Thoughts on Anderson/Frye now???

[zipdiehard]

Even the Charlie haters on this board can't be serious with some of the stuff they write. As a Browns fan I am glad to see the TEAM doing well. I emphasize this because while DA has done a decent job, it is the pieces around him that are making the real difference. How can any of us compare CF's 1 series to DA's 7 games? You "football experts" can't be stupid enough to not realize this is a completely different team and offensive coordinator than CF (or DA for that matter) ever had in front of him. Before we annoint DA as the second coming of Kelly Holcomb, let's see how things go the next two weeks when the Browns play two attacking defenses. As Browns fans, let's hope the line does a better job than they did the last Pittsburgh game. All this comparison talk is a joke, as neither CF or DA were going to be the QB next year anyway. They didn't give up next year's draft and all that cash to watch BQ carry either one of their clipboards. Both of these guys will be backups somewhere next season.

[Z-P]

From the #1 Superman-lover.........Derrick Anderson is a better thrower than Charlie Frey. Period. Charley Frey has better "people skills" and is a better "teammate" than Derrick Anderson. That is why the staff had grief moving him aside to slot DA #1. The players all knew this also, which is why there was probably an amount of disharmony in the ranks as all that preseason crap went down.Chud is a better OC than Mo. The O-line is better than it was last year..............and better with Tucker back in the mix than it was game one.My big problem with the Browns is that they did not trade him away following the draft, and jacked him around personally. Like every single one of us on the board, Charlie now has to make his way every single day by doing a good job at what he does.We'll all see what happens.As far as opinions go, we each have our own.....................and are entitled to it.Mine is this..............I think he'll fight his way back to a "shot" in some form..................be it an injury to a starter somewhere, or just a chance awarded by a coaching staff where he's once again had adequate time to show his innate leadership skills..............it probably will happen.............and at that time, I hope it's with a team which runs an O not requiring a cannon for an arm, and lets Charlie be Charlie by moving around and creating his opportunities.nm

[w00t]

How can any of us compare CF's 1 series to DA's 7 games?

You're right, when someone gets sacked as many times in one series as someone else does in eight games, there is very little need for comparison.

[zipdiehard]

You're right in that the line has done a much better job since game one.

[GP1]

Well I kind of think the people who bashed me and said I knew nothing about football (based on me saying I thought Anderson was better than Frye) were assholes themselves. And yes...I am posting just to say I was right. When you get bashed and attacked like I did for simply holding that opinion, and it comes out to be that you were not only right, but that the debate's result wasn't even close - sometimes it's good to say "I told you so".

sgm405,There isn't a single poster on this board who took more crap since Frye's senior season than the great GP1. You should try to be as gracious and magnanimous as the great GP1. Believe me, I knew then I was right and I know now I'm right. No need to rub it in.

You deserved the crap when discussing Frye's senior year or any other year for that matter. Just look how atrocius the The University of Akron's QB situation has become in three short years. On any scale, CF was infinitly better than what we have now.

One of those QBs played a great game when it mattered and won the MACC. It's not that Frye is a bad QB, he just isn't a winner and the numbers prove it.

[Dr Z]

DA has beat the Dolphins, the Bungles, the Ravens and the Rams. They might be the four worst teams in the league.His numbers will look good this year. His team may have the easiest schedule in the history of the NFL.The final six weeks, facing opponents with a combined record of 16-34. Point being, I don't take his stats very seriously.

[UA1987]

In addition to having a poor line (3 different centers, a tackle went nuts, ect...), and three offensive coordinators, the browns did not have edwards and winslow, most of the time, while Charlie was playing. Both Anderson and Frye struggled prior to this year due to numerous problems with the entire shit-streaks organization. They needed to unload a QB to cure the QB controversy when they picked up pretty boy and Frye got knifed in the back. They should have picked up a nose guard or some other need rather than quinn. Frye would be winning now too. Great organization... I hope they move again. Go Steelers!

[Zips Win!]

.. I hope they move again.

Me, too. Then we wouldn't have to worry about the NFL broadcast blackouts....

[Buckzip]

.. I hope they move again.

Me, too. Then we wouldn't have to worry about the NFL broadcast blackouts....

