Zipmeister Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 I saw more positive comments than negative in that thread. Well the credibility of your glass is half full attitude just took a big hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZipsFan Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Well the credibility of your glass is half full attitude just took a big hit. I guess I'll have to go back and count each comment. I'll get back to you Mr. Meister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xu9697 Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 I have to disagree with you on this. I know that at least two of our new recruits chose Akron specifically because of the Engineering program. And as much as we don't want to start Freshmen, every position is open on the team right now. If an incoming freshman is the best at his position - he's going to start. At least for now. Obviously, the plan is to build the team and continue to attract better and better players, and then have the luxury of red-shirting freshmen. But I would say for the next couple of years - almost all recruits will be told that they will have the opportunity to compete for a starting position immediately. I just can't see the Patriot league taking any player that Coach Bowden really wants. Feel free to disagree, but please understand that I wasn't speaking of just Akron. I was looking at the MAC as a whole (not hole...in this case). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZipsFan Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Well the credibility of your glass is half full attitude just took a big hit. Ok -- here is the breakdown of the comments in that thread: Pro-Akron - 5 Anti-Akron - 3 No real opinion - 3 (those were the "I remember getting into the Rubber Bowl with a can of creamed corn" or "I feel sorry for Akron" comments) So -- I stand by my original statement that there were more positive comments than negative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadszip Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Big East, or more like "Medium Everywhere" would be such a weird place for us: Legends: Akron Cincy Louisville Rutgers Navy Central FLA South FLA Leaders: San Diego St. Houston Boise SMU Memphis ????????? Best case scenario would have been if the Big East kept WVU, SYR, UConn and Pitt and added us, but it wasn't meant to be. As weird as this would be, I'd still take the "Medium Everywhere" scenario over Conference USA/MWC. Nothing sounds less alluring than the prospect of road trips to Marshall. Yuck. I don't see that as "Medium Everywhere" especially considering the MAC is "Bottom everywhere," despite what some computer calculations that have been thrown out here say. I do agree with your proposed Big East divisions. But at 14, I don't think Akron's included, even with a new arena. The Eastern or "Legends" division (like the crack on the Big Ten, btw) is either Temple or Villanova. No matter what Akron does, the BE doesn't pass on the No. 4 Philadelphia market. At 14 schools, the league would have to take another Western school, even if there are better eastern options, just to maintain geographic balance. But if it goes to 16, which is probably most realistic anyway, because when it becomes a non automatic-qualifying conference (as will the SEC, Big Ten, Big 12, Pac-12 and ACC), it will need to go after big markets to remain relevant (the No. 17 Cleveland market is the biggest one left without a direct school located in it). Even being a non AQ league, there is enough support for college football where, despite the overwhelming majority of "playoff" spots going to the leagues I put in parenthesis, if a league outside that can capture enough audience, and one of their teams is good enough, it can get in based off potential TV ratings. The only league that can do that is one that has inroads in the largest markets in America, which the Big East is setting itself up to do. Eliminating the non-AQ status actually hurts leagues like the MAC more than any other. Without any AQ standards, there is no way a regionalized MAC school is ever invited to the big party because the TV audience won't be there. And if you think TV is not going to play a big part in the future of college football, you're naive. Leagues like the MAC, Sun Belt and an even a more watered-down CUSA/Mountain West are better served dropping down to current FCS levels (though a watered-down CUSA/Mountain West is still a better option due to basketball). When AQ status is revoked, it gives the holdouts in the Big East even more incentive to stay at that top-tier, even if it means their champ only makes the final cut every three or so years, because not having having leagues with no shot at all like the MAC to compete with, gives the BE a bigger share of the college football market (even if it always remains a step behind the five big boys). Really, the way the landscape is changing, outside of complacency, there is no incentive for Akron to even think about remaining in the MAC. Plus, what rivalries does Akron truly have in the MAC? The school has been in the league for only 25 years, and even to this day, Akron is viewed as a red-headed stepchild