zen Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Looks like he is holding on to the ball too long here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Z Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Dr. Z...if we are thinking of the same play, Shaffer got pushed to his back with such ease that it looked like he was standing on a street, and a truck ran him over.Found it.Here is a blow by blow of the first three sacks:Sack #1: On a simple four-man rush with no trickery right tackle Kevin Shaffer was simply blown back into Frye by Aaron Smith for the sack. The sack occurred 2.97 seconds after the snap, so it's borderline, but this one is more about the offensive line than Frye.Sack #2: This was a little more difficult of a disguised blitz for the line to pick up. The Steelers rushed two linemen while bringing three linebackers in a well-designed dime defense on third and 12. But again it's less about trickery than a man being beaten head-to-head. Linebacker James Farrior simply bull rushed left tackle Joe Thomas back to Frye. Shaffer was also being beaten on a speed rush by LaMarr Woodley on the other edge which forced Frye to step up into Farrior. The sack came 2.75 seconds after the snap so it again seems to be more of a line problem than Frye.Sack #3: There's no way to blame Frye for this sack. Just 1.5 seconds after he took the snap, and as he set to throw on a three-step drop, Frye was hit and sacked by Clark Haggans coming off his blind side. The Steelers sent Haggans and two defensive backs on a blitz from the left side. With no one in the backfield for blitz pickup there simply was too many rushers and not enough blockers.Does anybody in the Cleveland media have the balls to dispute the Browns front office with this? My guess...no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Dr. Z.....I think it was right after that 3rd sack that the fans started yelling "Brady...Brady...Brady".Please tell me not all Browns fans are that ignorant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zen Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Dr. Z.....I think it was right after that 3rd sack that the fans started yelling "Brady...Brady...Brady".Please tell me not all Browns fans are that ignorant. Brady could actually be a good QB in the NFL. I got nothing against him.... but on this team (browns).... in this state..... if he looks good right away, then maybe he IS jesus.I used to think that browns fans were knowledgeable football fans.It became obviously they are pretty lame when we got the team back they are so desperate to cling to something that they don't think straight. They would chant for Shirley Temple to go into the game and replace Joe Montana if he got sacked 3 times and threw an INT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyZip Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 A conspiracy is far-fetched at best. This is a blessing for Charlie. If he has the the ability that a lot of THINK he has, being in Seattle with Coach Holmgren is probably the best place for him to go. I love the Browns, but this franchise is going nowhere, and frankly I believe no one knows how to fix it. So here, perhaps, is my next NFL purchase... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Is it available yet? I've always liked those colors. And that jersey will forever signify Charlie Frye being given the greatest gift of his life, whether he realizes it now or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyZip Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Is it available yet? I've always liked those colors. And that jersey will forever signify Charlie Frye being given the greatest gift of his life, whether he realizes it now or not. You can personalize at NFLshop.com I doubt it will be available for purchase until Charlie is the starter. Unfortunately, the personalized one is $99.99 plus shipping. Oh, but you do get a free NFLShop kickoff mug! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-P Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Be the first kid on your block........Just bought mine but I had to get white.........that's fine, I want it in time to wear it to the first home game (UA) and down to the stadium (if I ever get the hell out of Asia :-) )BTW......do we have any home games this season??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgm405 Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 A conspiracy theory against Charlie? The team in on it? Everyone but Charlie making mistakes?Wow...just wow. Frye supporters have reached a new low here. He was replaced because...drumroll please...HE WASN'T GOOD ENOUGH!Romeo Crennel is fighting for his job...you really think if he thought Frye was good enough to lead them to the playoffs that he'd let him go????Phil Savage is on the seat seat as well...if he felt Frye was good enough, would he have let him go? And the players not playing for Charlie? Give me a damn break...it's the NFL, and those players take pride in what they do. They don't tank games in the National freakin Football League and you all know that just as much as I do. I mean, seriously guys...whbat will it take for you to admit Charlie didn't do the job? Does he have to turn around and throw it through the goalposts? Does he have to crap his pants in the huddle? Even then, you guys would probably blame it on the wind, or the team cook, or anyone else not named Charlie Frye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zipgrad1990 Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 From the Livingston article - "...as was the loss Sunday, although Frye dug the hole. "How did Frye dig the hole? Sure his interception led to a FG and you can argue that his inability to move the offense led to the rest of the scoring. But I still don't see how you can place it all on Frye's shoulders. He is not on special teams and defense after all. Plus he didn't pass on every play, they did run the ball too.I don't think the Frye situation was a consipiracy. I just feel he is a qb that needed lots of time as a backup with good coaching to reach his potential. I don't know if his potential will be as an NFL starter, but he should be able to hang on as a backup somewhere.BTW - One of my coworkers is a Brown's fan and he said a fight broke out near him with someone wearing a Frye jersey and another Brown's fan. So I don't know if it would be wise to go to the Seattle game wearing a Frye jersey. Of course maybe by then BQ should be playing and the Brown's fans will have forgotten all about CF.I do hope Seattle crushes the Browns and they allow CF to get in for some mop up time though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
