GP1

Excellent point. I've never looked at it that way. Normally the watering down point is made about baseball.People wonder why southern and western colleges are doing so well in football now. That's where the population has moved. The greater the number of people, the greater the chance of getting good players.

I can't think of a single NFL team other than Cleveland Frye could have started for the past three years. There are a few teams where he would have been cut by now. Playing for Cleveland may have been the best shot the guy ever had to prove himself.As far as Jim Zorn, all he can do is coach. He can't play. Frye needs to prove that he belongs in the NFL. You make it sound like Zorn's job is to develop a #3 into a starter. Zorn may not even know the name yet of his new emergency QB. Probably as we type, Frye is running the scout team for Seattle trying to help get the defense ready for Sunday.Locker rooms can be cruel places. I'm sure Charlie has had his balls busted quite a few times this week in ways that make what I type about him seem like compliments. These players are the perfect combination of mean and stupid, and they will say whatever they are thinking. Don't think for a second that the other players don't know he is the first QB ever to start opening day and then get traded the folling week.There is something all of you need to understand......listen closely. Charlie Frye will NEVER be hired to be the starter for another NFL team. His career is on life support right now in Seattle. The best he can ever hope for is to be a career back-up. Charlie needs to save Charlie. Nothing is going to be handed to him again. There is no shame for Frye in being a career back-up either. Again, it's better than getting a real job and it pays a heck of a lot more.

It does run through downtown.

Sounds like you are softening your stance on your man Charlie. LOL. If Frye does indeed make a mil per year, he better catch on quick or he will be gone at the end of the year. Good point and I normally would agree, but from what I saw last Sunday out of NFL QBs, there is no reason to think Frye can not stay on with Seattle. The first thing he should do if he wants to stay on is renegotiate his contract down to a level of #3 with performance clauses in case he makes it to #2 and actually gets to play. If his salary is too high, he stands a much better chance of getting cut. He could be Seattle's Brian St. Pierre. That stiff has been the #3 in Pittsburgh for a long time now. Making the league minimum is much more than he would make on the outside working a real job like us hacks work. I would still like to know if Cleveland is picking up part of his salary. Frye should rent and not buy in Seattle though.The NFL is littered with bad QBs drawing a paycheck and this trend is moving quickly in the wrong direction. There is no reason to believe Frye can't continue to draw one as well. What in the Hell is happening to the NFL?Just for clarification, my main arguments against Frye remain the same:1. Doesn't have the tools, either physically or intellectually, to be an even average QB.2. Doesn't win or do things to help his team win because of his style of play.Quick Seattle joke: How do you know when the sun is out in Seattle?.................................................................The rain is warm.

Jocks and Jills on Tryon.

In the 1970s, successful teams were very run focused. The birth of the run and shoot offense and the west coast offense happened in the 1980s and quickly found a place in college with a lot of southern teams. The better NFL QBs come from passing offenses from their college days. Brady - Michigan, Manning - Tennessee, Hasselbeck - Boston College, Quinn will show himself to be well prepared for the NFL in the next few weeks, etc. It seems as if college is getting away from NFL type offenses to run the type of plays WVU and Florida run.I absolutely love the NFL, and I think the league is becoming less entertaining because the players are not prepared to play in the league. I worry about the quality of the league in the next few years. One of the worst things the NFL has done is close down NFL Europe. They really need a minor league system to develop players.

How about a little break from the norm to discuss a topic semi-related to the Zips as we have a college team?After week one, I can only say that the NFL is becoming a league of three types of teams. The A Teams are most probable to win the Super Bowl...New England, Colts, maybe San Diego are examples. The B Teams a most probable to make the playoffs...Bengals, Eagles, Steelers, Denver, Cowboys, etc. A & B teams constitute about 12 of the 32 teams. There are actually some NFC teams that make the playoffs that are horrible and would never make it in the AFC. The C Teams absolutely stink and you can throw whichever 20 teams you wish into this category. I don't think this is the parity the NFL was hoping to achieve. Why is this? I can think of two reasons and feel free to add your own.First, successful college offenses are now much different than what you see on Sunday. The teams are much more spread out than before and the players are not being prepared for the NFL in college any longer.Secondly, does anyone fear for the future of NFL quarterbacking other than me based upon what we see on Saturday afternoons? The QB is the single most important player on the field for every NFL team.....hands down. With the exception of west coast teams, college QBs now run instead of pass and NFL scouts are just stupid enough to pick up on these guys. Case in point, Michael Vick.I really don't think college football is to blame. I just wrote that to spark interest. Colleges do what they have to do to win games.

"Potential" is a key word. "Dominant" is the other. They are just not telling the truth when they say dominant. It's too over the top.Dominant players don't come around very often. If they truely believed he would have been dominant, they would have drafted him in the first two rounds.A lot of guys have potential. Very few pan out. Frye is not panning out, but he still has NFL life left in him.Here is what Seattle should have said. "We believe Frye has the potential to be a solid back-up quarterback for this team. By adding him, we give stability to the position as we expand our offense to include Wallace in more of it." I think this is a more reasonable statement.

