of ideas involving their schools, but nothing definite. Proenza has written extensively on what he calls higher education as an industry in transition.A group called the Northeast Ohio Universities Collaboration and Innovation Study Commission has been meeting monthly since March to pitch ideas on improving higher education. The group, made up of university and business leaders, has until December to submit ideas to Fingerhut.One member, Cleveland businessman Richard Pogue, proposed relocating NEOUCOM to a major city.Strickland also would not comment on specifics, but said much change is possible."I am encouraging Eric to be creative in his approach and to not leave anything off the table necessarily at this stage," he said.View Plain Dealer Article

[Captain Kangaroo]

Gary Waters and Keith Dambrot on the same sideline! We'd RULE in hoops!

[skip-zip]

I'm going to assume at this point that the goal of such an idea is to combine administrative and management functions since it says "The TWO schools would then function under a single leader".I would not think that this is a consolidation in terms of a name change for both schools, or combining athletic programs. Lets hope not.

[g-mann17]

I have to say that this is the dumbest idea I have ever seen. Two Universities that are over a 45 minute drive apart combining? That is completely ignorant. Also why should Cleveland get everything? They always try and steal any identity that the City of Akron has. I pray that this doesn't happen, and if i knew that this was something that Strickland wanted to accomplish I would have never supported him. Fund the schools appropriately, if you don't want overlapping programs then quit having OSU expand it's education programs. It is technically supposed to be an A&M school anyway. I have no problem with aligning credits, and making intercollegiate transfer easier. I have no problem saying that the U of A is the only school who focuses on Polymer Engineering; Can't State is the only school that focus on liquid crystal; Cleveland State is the only school that focuses on urban development. But let those programs be integrated don't start combinging schools together because it deludes the knowledge pool.

[zen]

Guys, the benefits of consolidating administration is negligible. You still have two campuses to manage, even if they are under one banner.Where they MAY have a point is combining educational resources and overlapping programs, but even that is quite limited, because if you do it in it's truest sense, what you end up doing is taking away the LOCAL higher education resources from the population (IE, people who walk or use public transportation to campus) which they are not going to do unless they SPEND MONEY on a inter-campus transportation system between Akron and Cleveland, which defeats the purpose of being efficient. It doesn't make any sense.This whole thing, in my opinion, is about NEOUCOM. They want it for Case. They want it in Cleveland.That's why I gave my thread the title "I KNEW IT WAS A COUP"This is all politics. What did you expect from politicians.I didn't think Cleveland had much clout in Columbus.... but apparently, they definately got more pull than Akron. What a shit-job

[ZachTheZip]

It's a terrible idea unless they decide to make CSU something like our current Wayne County Campus. UA is so much more of a true university than CSU with the exception of their medical program. I have a feeling that the idiots in Cleveland that have never seen what UA is like and have no idea about it's research programs will whine and complain until the "main" university is located in Cleveland. There's no way I'm moving there to finish my classes and graduate. I'll transfer somewhere else first.Anything located in Cleveland is bound to failure. It's a simple fact.Here are some statistics and facts to throw around when you e-mail Fingerhut and Strickland telling them to make CSU into a satellite campus for UA:

The University of Akron is the public research university for Northern Ohio. It is the only public university in Ohio with a science and engineering program ranked in the top five nationally by U.S. News & World Report.UA offers more than 200 undergraduate degrees and over 100 postgraduate degrees.The university has the second-highest increase in enrollment among public universities statewide, according to figures released so far by individual schools with a 4.9 percent increase, that is double that of many colleges in the state university system.At UA, the main campus in downtown Akron and the Wayne College branch in Orrville reported 5.8 percent growth in incoming freshmen and 5 percent in graduate students, bringing total enrollment to 24,704.

Now compare that to CSU:

Four universities faltered in boosting enrollment, a state initiative as officials try to build the number of residents with college degrees. Bowling Green State University showed a decline of 2.5 percent, Cleveland State stayed just about even, Miami University grew a quarter of 1 percent and Can't State grew 1 percent.Cleveland State's total enrollment is at or near 10,000 which is less than half of UA.CSU offers 70 undergraduate degrees and 37 post-graduate degrees.

We can't let Clevelanders take UA away and try to control this NEOUCOM thing, as they inevitably will attempt to do.

[zipsbandman]

Unless CSU is going to be a glorified branch campus and Louis Proenza is the leader this is a horrible idea. We are miles and miles ahead of cleveland state, and making students drive all the way for cleveland for classes does not make sense. I suppose they can integrate NEOCOM into CSU's campus, but then what? I do not want them to take away what we have worked hard to build over here.

[GoZips]

By the grace of God these nincompoops (Strickland and Fingerhut) will be long out ofoffice before any of these inane ideas become reality..

[zen]

I think someone in cleveland has convinced these state politicians that the cleveland medical corridor (er whatever it is) with Case Western and the Cleveland Clinic needs NEOUCOM. I always thought NEOUCOM was independant of any particular university, so I don't see why the University of Akron needs to get raped by this whole thing. Something just doesn't seem straight at all about this whole thing! Why here?Why aren't they merging Toledo and BGSU? Aren't they even closer to each other? Why not (god forbid) Akron and Can't???None of this makes sense. I smell serious stink.

