Zeke's Ceiling

[UAZip0510]

Discussion regarding Zeke is usually absent on this forum, but I think this is an interesting topic to throw out there...just how good is Zeke Marshall going to be? The opinions on Marshall exist to both extremes. Some people believe he will be dominant, even discussing the possibility of him leaving after next year for the NBA. Others (mostly outside of Akron) think he's overrated, and that he'll be a good, but not great college player.

Positives:

- High character player...great head on his shoulders

- 7'0" tall, which is obviously a huge advantage in MAC play

- Gained some decent weight this offseason

- Blocks a good amount of shots, and changes many others

- Has developed a nice hook, and his ability to score has improved

Negatives:

- Still not big enough, gets pushed around a bit by bigger posts

- Gets into foul trouble quite a bit

- Doesn't rebound as much as you'd expect from a 7' center (4 RPG)

- Rumors exist that Zeke would prefer a normal career than life in the NBA (Not that there's anything wrong with that)

Obviously this is all speculation, but I'm interested to see what people think...

Who will Zeke's career most closely match?

1) Romeo Travis (Very good college player, nowhere near NBA-caliber)

2) Chris Kaman (Dominated MAC, left after junior year, good NBA player)

[The Hip Zip]

Too early to say for sure but I do know that Zeke needs to get mean out there. He's such a good guy, and I love that fact, but he needs to put that on hold when he puts on the uniform.

[Buckzip]

Discussion regarding Zeke is usually absent on this forum, but I think this is an interesting topic to throw out there...just how good is Zeke Marshall going to be? The opinions on Marshall exist to both extremes. Some people believe he will be dominant, even discussing the possibility of him leaving after next year for the NBA. Others (mostly outside of Akron) think he's overrated, and that he'll be a good, but not great college player.

Positives:

- High character player...great head on his shoulders

- 7'0" tall, which is obviously a huge advantage in MAC play

- Gained some decent weight this offseason

- Blocks a good amount of shots, and changes many others

- Has developed a nice hook, and his ability to score has improved

Negatives:

- Still not big enough, gets pushed around a bit by bigger posts

- Gets into foul trouble quite a bit

- Doesn't rebound as much as you'd expect from a 7' center (4 RPG)

- Rumors exist that Zeke would prefer a normal career than life in the NBA (Not that there's anything wrong with that)

Obviously this is all speculation, but I'm interested to see what people think...

Who will Zeke's career most closely match?

1) Romeo Travis (Very good college player, nowhere near NBA-caliber)

2) Chris Kaman (Dominated MAC, left after junior year, good NBA player)

He has shown he can blcok shots. That's it. He has a long way to go still. usually guys that are rated that high come in their freshman year as stars. This is his sophomeore year and he still hasn't shown anything.

[Dave in Green]

We've been through a lot of this before, but here's a quick refresher: Zeke was not interested in playing basketball as a kid, and started playing late. He's a classic late bloomer. Then he had a big growth spurt and quickly shot up to 7 feet, which required time for adjustment. He's as much a computer nerd as he is a basketball player. His whole life does not revolve around becoming a professional basketball player, so the sense of urgency isn't there as it is with kids who have no earning power beyond their physical abilities.

Zeke has some traits that might take him to the NBA if fully developed. But it's also possible that he may not ever fully develop, or even if he did that he wouldn't quite have enough ability to make it in the NBA. A lot depends on how much physical potential he actually has, how badly he wants to become a truly superior player, and how much work and dedication he puts into it.

His shot blocking has been his primary strength from high school on. This year he has shown that he has developed a nice hook shot that is good for a better than 50% shooting average. His free throw shooting has also improved. So has his ability to catch a pass inside and kick it back out to the open man.

On the downside, Zeke has not shown the ability to reliably hit shots other than the hook. He also has not shown the fire and determination to go after rebounds that make for a great rebounder. He's good but not great in his whole defensive game. He's not built to play hard and physical against stronger, beefier opponents, and not there yet on compensating for that with a polished finesse game.

We can only guess at this point how far Zeke might develop. The good news is that he is continuing to develop. He hasn't flat-lined or given up. You can still see his frustration when he doesn't perform as well as he'd like to. Just as there are examples of early bloomers who go directly from their freshman year of college into the NBA, so there are examples of late bloomers who have steadily developed throughout their college careers to where they have developed a full game by their senior years.

Zeke is obviously not one of the former, but he still has the potential to be one of the latter. His biggest physical attribute is also a curse in a way, because those of average stature tend to automatically assume that 7-footers should all be superstars in basketball. That's not true of all 7-footers, and in the long run it may or may not be true of Zeke.

