Zipped Up

The first year members were UC, Butler, Western Reserve and Ohio. In 1948 the above four members were joined by Western Michigan and Miami. Kent joins in 1951 and BG and Toledo in 1952 which marks the year that the six oldest members have been in the league. If we are counting total wins, that is the first year that would be most logical. Here are the win totals for those six between 1952 - 1961. Miami 38 Ohio 36 BG 32 Kent 31 Kent was a decent program until about 1961. WMU 16 UT 15 So taking into account those years with all the same six, total wins are: Toledo 443 Miami 431 BG 411 WMU 380 Ohio 360 Kent 257 Kent jumps ahead of Northern Illinois by 12 wins but NIU has been in the league 35 less years overall. If one counts inclusive of the 1947-51 years the Miami leads the conference in all time wins with 445 to Toledo 443. Miami has the most MAC championships 17, BG and Toledo tied at 12, CMU 7, NIU 6, OU 5, Ball St 4, Western 2, EMU, Kent, Buffalo and Akron 1 each.

No, you have the much better handle on this. Mango is correct that a 3 star should have confidence in themselves and the coach to be successful. But since the establishment of the Portal, a 3 star (even at Akron) is going to have zero chance to win a job true freshmen year. There used to be a slight chance in the days when a school graduated a kid who had just held the job for two or three years and the freshmen could compete right away with another freshmen or RS freshmen and an upperclassmen who was really a long shot, those days are gone. As soon as a senior graduates, the staff has probably recruited a kid from the Portal the year before or are going looking for one immediately. As you said, the staff is overcommitted to every transfer they bring in. HS kids are still told “we really like you but you’re going to have to compete”, as opposed to the conversation with portal kids “ we liked you out of HS and now that you have a couple years with a program we are going to give you every opportunity to win this job as we like our QB room but JR Jonnie Doe is a true backup and our freshmen and RS freshmen have no experience”. Mango is also correct that a 3 star shouldn’t go D3 because there is little chance he is moving up, but the more likely route now for a 3 star out of HS would be to consider FCS (if you are a good student) or D2 or JUCO (if you are academically challenged ) and you will have a better chance to move up some day to a G5. I think I’m going to look at every MAC school since 2019 or ‘20 and see how many 2 or 3 star HS QBs ended up starting for a season, what year it was, how many stayed the duration and how many even played a down in their first two years before transferring. Off the top of my head, I believe Gabbert and Finn started as freshmen or RS and stayed there at least three years. Gabbert may be the only one to stay the duration. And 98% of every 2 or 3 star on every MAC team eventually had to look elsewhere for a shot. Some teams during this time frame like BG and Akron have played transfers exclusively.

Respectfully disagree. There is almost zero chance of a freshmen or RS freshmen staying if they don’t start. If they haven’t cracked the lineup then the staff is going right to the portal for a quick fix. The portal has ruined recruiting for HS QBs who aren’t 4 or 5 stars but could have been developed at the G5 level or even lower P4 programs.

I think LSU was #6 in 1986 when Miami beat them. This ND team at #5 was a joke.

Iowa’s QB was arguably the worst QB in FBS and he was playing behind a Big10 line. Labas passed on Akron for Ball St initially before decommitting and signing with Iowa when they were empty handed during the COVID freeze on recruiting. He’s not coming to Akron unless it’s his last and only D1 offer.

Tony Georges is on scholarship. Nate Williams, Ronan Chambers and Georges all graduate in spring and will most likely hit the Portal for their last year of eligibility.

Comparing prior and current staff records was not exactly apples to apples comparison. Although I’m not a fan of Arth, Covid screwed up 2020 and skewed how he handled 2021 personnel. So let’s throw out ‘20 and compare two years v two years. Arth (and staff) 2-22 JoMo 4-20. Arth got the two wins and lost 2 of the last 4 to Ball St and Western on last minute plays. Progress was coming (albeit slowly). I would also argue the 2021 schedule was a hell of a lot tougher (both OOC and within the MAC) than this year. So only two wins, but one vs a Bryant team that made the FCS playoffs ( or maybe just missed) and BG on the road, while not a very good team, they were coming off a win vs Minnesota just a couple weeks earlier. Last year JoMo needed OT to beat an average FCS team and the worst NIU in 20 years and this year needed two miracles to beat the worst team in FCS and the worst in FBS. Frankly, they were both failures in relatively comparable time frames, yet only one is heralded as an offensive guru and keeps telling everyone how he could be somewhere bigger and better.

Can’t be a Can’t alum. None would have a million dollars.

He verbally committed to Arth’s staff per their X posts in October of ‘21. He probably didn’t sign his NLI in December because of the uncertainty around the new hire. JoMo and Fessler closed the deal in January because they had only been on the job 2 weeks and hadn’t time to recruit anybody. My point is that Jennings is not Moorhead’s kid, nor Jankowski. Wasel is a different story but if they don’t give him a chance in last 4 games given where the season stands ( and his redshirt intact) then that may say something about their initial evaluation of him. I personally wish they would give Jankowski a start against the other worst team in FBS. With almost zero experience in three years, he has just a good a chance as what we’ve seen.

Jennings was recruited by Arth and he committed to Akron while Arth was still employed as HC.