Looks like this story is going to have a fairly "happy ending". And I don't mean the type of "happy ending" Z-P is getting in those Asian bath houses either.

sgm, this one could take years to pan out, and I really sorta wish there was a fast forward button or powers of forshadowment, but I really think you're going to eat it on your extremely low opinion of Charlie Frye You don't have to look forward to see how Frye is going to do, past history tells us how people behave. I've had a low opinion of Frye's ability since his senior year at Akron and rather frequently stated it on this board. Most of the time I was alone on my island of reality and was killed by the members all along. Guess who is getting the last laugh? No hard feelings.You won't have to eat anything sgm405. Frye just doesn't win games or even make players around him better. Sports are really that simple regardless of what the talking heads on networks like ESPN go on and on for hours about. His performance Sunday was an absolutely horrid display of NFL quarterbacking. One would have thought I wrote that article for Livingston in the PD this week.

Frye will be the #2 QB in Seattle by mid season. Two reasons. First, Wallace will be playing WR by then. Second, I think Wallace is in his fourth year. if so, he could be a free agent at the end of the year. Frye still has one year left on his contract and Seattle probably does not want to eat the cap hit. Frye makes too much money not to use him as #2.....especially next season.

Finally, the voice of reason speaks. I just want to know why all those Steeler fans in NE Ohio don't also follow the Buccos. Pittsburgh still has a baseball team? Sort of......I'm just sort of numb to the whole team now. I try to watch, but it's like watching the Little League World Series.

I guess birds of a feather do indeed flock together. Enjoy Asia......take in a bath house and let some little Asian girl soap you up some. Wait a minute, you can go to Youngstown and get the same thing.Sometimes in a baseball trades when a team is trying to unload a player, they trade them but agree to continue to pay part of the salary. I wonder if this is the case here.Frye is listed as #3 right now, but by the end of the year he will be #2. There was a report that they want to use Seneca Wallace (sp?) as a "Slash Stewart" type player. If so, Frye will need to be listed and prepare as #2 in case Wallace gets hurt.

Just wait one damn minute Go Zips!So many Browns fans have become Steelers fans that we now have a wait list. Zip fan or not, there is no automatic entrance. No cutting in line.

In all fairness, he really didn't. Anderson stunk in preseason.

Why don't you tell us what you think big mouth. You come on here and tell everyone how little they know. Tell us how Charlie was actually good against the Steelers. We'll wait for you to get your thoughts from Cincinnati. I'd love to hear you string of stupidity.

I can help here.......NONE!

Hang in everyone, still nine games to go.Go Zips!

UC David gives his point. I'll move in with sgm405 if you admit you slept with Mike Waddell.Frye was absolutely horrible today and was the cause of the Browns loss. You guys can make excuses from now till the cows come home, but the guy is just stupid and doesn't belong in the NFL. I love the NFL and every day he is in it, it is another day that destroys it. He is the same stupid guy who played at Akron and only won 19 D-1A games in four years. Completing a pass to a guy five yards out of bounds....anyone see that at Akron?..... Every game....evey day that goes by, I become more and more right about this guy. "Stupid is as stupid does." Forrest Gump.God bless the Pittsburgh Steelers!

Where are the apologists? You know who you are.......

You made me laugh too......Best wishes.

Can't have the team get a turnover and drive down inside the five with four minutes to go and down by three and have the QB thow into double coverage. They are playing a back-up QB and he is awful. They did have 230 yards rushing against a good Nebraska defense.It was my first trip there. Facilities can't possibly be as good as the rest of the league. It's nice, but nothing like what we saw at NC State last season. I think the stadium only seats 35-40 thousand....not a bad seat anywhere unless you sit on the lawn at one end zone. I'm not even sure if it is on campus or not. I didn't see a campus anywhere. There was a minor league baseball stadium next to it. It's kind of almost like at a county fair around it. Anyhow. Go Zips!

I just got home from the Wake Forrest vs. Nebraska game. Huge Husker tailgate. 25% of the stadium was in red.I got to talking to a few Husker fans in a bar before the game and they said a lot of really nice things about Akron and the game against us in 1997. Extremely nice and friendly people. Wished Akron well. They were so nice talking about Akron, I almost forgot they waxed us 59-14. They are really smart college football fans. Very refreshing.

I'm not going Saturday so I didn't even look into it, but wasn't the OSU game tied into buying season tickets somehow? I'd like to know how much Akron received out of the the OSU tickets they sold.My understanding is between Akron, Army and the Cleveland Sports Commission, only 10,000 tickets were sold for Saturday. Not good. I'm very concerned that having a new stadium is not going to be enough to sell a lot of tickets in a couple of years. For decades, people around Akron have never spent their own money on Zips tickets. Why will they start in two years?

AHHHHHHHHH, the old Ginger or Mary Anne question. You can't lose either way. I take the MAC Championship. There are too many questions remaining the remainder of the season if we beat OSU.Championships really matter as they define a season the players work for all year. They also give the players a ring to keep the rest of their lives.Tough question though.