This thread is amazing. I have usually stayed out of the CF conversations, because I wasn't sure how he would do in the NFL.Plus, I liked him when he was at QB for UA. I felt confident in the offense with him at QB.However, it is hilarious how some posters are giving every excuse in the world why DA is doing so much better than CF did.Wow, after the first game of the year, everyone said how bad this team was and how the o-line sucked and they had no offensive weapons. Now people are saying that CF didn't have the same line and weapons that DA does. That is BS.Tucker is the only difference. Sorry, but he isn't Jonathan Ogden or Orlando Pace.One of the BIGGEST complaints about CF was that he held the ball too long and that resulted in many of the sacks.The CF lovers said it was the o-lines fault. Well, that has obviously proved to be wrong. I knew this thread would eventually come up and that the lovers would defend him to the world. I am still amazed at how blind some posters are.I know skippy boy will come here and bash me now, because that is all he can do. Also, since I am a grad of UA and another school, that makes me no fan of UA. I know this skippy, no need to reitterate your childish behavior.

[skip-zip]

Was this directed at me? What did I say that you categorize as "childish behavior"?You have a right to expess your opinion, just like everyone else. That's what this forum is for.

[Big Zip]

I'm a Browns season ticket holder and I'm glad DA is doing well. At the first game this season Charlie was holding the ball too long, but the offensive play calling changed significantly when DA got into the game. Also, the defense backed off because they were already up. This is not an excuse -- it is a fact I witnessed from my seat in the dog pound. I don't know if Charlie would have faired any better if he stayed in, but going down to Pittsburgh early wasn't all his fault. Pittsburgh's first drive was 22 yards after a Cleveland punt, the second was a field goal after a CF interception and the fourth was a one play 40 yard drive after a Jamal Lewis fumble. He was responsible for 3 points and took 100% of the blame for all 17.

[RowdyZip]

Maybe we can put this at rest after next sunday? If pittspuke jumps all over DA then we'll know...it's the advantage of an easier schedule. If not, maybe DA is a little better fit for this offense? I truly believe they are quite similar in overall ability. DA stronger arm, less mobility better decision making, Charlie more mobility, weaker arm and mediocre decision making. Wait till sunday.

[skip-zip]

You know, everyone has a right to their opinion. It just bothers me when people ignore facts, and just give their expert analysis, as if they are an NFL GM or something.Since Charlie is no longer in Cleveland, it's a mute point to try to compare how each of them would be doing now under similar circumstances. All we know is how they performed when they were both on the team, playing with the same players. Which makes us take a look at 2006.Some of you speak about how their arms compare, and I assume that in many of these cases you're referring to arm strength. Well, how about accuracy? In 2006, CF had more than a double-digit advantage in completion percentage. Anderson completed barely half of his passes, and not much has happened to change that dramatically. I believe he's still in the 50s. That's considered pretty poor for an NFL starting QB in terms of accuracy. Some of you have talked about winning. Well? Charlie won 4 games as Cleveland's starter in 2006. And Anderson? ZERO. Getting rid of the ball faster?? Come on folks, watch the tape of the Steelers game back in September, and you clearly see an offensive line getting steamrolled. No QB could have succeeded in that situation. Ask Anderson himself. He stunk for the other 3 quarters after Charlie came out. There's a reason why through 2 training camps, and an entire regular season, that Anderson was sitting the bench behind Frye. Ok, I'm done with this. Charlie is gone, and there's simply no way to compare how each of them would be performing now. But the Charlie bashers can feel free to speculate all they want.Go Browns!!

[sgm405]