you am i Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 sgm, i think some of the "conspiracy" postings are intended as tongue-in-cheek and not to be taken seriously.my gripe with the browns is not what they did to charlie, but HOW they did it. if they decided that he's not the guy, so be it. but to name him as starter and then pull the rug out from under him was really bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgm405 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 sgm, i think some of the "conspiracy" postings are intended as tongue-in-cheek and not to be taken seriously.my gripe with the browns is not what they did to charlie, but HOW they did it. if they decided that he's not the guy, so be it. but to name him as starter and then pull the rug out from under him was really bad. I do agree with that...they should've named DA the starter if they knew Charlie wasn't going to last.But I also do think he had more than enough opportunities to claim the job, and failed time and time again.As for the tongue-in-cheek, hey, ya never know...a lot of these people were the same ones who didn't think Frye played horribly last Sunday... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 sgm...first of all, he DID claim the job. He's been the starter since the middle of the 2005 season. Where have you been?You'll start to see the light when you realize that Charlie Frye is not the reason why the Browns are a horrible football team. What's with this "if Romeo and Savage thought Charlie could take them to the playoffs, he'd still be here"?? This is not a good enough TEAM to go to the playoffs, and when a coaching staff and GM are in DESPERATION MODE to try to keep their jobs, they need someone else to blame.And I'm sure I don't need to ask if you are getting this yet, because I'm sure you'll surface again with yet another "Frye stinks" argument.I think you keep forgetting that many of us are lifetime Browns fans. So, to accuse us of this undying support of Charlie Frye at the expense of the Cleveland Browns is ridiculous. We want the Browns to win. The only thing we know for sure is that this team is not very good. Will it get better? We don't know, but they need a serious overhaul. Will Charlie ever be a star in the NFL? We don't know that either. Will Brady Quinn be a star? Again, we don't know. But I do know one thing that will be comforting to me now that Charlie is in Seattle...As the Browns continue through this season as one of the NFL's worst teams, I won't have to come on this board and see anyone blaming it on Charlie Frye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoZips Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 You guys are stuck in Clowns town. Try listening to nationwide radio and TV reports.Consider this: Seattle had their choice of Charlie OR Ken Dorsey. They chose Frye.In Wednesday's afternoon practice Charlie threw two interceptions. He also threw a"long, long" touchdown pass. This on six hours sleep and a three hour time change.Mike Holgren and crew admit that they have been tracking Charlie since the 2005draft. Seattle had Charlie penciled in as their next pick when the Clowns took him.Seattle considers that they "stole" (their words) Charlie from the Clowns.That ugly dark grey overcast hanging over Charlie the past two years has parted toreveal great rays of golden sunshine.I think we will look pretty spiffy in a number five SeaHawks jersey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zippysgotagun Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 From what I understand, the process was very hurried (gone so soon after being named starter) because Seattle was going to sign Dorsey. Cleveland had to sign him and trade Charlie quick so Seattle couldn't have him.A sad state when you have to block a team from picking up Ken Dorsey (IMO). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgm405 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 sgm...first of all, he DID claim the job. He's been the starter since the middle of the 2005 season. Where have you been?You'll start to see the light when you realize that Charlie Frye is not the reason why the Browns are a horrible football team. What's with this "if Romeo and Savage thought Charlie could take them to the playoffs, he'd still be here"?? This is not a good enough TEAM to go to the playoffs, and when a coaching staff and GM are in DESPERATION MODE to try to keep their jobs, they need someone else to blame.And I'm sure I don't need to ask if you are getting this yet, because I'm sure you'll surface again with yet another "Frye stinks" argument.I think you keep forgetting that many of us are lifetime Browns fans. So, to accuse us of this undying support of Charlie Frye at the expense of the Cleveland Browns is ridiculous. We want the Browns to win. The only thing we know for sure is that this team is not very good. Will it get better? We don't know, but they need a serious overhaul. Will Charlie ever be a star in the NFL? We don't know that either. Will Brady Quinn be a star? Again, we don't know. But I do know one thing that will be comforting to me now that Charlie is in Seattle...As the Browns continue through this season as one of the NFL's worst teams, I won't have to come on this board and see anyone blaming it on Charlie Frye. 1) I don't feel Charlie ever "claimed" the starting job...it was given to him. Can you honestly say he ever looked really good out there? He was starter by default - lucky that the Browns had nobody else. 2) I never said the Browns team was good enough to make the playoffs...I was speaking in terms of the long-term plan, and if Frye could be the one to lead them back.3) I don't need a Frye stinks argument...simply go look at his statistics. They say enough about his performance in the NFL 4) There were a few people, like the one I quoted, saying they were jumping ship on the Browns and becoming Steelers fans because of the trade. I'd certainly like to think that these idiots are indeed in the minority, as you say. 5) I totally agree that we don't know what the future holds for the Browns...but if you want the best for Charlie, him going to a team with a stud QB already in place isn't going to help. Sure, if Hasselbeck gets hurt he'll get in...but you're also talking about a guy who's only missed 9 starts in 9 years...a guy that is only 31 years old...and a guy who is head and shoulders above Frye. If him collecting a paycheck and never playing is what you want, the Seahawks are perfect for him. It's the perfect situation for Frye fans...he'll never play, so they can always say he'd produce if given the chance...and if he does play and doesn't perform, they can blame the Browns for "ruining him"...it will simply never be Charlie Frye's fault that Charlie Frye isn't a starter in the NFL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgm405 