in the league. The good-old boys don't respect Akron, even if the Zips were/are winning. Ok, we lose the Can't rivalry. Texas A&M gave up an even bigger rivalry to Texas; Missouri gave up an even bigger rival in Kansas; and Pitt and West Virginia both gave up a bigger rivalries, to improve the futures of their athletics programs. I think Akron would be able to do the same with Can't if it meant enhancing every other program the school offers. I'm not saying Akron to the Big East is a shoe-in, because it isn't. But a new arena puts us in the ballpark (for reasons I already posted). If it's even a possibility, the university has to whatever it can to make it happen, regardless of the future of the Big East. Somebody said the MAC is a cockroach, which is partially true, but the Big East is a NYC-sized cockroach, it isn't going away either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachTheZip Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Rumors of an Ohio school? Haven't heard of any from reliable sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZipsFan Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Rumors of an Ohio school? Haven't heard of any from reliable sources. No way Akron would even accept. I think we have bigger things in mind than the MWC/CUSA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 No way Akron would even accept. I think we have bigger things in mind than the MWC/CUSA. Why not? Boise did it with the MWC then the BE. TCU the same with the BE to the Big 12. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZipsFan Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Why not? Boise did it with the MWC then the BE. TCU the same with the BE to the Big 12. Big East Champ = automatice BCS Bowl game CUSA/MWC hybrid - at least from what I know - does not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Big East Champ = automatice BCS Bowl game CUSA/MWC hybrid - at least from what I know - does not I'm saying going to that conference for a year or two doesn't stop us from leaving it after a year or two. I realize I'm putting the cart before the horse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zipmeister Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Ok -- here is the breakdown of the comments in that thread: Pro-Akron - 5 Anti-Akron - 3 No real opinion - 3 (those were the "I remember getting into the Rubber Bowl with a can of creamed corn" or "I feel sorry for Akron" comments) So -- I stand by my original statement that there were more positive comments than negative. "No real opinion - 3 (those were the "I remember getting into the Rubber Bowl with a can of creamed corn" or "I feel sorry for Akron" comments)" I rest my case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZipsFan Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 "No real opinion - 3 (those were the "I remember getting into the Rubber Bowl with a can of creamed corn" or "I feel sorry for Akron" comments)" I rest my case. Those were "empathetic statements" - not "Akron Sucks!!". But wel'll just have to agree to disagree. Again . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctmjbowes@sbcglobal.net Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Big East=Pipe Dream, but would love to see it. MWC/C-USA=Less of a Pipe Dream, would love to see it. Any conference other than the MAC would be a wonderful thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottditzen Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Again I feel the need to stick up for MAC Madness B-ball...so fun!! But as far as FB goes, we can still keep the rivalry with K-ent I'm sure. In fact, being in different conferences may even make it more interesting I can't say I ever took much advantage of our close confines here in the MAC outside Ford Field and away games to Ohio U. I'd miss OU, if you can't have fun there you're in a coma. Would love to get out to W. Michigan someday (Bells Brewing!) but not too many MAC schools have that away game allure/atmosphere that makes you want to go through the trouble. I agree with everything Wadszip said btw. on Big East being our best bet. Big East=Pipe Dream, but would love to see it. MWC/C-USA=Less of a Pipe Dream, would love to see it. Any conference other than the MAC would be a wonderful thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 If we want the Cleveland market we should bring in Can't since they are located closer to Cleveland than Akron. At least Can't has a great basketball program to offer CUSA. This post made me angry edit: that was from the cusa thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zipgrad01 Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 This post made me angry edit: that was from the cusa thread Why get upset? The person is obviously an idiot on both of his comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zen Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Big East=Pipe Dream, but would love to see it. MWC/C-USA=Less of a Pipe Dream, would love to see it. Any conference other than the MAC would be a wonderful thing. Could we start beating the f'n spit out of MAC teams rather than vice versa first please?