[Magnus]

We've been through a lot of this before, but here's a quick refresher: Zeke was not interested in playing basketball as a kid, and started playing late. He's a classic late bloomer. Then he had a big growth spurt and quickly shot up to 7 feet, which required time for adjustment. He's as much a computer nerd as he is a basketball player. His whole life does not revolve around becoming a professional basketball player, so the sense of urgency isn't there as it is with kids who have no earning power beyond their physical abilities.

Zeke has some traits that might take him to the NBA if fully developed. But it's also possible that he may not ever fully develop, or even if he did that he wouldn't quite have enough ability to make it in the NBA. A lot depends on how much physical potential he actually has, how badly he wants to become a truly superior player, and how much work and dedication he puts into it.

His shot blocking has been his primary strength from high school on. This year he has shown that he has developed a nice hook shot that is good for a better than 50% shooting average. His free throw shooting has also improved. So has his ability to catch a pass inside and kick it back out to the open man.

On the downside, Zeke has not shown the ability to reliably hit shots other than the hook. He also has not shown the fire and determination to go after rebounds that make for a great rebounder. He's good but not great in his whole defensive game. He's not built to play hard and physical against stronger, beefier opponents, and not there yet on compensating for that with a polished finesse game.

We can only guess at this point how far Zeke might develop. The good news is that he is continuing to develop. He hasn't flat-lined or given up. You can still see his frustration when he doesn't perform as well as he'd like to. Just as there are examples of early bloomers who go directly from their freshman year of college into the NBA, so there are examples of late bloomers who have steadily developed throughout their college careers to where they have developed a full game by their senior years.

Zeke is obviously not one of the former, but he still has the potential to be one of the latter. His biggest physical attribute is also a curse in a way, because those of average stature tend to automatically assume that 7-footers should all be superstars in basketball. That's not true of all 7-footers, and in the long run it may or may not be true of Zeke.

This tells us about Zeke's ceiling.

[OZoner]

This tells us about Zeke's ceiling.

What, that he can't outrun a 6'2" guard? Cole didn't even dunk through him; Zeke was behind Cole. Even if he did, so what? Any big man who has ever played basketball has been dunked on.

[Dave in Green]

I agree that the video tells a lot about Zeke's ceiling. You won't often see a 7-foot center run the full length of the floor, almost catch up to a speedy guard on a breakaway, and almost block the shot from behind. What it shows is that Zeke already has the physical ability to do something most 7-footers can't. As he becomes more experienced and polished, he'll make plays that most 7-footers can't, because 7-footers can't "learn" that kind of foot speed. They either have it or they don't. Zeke has it.

[Captain Kangaroo]

NBA All-Star and Former CMU Chipp Chris Kaman's College Stats

Sophomore season -- 11.8ppg / 8rpg

Former K.e.n.t. Center and NBA Player John Edwards College Stats

Fr.: 2.0ppg / 1.7rpg

So.: 3.5ppg / 2.1rpg

Jr.: 7.2ppg / 3.4rpg

Sr. 13.2 ppg / 6.7rpg

7 games into Zeke's Sophomore season, I think he's doing fine. Statistically, he'll finish 2010-11 in the same neighborhood as Kaman's Sophomore season. And his development is way beyond Edwards'.

[Quickzips]

Zeke's ceiling is as high as Zeke wants it to be. He's got just about everything physically that the NBA looks for in big-men now days. He can run the floor, jump out of the gym, has long arms, is a true 7'0". About the only thing he doesn't have is enough bulk to play 30+ minutes per game night in and night out for 82 games in the NBA, but he's getting there. If he really wants it, and he continues to work hard he shouldn't have any problem with the physical end of the game

Where Zeke's problem lies is the mental and psychological part of the game and to a certain extent, fundamentals. For all the talk about how great he has been "catching a pass and hitting an open man outside" I haven't seen it. In fact, the first part of that equation, catching a pass, is probably one of his biggest weaknesses. Far too often we are watching Zeke work extremely hard to get in position underneath and the guards patiently waiting for him to get there only to dump the ball down to him and have it bounce off of his hands. I also have rarely seen him pass the ball out of the post to an open shooter. I don't know where this whole idea that he is a great passer out of the post came from, but as far as I am concerned it is a complete myth. Beyond that, the mental part of his game just isn't there a lot of times. He is getting more comfortable out there, but you can still see the wheels turning all the time. He doesn't play the game instinctively at all, even on the defensive end. He often allows himself to be taken out of the game by early foul trouble and when he does come back in he usually looks lost and out of sync. Maybe the most important of all, he is going to have to learn that good defense doesn't begin and end with blocking shots. All of these things are issues that Zeke is going to have to want to work on for him to reach his ceiling. If he wants it, he can absolutely be a dominant 25 point 10 board 5 block guy night in and night out for us by the time he leaves here. But at this point, he is a rollercoaster ride who shows glimpses of the brillance that could one day become and nights where he simply makes you want to pull your hair out.