[ziptrumpet87]

NEOUCOM is a joint effort between UA, Can't State and YSU. I don't see them moving anytime soon. (My wife is a physician who went to NEOUCOM).

[zen]

NEOUCOM is a joint effort between UA, Can't State and YSU.

Well see! That's efficiency right there for ya! Three univerisities pooling their resources. CSU should join in the effort with UA, Can't, and YSU and the problem is solved.But nooooo.... They are "better" than Akron, Can't and Youngstown because they are cleveland and they have media. So, why not just steal NEOUCOM? *cough* Cleveland stealing it would make thinks LESS efficient administratively, but that's okay, because politicians regularly promote their plans with the exact opposite argument than what the result will be. In the private sector, it's called "lying"

[Zipmeister]

glad this didn't happen while I was a student cause I 'm pretty sure I would have had 10 minutes to walk the 35 miles between my classrooms.

[redbarn26]

NEOUCOM is a collaboration between Akron, K.S.U., and YSU, but the new Pharmacy program which was recently started, is a collaboration between those three universities, AND Cleveland State, so they do have some claim to it, just not as much as the other three schools. There has also been talk in the past, and i dont know if it continues, but of Can't State and YSU giving up their interests and it becoming solely Akron's, but I doubt that would ever happen.

[bobbyake]

Let's look at the positives and the negatives.Positives:• It's going to save both universities money. • CSU and Akron's athletics would merge.• Both campuses can specialize at certain programs. Akron should be business, science, law, and engineering. CSU should be focused on medical programs like nursing, pharmaceuticals, and a med school.• Powerhouse school will be created that can compete with Columbus for power and prestige.• All the OSU fans in the area will complain about the new Northeastern Ohio school is taking away their media coverage outside of Columbus.• The Akron Beacon Journal will have to relocate all of there reporters back to Akron from Columbus.Negatives:• Republicans will have to admit that the Democrats did something positive for the area. (I'm a moderate so I can live with this).• Students that want to focus in certain programs might have to drive to Cleveland or Akron for SENIOR and JUNIOR classes (Wayne offers almost every freshman and sophomore class, even in accounting).I like the idea. From what I heard, Cleveland State will offer most of the same classes but will have new programs that Akron doesn't offer. Does anyone on this board know how prestigious Northwestern is??? I think this merger could create something like that. It could be called "Midwestern" or something like that.

[bobbyake]

I know people on this board have expressed complaints about this merger, but I'm willing to bet most of the problems with the merger will be worked out. Doesn't Michigan and Indiana have 3 big campuses across their state???

[zen]

Let's look at the positives and the negatives.Positives:• It's going to save both universities money. • CSU and Akron's athletics would merge.• Both campuses can specialize at certain programs. Akron should be business, science, law, and engineering. CSU should be focused on medical programs like nursing, pharmaceuticals, and a med school.• Powerhouse school will be created that can compete with Columbus for power and prestige.• All the OSU fans in the area will complain about the new Northeastern Ohio school is taking away their media coverage outside of Columbus.• The Akron Beacon Journal will have to relocate all of there reporters back to Akron from Columbus.Negatives:• Republicans will have to admit that the Democrats did something positive for the area. (I'm a moderate so I can live with this).• Students that want to focus in certain programs might have to drive to Cleveland or Akron for SENIOR and JUNIOR classes (Wayne offers almost every freshman and sophomore class, even in accounting).I like the idea. From what I heard, Cleveland State will offer most of the same classes but will have new programs that Akron doesn't offer. Does anyone on this board know how prestigious Northwestern is??? I think this merger could create something like that. It could be called "Midwestern" or something like that.

wow, all that? and again, I ask, why akron and csu? Why does Can't get left out?why not BGSU and toledo? Dayton and cincy?It's just odd.What do you call this place? Why do I have a feeling it's going to be CSU and CSU akron campus? Share athletic programs you say? So, what? Football in Akron and Basketball in Cleveland? Or, split venues in every sport?It just doesn't make any sense!

[Zipmeister]

B...ake,Business would go to Cleveland since they have a Doctoral program and UA does not. There already is a Midwestern State in Tx. but keep up the good work.

[bobbyake]

Zen, I understand the concerns you have over this merger. I share the same concerns.CSU is half of Akron in geographic size so it's hard for me to believe they're on a coup to take over everything, especially with Akron having over 7,000 more students and more money. Did you hear the news about Akron getting a record amount of money from gifts this year? Akron has too much power to become a branch of CSU. If the merger was to happen, there is the possibility of a name change for the combined schools. I highly doubt the new university will be named after either city, I don't see this happening because there's too much conflicting interest there.There's a lot of things that will have to be worked out of this merger is to happen. That's why we know so little right now.

[bobbyake]

B...ake,Business would go to Cleveland since they have a Doctoral program and UA does not. There already is a Midwestern State in Tx. but keep up the good work.

I don't know if that would happen. Akron just created a new Finance lab in the CBA and already has the new Marketing floor in Polsky.