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zipgrad01 Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Rumors of an Ohio school? Haven't heard of any from reliable sources. Notice that it says "Ohio based", not Ohio school. The MAC is based in Cleveland. This could mean Temple, Buffalo, NIU, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zen Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Rumors of an Ohio school? Haven't heard of any from reliable sources. I have never in my 15+ years of bulletin board service/threaded forum/social networking experience read a series of posts more dripping of delusional faction propaganda... ever After reading all that nerdish sycophantic drivel, I want nothing to do with stopping to nipping at CUSA toes likes that. MAC or BigEast please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadszip Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 I have never in my 15+ years of bulletin board service/threaded forum/social networking experience read a series of posts more dripping of delusional faction propaganda... ever After reading all that nerdish sycophantic drivel, I want nothing to do with stopping to nipping at CUSA toes likes that. MAC or BigEast please. That thread was so full of fail, but it seems like 90 percent of the anti-Akron sentiment was from one obvious Ohio supporter and then a couple of Marshall fans. I actually tried to sign up and post, but it kept saying that the email address I've entered "is currently disallowed." I tried a yahoo and gmail account. Damn, if only I had I had a CompuServe account, I'd be golden. The funniest part to me though was the Ohio fan (Louis Kitton) make the argument that Akron can't be counted in the Cleveland market because "Akron is 50 miles away." Then a couple of post later, he says Ohio is in the Columbus market because "OU is 45 minutes away." Really? I mean all one has to do is bust out mapquest and see that Akron is 34 miles from Cleveland and Ohio is 75 miles from Columbus (and a good hour and a half away). Plus, thinking that any considerable amount of people in Central Ohio care about Ohio University is laughable, considering that is Ground Zero Ohio State country. And while the entire state (outside of maybe Cincinnati) is Ohio State country, at least Akron actually is located right in the middle of the No. 17 market. Since TV markets are going to be a driving force in realignment, and all these leagues know that whatever Ohio school they take is going to be No. 2 behind OSU. Akron is still way more viable than any other school (outside Can't since we share the Cleveland market) in that regard. Ohio University can pull together all the southeast Ohio counties together and it still doesn't have the population Summit County, alone, has. The actual CUSA people seem to like Toledo, and I don't blame them. Toledo has had a consistently good football program for the past 30-40 years, and the school has nice facilities. The No. 73 market isn't great (and will keep the Rockets from ever having a chance at anything higher than CUSA), but is livable for that league's purposes. I can actually see CUSA/Mountain West trying to go after Toledo and Akron (or Can't, but Can't's facilities put it at a big disadvantage compared to Akron). One last thing, I also found it hilarious the Louis Kitton guy acts like Ohio is now some sort of MAC power that no other MAC school (especially not Akron) will be able to catch, while saying Akron is the worst program in all of football, and the MAC would be better off with James Madison. Does he realize that, for apples to apples purposes, from 1992 (the year Akron joined the MAC in football) until 2005 (the year OU hired Solich), the Bobcats had exactly 2 winning seasons (both under Jim Grobe) and 5 seasons with 0-2 wins. In that same time span, Akron had 5 winning seasons and 3 seasons of two or less wins. Looking at that, is there any reason to think that if Akron, instead of Ohio, hired Frank Solich in 2005, the Zips wouldn't have had the same amount of success Ohio is having? If so, it defies logic. The only explanation as to why Ohio has built its way to being a solid program, while Akron has fallen back, was because Ohio hired the right coach and Akron hired the wrong one. Guess what? Akron now has its Frank Solich ... and Terry Bowden's credentials are arguably better than Solich's because while their W/L percentages are similar at the BCS conference level, Bowden did it in the SEC. Oh well, let the average message board fans keep thinking that Akron is a perpetual 1-win team ... something that pre-Ianello had only happened one other time in the Zips D1 history (and coincidentally the one win that year, 1994, came against Ohio). The people that matter know what Akron can bring to the table, especially now that not only do they have the right coach, but also a facility to match. Like I said before, Central Florida was 3-20 its final two years in the MAC in 2003 and 2004. With George O'Leary, they have won 3 CUSA Eastern Division titles and two outright CUSA titles since 2005. And I'd put Solich and Bowden ahead of O'Leary when it comes to coaching greatness. That's not to mention that we have Jim Tressel lurking behind the