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindeale...2260.xml&coll=2Good article Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zen Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindeale...2260.xml&coll=2Good article sgm, this one could take years to pan out, and I really sorta wish there was a fast forward button or powers of forshadowment, but I really think you're going to eat it on your extremely low opinion of Charlie Frye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgm405 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindeale...2260.xml&coll=2Good article sgm, this one could take years to pan out, and I really sorta wish there was a fast forward button or powers of forshadowment, but I really think you're going to eat it on your extremely low opinion of Charlie Frye Hey, maybe I will...but I honestly don't think Frye will ever play regularly in the NFL again. He'll certainly never be a team's #1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindeale...2260.xml&coll=2Good article sgm, this one could take years to pan out, and I really sorta wish there was a fast forward button or powers of forshadowment, but I really think you're going to eat it on your extremely low opinion of Charlie Frye You don't have to look forward to see how Frye is going to do, past history tells us how people behave. I've had a low opinion of Frye's ability since his senior year at Akron and rather frequently stated it on this board. Most of the time I was alone on my island of reality and was killed by the members all along. Guess who is getting the last laugh? No hard feelings.You won't have to eat anything sgm405. Frye just doesn't win games or even make players around him better. Sports are really that simple regardless of what the talking heads on networks like ESPN go on and on for hours about. His performance Sunday was an absolutely horrid display of NFL quarterbacking. One would have thought I wrote that article for Livingston in the PD this week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 sgm...it's just the same repetitive and tiring argument, over and over again.Yes, we all know Charlies stats: One of the best QB ratings among current NFL starters in their first 16 games as an NFL starter. But, you've chosen to argue that for months now.But what you say in your most current post really takes the cake.Charlie has been Cleveland's starter by default??? Because we had nobody else that was better???Hmmm...can't we make that argument about every starting quarterback in the NFL?You're really reaching for anything you can at this point, aren't you? I just don't understand your obsession with finding anything you can think of to discredit this guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 GP1...your comments couldn't be further from the truth.History clearly shows that a QBs performance in their first 1-2 years in the league is NO INDICATION of how they will perform during the remainder of their career.But, since you and sgm are ready to can quarterbacks during their first couple of years in the league, we all would have missed seeing many, many great quarterbacks perform in this league over the years.Both of you continue to miss the argument that most of us are making, and that is that there is no way for us to tell how a guy like Charlie, or any other young QB, will develop during the course of their career. All we know is that Charlie's QB Rating gives an indication that he is on-track, or ahead of, where most future starters were at this point in their career. What hapens from here on out is yet to be seen.Like I've said before, maybe both of you should pursue some high-paying front office jobs in the NFL instead of post your analysis here. Because, every team in the NFL could use someone who can foresee future success or failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UADavid Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindeale...2260.xml&coll=2Good article Aside from piling on Charlie Frye and defending the honor of ohio st. whenever they're mentioned, have you ever written anything positive about the zips? I ask because I really haven't seen you post anything other than rants about osu and Charlie. He's no longer with the team and you still feel a need to pile on. What could be the reason for your need to discuss him? Are you also from Willard? Did Charlie beat you out for hall monitor in the fifth grade? Did "your girl" ask him to the Spring Fling dance as a junior? Are you just jealous of him? You spend all your time and energy on this forum hating on a guy we all know you think is worse than awful. Why not give all of ZipsNation a rest and give up half of your hobbies and just defend ohio st. from all enemies foreign and domestic. I know ZipsNation would appreciate it. :wave:ps. On sirius radio NFL last night they were discussing Seattle and they said Charlie was high on their draft board but needed time before playing. They say he had the potential to be a dominant QB in the NFL. Why not troll over to the Seattle forum and set them straight with your opinions, I mean, with your facts. I'm sure they will appreciate your enlightening positive posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 On sirius radio NFL last night they were discussing Seattle and they said Charlie was high on their draft board but needed time before playing. They say he had the potential to be a dominant QB in the NFL. "Potential" is a key word. "Dominant" is the other. They are just not telling the truth when they say dominant. It's too over the top.Dominant players don't come around very often. If they truely believed he would have been dominant, they would have drafted him in the first two rounds.A lot of guys have potential. Very few pan out. Frye is not panning out, but he still has NFL life left in him.Here is what Seattle should have said. "We believe Frye has the potential to be a solid back-up quarterback for this team. By adding him, we give stability to the position as we expand our offense to include Wallace in more of it." I think this is a more reasonable statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 GP1...change Seattle's comments to read however you want them to read. That's your choice. We can't stop you.Truth is, if any of us had the time, we could provide quite a long list of great NFL quarterbacks who looked awful when they were first in the league. For one, does the name Brett Favre ring a bell? Cut by the Atlanta Falcons after only a couple of years? We simply don't know. But since you do, I'm sure we'll find you in a very prominent position in an NFL front office someday.Good luck to you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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