A few random responses...- To whoever said Charlie is a better leader than DA, how do you know? Are you in the clubhouse? If you ask me, it seems like the players love DA...DA also doesn't get rattled at all, while Frye usually did (look at his 4th quarters numbers). - Lots of different excuses...Charlie didn't have an o-line, Charlie didn't have receivers, Charlie didn't have a running game, Charlie didn't have coaching, DA is playing easy teams, Charlie had the sun in his eyes, blah blah blah blah. I understand - he didn't have the late 80's Niners around him - but at what point does Charlie take ownership of some of the fault? Ever???- It's obvious that Charlie will never do wrong in the eyes of many on this board. Charlie could get the snap, crap his pants, and quick-kick the ball towards his own endzone and some of you would blame the split end for not getting open. - To me, this is the bottom line:CAREER STATS------------------------------------------------------------------PLAYER A - 13 GP (5-5 as Starter)- 83 RAT, 214-374, 57%, 2901 YDS, 223 YPG, 7.8 YPA, 22 TD, 17 INT, 16 Sacks, 5 Fumb.PLAYER B-21 GP (6-13 as Starter)- 71 RAT, 354-568, 62 %, 3490 YDS, 162 YPG, 6.1 YPA, 14 TD, 24 INT, 71 Sacks, 15 Fumb.Which player would you rather have? Obviously, A is DA, B is Frye. And if that's not enough, how about one being a Pro Bowl candidate and one not even being the #2 QB on his team? If that doesn't convince you enough, nothing ever will.

[zipdiehard]

The answer to your question is neither. Its funny that your "excuses" list has a lot to do with the sorry numbers for both. Too bad facts get in the way with some people. Going by this, the O line is no different this year than any previous year, the running game has been fantastic the last few years, and Edwards and Winslow haven't missed a game ever.

[sgm405]

The answer to your question is neither. Its funny that your "excuses" list has a lot to do with the sorry numbers for both. Too bad facts get in the way with some people. Going by this, the O line is no different this year than any previous year, the running game has been fantastic the last few years, and Edwards and Winslow haven't missed a game ever.

The point isn't that..the point is that Frye has a great deal of the past blame, which Frye-supporters refuse to admit. Oh, and Anderson's 2007 numbers are far from "sorry"

[skip-zip]

Thanks zipsdiehard....couldn't have said it better myself.sgm....Charlie is not here anymore to compare how they are playing under the same circumstances. It's over. He's gone, and he's not coming back. It's a mute point.When they were both here, Charlie was the starter, and Anderson sat the bench. There was a reason for that. The coaches consistently deemed one to be better than the other. I'm sure you probably think Jeff Garcia stinks too.

[sgm405]

Thanks zipsdiehard....couldn't have said it better myself.sgm....Charlie is not here anymore to compare how they are playing under the same circumstances. It's over. He's gone, and he's not coming back. It's a mute point.When they were both here, Charlie was the starter, and Anderson sat the bench. There was a reason for that. The coaches consistently deemed one to be better than the other. I'm sure you probably think Jeff Garcia stinks too.

1) Charlie is not here anymore BECAUSE the coaching staff deemed Anderson the better QB. Why else would they trade Frye away?2) Jeff Garcia doesn't stink at all...he didn't fit with the Browns' system...he, unlike Frye, was/is a proven NFL QB before and after his Cleveland tenure. 3) Derek Anderson is a pro-bowl candidate...Charlie Frye is inactive week after week, sitting at 3rd string behind a guy who's more of a receiver than a QB. What does that say about him?P.S. It's a "moot point", not a "mute point"...unless you were saying your point had no sound...

[Zip_ME87]

sgm405-You are entitled to your opinion, and I respect your opinion. But no matter how many statistics you quote, you are still only expressing an opinion. Nothing is as black and white, straightforward as you profess so many things to be. As you mature, you will see there is a lot more gray in the world than you ever realized.Charlie no longer plays for any of your teams. Let it rest.

[sgm405]

sgm405-You are entitled to your opinion, and I respect your opinion. But no matter how many statistics you quote, you are still only expressing an opinion. Nothing is as black and white, straightforward as you profess so many things to be. As you mature, you will see there is a lot more gray in the world than you ever realized.Charlie no longer plays for any of your teams. Let it rest.

As I mature? Thank you for the kind words, Grandpa. Look...we'll never know what Frye would've done this year. That I'll give you. But we what do know is that Frye had a chance to be the Browns starting QB and failed. He is now a 3rd string NFL QB. Derek Anderson got the same chance and has had great success. He's a Pro Bowl candidate. That's about as cut and dry as you get.

[ZipGrad93]

sgm405-You are entitled to your opinion, and I respect your opinion. But no matter how many statistics you quote, you are still only expressing an opinion. Nothing is as black and white, straightforward as you profess so many things to be. As you mature, you will see there is a lot more gray in the world than you ever realized.Charlie no longer plays for any of your teams. Let it rest.