[RootforRoo44]

I think most of you hit it right on the head, Zeke is doing fine. He's progressing nicely and with his speed, agility, and that nice hook he's developed, he's going to be something special pretty soon.

I will say that getting a bit meaner would do him some good.

[Captain Kangaroo]

Zeke's ceiling is as high as Zeke wants it to be. He's got just about everything physically that the NBA looks for in big-men now days. He can run the floor, jump out of the gym, has long arms, is a true 7'0". About the only thing he doesn't have is enough bulk to play 30+ minutes per game night in and night out for 82 games in the NBA, but he's getting there. If he really wants it, and he continues to work hard he shouldn't have any problem with the physical end of the game

Where Zeke's problem lies is the mental and psychological part of the game and to a certain extent, fundamentals. For all the talk about how great he has been "catching a pass and hitting an open man outside" I haven't seen it. In fact, the first part of that equation, catching a pass, is probably one of his biggest weaknesses. Far too often we are watching Zeke work extremely hard to get in position underneath and the guards patiently waiting for him to get there only to dump the ball down to him and have it bounce off of his hands. I also have rarely seen him pass the ball out of the post to an open shooter. I don't know where this whole idea that he is a great passer out of the post came from, but as far as I am concerned it is a complete myth. Beyond that, the mental part of his game just isn't there a lot of times. He is getting more comfortable out there, but you can still see the wheels turning all the time. He doesn't play the game instinctively at all, even on the defensive end. He often allows himself to be taken out of the game by early foul trouble and when he does come back in he usually looks lost and out of sync. Maybe the most important of all, he is going to have to learn that good defense doesn't begin and end with blocking shots. All of these things are issues that Zeke is going to have to want to work on for him to reach his ceiling. If he wants it, he can absolutely be a dominant 25 point 10 board 5 block guy night in and night out for us by the time he leaves here. But at this point, he is a rollercoaster ride who shows glimpses of the brillance that could one day become and nights where he simply makes you want to pull your hair out.

Big men develop slowly. They always have, and always will. From what I've seen of Zeke this season, he's WAY ahead of where he was last season. And I expect his progression will be similar when comparing 2010-11 to 2011-12.

I posted on Kaman and Edwards, since those are the most appropriate comparisons. The same can be done for 96% of the collegiate 7-footers out there.

[Dave in Green]

I don't know where the whole idea of Zeke being a great passer out of the post came from, either, because I don't recall having seen it expressed on ZN.O. What I have seen expressed is that Zeke is basically an unselfish player who prefers to pass to an open teammate rather than taking a shot himself. I've also seen it expressed that he has improved over last season in terms of establishing position, cleanly catching the pass and reliably hitting the open man, but still has a ways to go to be considered really proficient at it. So I think just about everyone probably agrees that, so far, Zeke has not reached the point of being considered a great passer out of the post.

[Quickzips]

I don't know where the whole idea of Zeke being a great passer out of the post came from, either, because I don't recall having seen it expressed on ZN.O. What I have seen expressed is that Zeke is basically an unselfish player who prefers to pass to an open teammate rather than taking a shot himself. I've also seen it expressed that he has improved over last season in terms of establishing position, cleanly catching the pass and reliably hitting the open man, but still has a ways to go to be considered really proficient at it. So I think just about everyone probably agrees that, so far, Zeke has not reached the point of being considered a great passer out of the post.

Like many other things about Zeke, it all comes down to potential.

[Captain Kangaroo]

I don't know where the whole idea of Zeke being a great passer out of the post came from, either, because I don't recall having seen it expressed on ZN.O. What I have seen expressed is that Zeke is basically an unselfish player who prefers to pass to an open teammate rather than taking a shot himself. I've also seen it expressed that he has improved over last season in terms of establishing position, cleanly catching the pass and reliably hitting the open man, but still has a ways to go to be considered really proficient at it. So I think just about everyone probably agrees that, so far, Zeke has not reached the point of being considered a great passer out of the post.

Like many other things about Zeke, it all comes down to potential.

No different than any other player with 1.3 years of college ball under their belt.

[RACER]

once we get into mac play he should be able to have some big games.there are no great big men in the mac.our best

post player was j.wood,and he was only 6-6.no reason he can't double figures in rebounds,and block alott of shots in mac play.i have no idea if he will get the ball enough to score double figures.i am not sure what kd plan is for him on offense.