[Quickzips]

bobby I can't really say I agree with many of your positives.Yeah, it is going to save both universities some money, but where does that savings come from. It comes from cutting administrative employees. Aren't we trying to CREATE good jobs instead of taking them away from the economy???I can't see where merging sports programs is a good thing, especially for us. At this point we are running circles around CSU in just about every shared program. The only program that MIGHT see a benefit for the two schools would be basketball where CSU and Akron both have a decent history and some momentum going, but you risk quashing all of that when you take away the two teams history. CSU doesn't even have a football program. Our soccer program would run circles around them every day of the week. Their swimming program is pretty far ahead of us. I don't even know what else they have, but I can hardly see this being a benefit.The idea of combining programs is just insane when you're talking about two campuses that focus on serving the surrounding community. If CSU is trying to serve people from Cleveland and the surrounding suburbs (almost exclusively) and Akron is serving people from Akron and the suburbs (not quite as exclusively anymore, but still) then both of those campuses need to have curriculum choices that are vast enough to serve the needs of the local citizens. Taking away some of those programs only serves to hurt both universities. If the goal here is to have more Ohio citizens with a college degree you aren't going to achieve that by discouraging people from going to school by taking programs that they may be interested in away and moving them 45 miles to the North or South depending on where you live.As far as the Columbus/OSU points. I'm sorry, but this is not going to draw any attention away from OSU. To think it will is just dilluting yourself. All the Columbus/OSU folks are just going to roll their eyes and turn up their noses at us. It will be a huge joke. I can here it now, "look at the two community colleges trying to think they are us." The bottom line is this is a bad idea for both Universities and both cities. Nothing about this makes any sense at all. It's all about NEUCOM and Cleveland's desire to add it to their supposed MedicalMart that is sadly going to be voted down by voters who can't see past a 1/2% sales tax increase and see the economic value to their own area.

[grice]

Why lose our Zips Nation, our identity, and our traditions? The University of Akron has came a long way and is really blossoming into to an excellent urban university. Let CSU merge with Ohio State, that would make for OSU Cleveland. Most of Cleveland loves the Buckeyes already so they'd be happy.

[zen]

It's all about NEUCOM and Cleveland's desire to add it to their supposed MedicalMart that is sadly going to be voted down by voters who can't see past a 1/2% sales tax increase and see the economic value to their own area.

That's the only thing that makes sense. You gotta think like politicians. They want to build cleveland up as a medical mecca, and NEOUCOM is a piece of their puzzle. It's like when politicians PROMISED when they passed the seatbelt law that no one would ever be pulled over and ticketed soley for seatbelt violations. They knew back then that it would change some day. They had to lie to squelch a public groundswell against it.They are making grand visions about this whole thing, but in reality, it's all about snatching resources for Cleveland. In fact, I bet it's not even about moving NEOUCOM as much as it is as eliminating it, in a way. Because, why can't CSU and Case Western Team up with the Cleveland Clinic to start their own medical programs. You know they'd be all over it except that there is already an established one in the region. So, instead of opening one in cleveland and finding political ways to put the hatched on NEOUCOM, they instead make it seem like it's "moving" and "merging". That's a facade. It's about eliminating the competition to something in Cleveland by "moving" the existing one.

[ZachTheZip]

Here's my hope, if this does come true:UA will become NEOUCOM Akron, and CSU will become NEOUCOM Cleveland. If there are multiple campuses, one absolutely has to be a main campus. There cannot be two main campuses. Since UA is much larger, it would be the main undergrad and main research campus while CSU would be the smaller, more graduate and doctoral focused branch, with the exception of Engineering, Law, and other areas where UA excels over CSU. Athletics will remain seperate, like the university systems of Wisconsin and California where they are all technically one major university with multiple branches.Any other way would be wrong and will doom UA to failure. Write to your state reps and to Strickland and to Fingerhut telling them about this. Ask for responses and post them here. If it's not something that we like, I'll attempt to rally the students and faculty and we'll have a good old fashioned campus protest (no national guardsmen allowed ). I'm sure it'll be easy to get people to join the cause if we tell them that they would have to drive to Cleveland just to go to a class that we used to have here.

[ziptrumpet87]

NEOUCOM is not going anywhere. They just built new facilities for one.

They are making grand visions about this whole thing, but in reality, it's all about snatching resources for Cleveland. In fact, I bet it's not even about moving NEOUCOM as much as it is as eliminating it, in a way. Because, why can't CSU and Case Western Team up with the Cleveland Clinic to start their own medical programs. You know they'd be all over it except that there is already an established one in the region. So, instead of opening one in cleveland and finding political ways to put the hatched on NEOUCOM, they instead make it seem like it's "moving" and "merging". That's a facade. It's about eliminating the competition to something in Cleveland by "moving" the existing one.

There are already two medical schools in Cleveland: Case and the new one at UH.

and again, I ask, why akron and csu? Why does Can't get left out?why not BGSU and toledo? Dayton and cincy?

Dayton is a private school, not a state school.

[ziptrumpet87]

Dr. P clears it up...Akron News Now report with audio