As I mature? Thank you for the kind words, Grandpa. Look...we'll never know what Frye would've done this year. That I'll give you. But we what do know is that Frye had a chance to be the Browns starting QB and failed. He is now a 3rd string NFL QB. Derek Anderson got the same chance and has had great success. He's a Pro Bowl candidate. That's about as cut and dry as you get.

I don't care what Charlie has done or may ever do as a pro. All I know is that for four years I got to see a kid grow into a very good college quarterback - probably the best ever at Akron - while giving maximum effort on the field. He broke about 50 passing records at the University, and did with class and humility, while taking a beating from opposing defensive lineman. I'm proud that he was a Zip, and priveleged to watch him. I absolutely do not understand the mentality of those saying he isn't a "winner" or whatever. What were Akron's records when Jason Taylor was here? Was Taylor a "winner"? Why do some of you feel the need to tear Charlie down? He never did anything to harm the university in any way, and he did a great deal to progress our program to respectability in Division I. No, we're not there yet, but we're a lot closer than we were before Frye helped put Akron on the map, at least to some degree, with a win over ranked Marshall, and good offensive showings against some big-time teams. I wish him all the best in his future, and thank him for what he did while he was at Akron.ZipGrad93

[sgm405]

sgm405-You are entitled to your opinion, and I respect your opinion. But no matter how many statistics you quote, you are still only expressing an opinion. Nothing is as black and white, straightforward as you profess so many things to be. As you mature, you will see there is a lot more gray in the world than you ever realized.Charlie no longer plays for any of your teams. Let it rest.

As I mature? Thank you for the kind words, Grandpa. Look...we'll never know what Frye would've done this year. That I'll give you. But we what do know is that Frye had a chance to be the Browns starting QB and failed. He is now a 3rd string NFL QB. Derek Anderson got the same chance and has had great success. He's a Pro Bowl candidate. That's about as cut and dry as you get.

I don't care what Charlie has done or may ever do as a pro. All I know is that for four years I got to see a kid grow into a very good college quarterback - probably the best ever at Akron - while giving maximum effort on the field. He broke about 50 passing records at the University, and did with class and humility, while taking a beating from opposing defensive lineman. I'm proud that he was a Zip, and priveleged to watch him. I absolutely do not understand the mentality of those saying he isn't a "winner" or whatever. What were Akron's records when Jason Taylor was here? Was Taylor a "winner"? Why do some of you feel the need to tear Charlie down? He never did anything to harm the university in any way, and he did a great deal to progress our program to respectability in Division I. No, we're not there yet, but we're a lot closer than we were before Frye helped put Akron on the map, at least to some degree, with a win over ranked Marshall, and good offensive showings against some big-time teams. I wish him all the best in his future, and thank him for what he did while he was at Akron.ZipGrad93

Hey...I agree with just about everything you just said...I really do...but the question I debated was who was the better pro QB, DA or Frye. I agree Frye helped the Zips program...I just don't understand why that makes people think he's a good pro...that's all.

[zipdiehard]

Oh, and Anderson's 2007 numbers are far from "sorry"Sorry, I thought we were talking about careers, I didn't realize that DA was only a rookie and only played this year...my bad

[zen]

1) Charlie is not here anymore BECAUSE the coaching staff deemed Anderson the better QB. Why else would they trade Frye away?

Actually, I heard the night before the trade broke that they were shopping both guys and Charlie was getting the best offers.But that's okay. You think what you want to. Nothing I say will change what you want to believe. Charlie isn't playing right now for the browns, and nothing I can do will change that either.

[skip-zip]

zen...you're exactly right. The Browns were able to get more for Frye. But, sgm will probably say that it was because of Anderson's stellar performance in the last 3 quarters of the Steelers game. Again, there's nothing we can do now to compare the two QBs. All we have is 2006. Charlie is holding a clipboard in Seattle because he's learning the offense and developing in their system, something that would have benefitted him tremendously had he gone to a team like Seattle from the beginning. If you read the ABJ article last weekend, his role is going to continue to grow as he progresses.Thanks to sgm for acknowledging that we don't know what Charlie would have done this year. I really think that is all anyone is trying to say. Sorry about the spelling error.....I wasn't an English major.