Ok, my last comment on this. I absolutely agree that coaches do not give a 💩 about stars. I used the stars in my example to demonstrate my theory that the level of recruit for Akron and other Ohio MAC schools, from far outside Ohio, is not greater than that which is still available within Ohio and surrounding areas. I appreciate your X’s and O’s analysis as an ex- coach, I assume, but as a parent of two boys who played college football, my knowledge is how recruiting works at all levels.

I don’t think you do know what I mean by secondary. I’m talking the level of recruit. 2 and 3 stars that the coaches know have greater potential to develop than what the rating services are suggesting. And that kid differs depending on where he lives. There is so much talent in the south now that every coach in the world thinks he can just throw his line in the water and land a big fish (Bowden), but the 4/5 stars go to the top SEC schools or a few other national powers, then the really talented 3 stars go to the rest of the SEC schools or the Big 12 or ACC. Then the lower level 3 star goes to the better Sun Belt or AAC schools and finally the better 2 stars stay close to home at those same conference schools. The rest of the kids who are barely 2 stars, unrated or over rated 3 stars (that most coaches in the region already recognize as such) are what is available to Akron or the MAC. Might you get an over looked kid now and then like Mumpfield, yes, but the majority are not even MAC worthy talent. They had no other options. Now in Ohio, every 4 or 5 star is generally going to OSU first, or the rest of the Big 10 or ND or maybe regional P5 like Pitt or WVU. The really good 3 stars (86-89 rated) are filling in the rest of the Big 10 schools. Now the lower 3 stars (85- 80) identified as having potential by the staff are going to have the MAC as their primary choice in most instances and should be a greater focus of Akron and every MAC school, but they are not because they are too focused on what they think they are getting from down south. They all think they are geniuses but they’re not. Even with Ohio not being as loaded with HS talent as years ago, the opportunity to get these “secondary” (lower rated 3 stars ID’d by the staff) is greater today because of the Ohio State’s and the Rest of the Big 10’s greater national focus. Ohio State is taking 4 and 5 stars at every position. If they’re from Ohio great, but their focus is only on the stars. In the olden days of my time, they took every Ohio kid who was a top 3 star. 80% of the roster was Ohio, Miami and Toledo got the low 3 stars that were left, developed them and thrived. Now OSU isn’t taking Ohio kids unless they are 4 or 5 stars. Their roster is no more than 40% Ohio and a lot of those kids are walk-ons. The pool of Ohio talent is somewhat smaller but the availability of lower 3 stars in Ohio that would be receptive to a MAC program is greater. So, keep recruiting HS players from the south or outside Ohio and contiguous areas like western PA that have won nothing or rely on the portal where the same logic applies, getting kids who were 2 or 3 stars to begin with and didn’t pan out at their first choice. Neither approach has worked so far. You are not going to get a 4 or 5 star QB or lineman for that matter in the portal to come to Akron. Lingard is an anomaly. Even Moorhead has said he wants to recruit more locally and has shown it to some extent by recruiting his western PA roots, but IMO he is primarily recruiting for the here and now to get his next job , so the portal it is. I’ve enjoyed the back and forth but my old retired self is exhausted now.

I’m not suggesting any team ignore the transfer portal. Akron’s improvement on defense is clearly due to the influx of transfers, but the portal is 3 frigging years old and for the better part of the last 40 years, transfers were few and far between. Miami made hay during those years and prior, by getting the second level kids that Ohio State didn’t grab or the Michigan’s and Michigan States etc. There was still enough talent they grabbed from NE Ohio to be one of the two dominant MAC programs. Now they don’t come recruit Ohio as hard and NE Ohio at all and they are no longer a dominant program. I stand by the reasoning that HS recruiting and development is far preferable to turning the roster over every two years and if you can land local “secondary” talent, all the better. Akron’s historic record isn’t good inside or outside, transfer or not. Yes, they need to find a QB from anywhere, but their greatest success was an under recruited kid from Willard who was looking for a good fit. And when I say NE Ohio, I’m not saying they need to find APS kids or Hoban kids, I’m talking the triangle from Lorain county through Cleveland to Youngstown back down to Massillon, Canton and Akron. If Akron outrecruited the rest of the MAC in that area, they would be a top tier MAC program. Miami’s past history proved that, and no one has filled the void. What the hell does UA have to lose trying. 40 years of mostly crap football would suggest nothing.

Other than Allar, Maendler’s QB factory looks like Lordstown, empty. He’s used that kid to his own self promotional success.

GP - He is averaging over 6 wins a year. Me- 6 wins a year over 10 years, based on Miami’s history is… Mediocre. GP - the main focus isn’t NW Ohio. Me - agreed, I said NE Ohio, NW Ohio and Detroit are where Toledo still make their mark. GP - there isn’t a place in the country that doesn’t overestimate their local talent. Me- Agree, not suggesting you only recruit locally but Ne Ohio was the reason Miami was more successful for 30 years in the MAC than anybody else. Their emphasis now is more Indiana, Illinois than Ohio and sorry those states are still not Ohio when it comes to HS talent. GP - a coach can’t fill his roster with portal players just because he thinks fans will be happy with local recruits. Me - exactly, but the portal is a short time fix at best. HS recruiting and development would be the best approach and getting local kids is Akrons only chance to get out of this rut. No good players are coming through the portal and no top recruits are coming from around the country given Akrons struggles. Only finding some under recruited kids who are from Ohio and who think Akron gives them a shot and it’s close, familiar et and the coaches can develop them will end this cycle of failure.