scenes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Why get upset? The person is obviously an idiot on both of his comments. idiots make me upset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyzip84 Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 And while the entire state (outside of maybe Cincinnati) is Ohio State country, at least Akron actually is located right in the middle of the No. 17 market. Since TV markets are going to be a driving force in realignment, and all these leagues know that whatever Ohio school they take is going to be No. 2 behind OSU. Akron is still way more viable than any other school (outside Can't since we share the Cleveland market) in that regard. The actual CUSA people seem to like Toledo, and I don't blame them. Toledo has had a consistently good football program for the past 30-40 years, and the school has nice facilities. The No. 73 market isn't great (and will keep the Rockets from ever having a chance at anything higher than CUSA), but is livable for that league's purposes. I can actually see CUSA/Mountain West trying to go after Toledo and Akron (or Can't, but Can't's facilities put it at a big disadvantage compared to Akron). I think it would be great if UA's leaders can convince prospective conferences of the Zips' rightful claim to the Cleveland TV market. But I'm not buying it. I think this assumption is nearly as absurd as Toledo claiming the Detroit TV market. Let's ask ourselves this question. Aside from UA alums, how many Clevelanders typically watch televised Zip sporting events? You might argue that this miniscule number will grow when UA differentiates itself from the Ohio-based MAC schools, but that's a leap at best IMO. When Buffalo joined the MAC, there was much complaining (especially from YSU fans). The TV market was a big factor, and in this case it's completely legit. Frankly, Buffalo shoudn't be ignored as a candidate for expansion because of this (and it's large endowment and respected academics). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 @johnnyzip84, your comparison of the Toledo-Detroit market to the Cleveland-Akron market is not a good one on several different levels. First, Akron is 20 miles closer to Cleveland than Toledo is to Detroit. Second, Toledo and Detroit are in different states. Third, Toledo has its own TV stations while Akron does not. All of the above leads to Cleveland-Akron being listed as one market in the official TV ranking of major metropolitan markets while Detroit and Toledo are separate. Bottom line is that if Toledo ends up in a bigger conference with opponents who are attractive enough for local TV to provide increased coverage, it will be smaller-market Toledo TV stations that do it, not bigger-market Detroit TV stations. Two separate markets from a TV perspective. On the other hand, if Akron ends up in a similar situation, it would be bigger-market Cleveland TV stations that would provide increased coverage. That's what prospective conferences would be looking at when adding new teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyzip84 Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 @johnnyzip84, your comparison of the Toledo-Detroit market to the Cleveland-Akron market is not a good one on several different levels. First, Akron is 20 miles closer to Cleveland than Toledo is to Detroit. Second, Toledo and Detroit are in different states. Third, Toledo has its own TV stations while Akron does not. All of the above leads to Cleveland-Akron being listed as one market in the official TV ranking of major metropolitan markets while Detroit and Toledo are separate. Bottom line is that if Toledo ends up in a bigger conference with opponents who are attractive enough for local TV to provide increased coverage, it will be smaller-market Toledo TV stations that do it, not bigger-market Detroit TV stations. Two separate markets from a TV perspective. On the other hand, if Akron ends up in a similar situation, it would be bigger-market Cleveland TV stations that would provide increased coverage. That's what prospective conferences would be looking at when adding new teams. I knew someone would jump on the Toledo comparison (I tried to defuse this with the NEARLY qualifier to no avail) and miss the main point. But, your 1st and 3rd points are undeniable. I don't think the different state argument is very strong though. Nevetheless, I'll take back the entire Toledo comment. Who here still thinks Clevelanders, in general, give a rat's a$$ about televised Zip sporting events? That's what I thought. The Zips are currently irrelevant to the Cleveland TV market. Hmmmmm I'd say they're NEARLY as irrelevant to the Cleveland market as the Rockets are to the Detroit market Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachTheZip Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 The reaction on the MAC board is mixed, at best. Still, there are rumblings out there beyond fan message boards. It's something to keep an eye on. If we do join, I would hope that Akron, along with ECU and a few other schools, lead the charge for an split that creates a true eastern conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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