Women's Basketball - 5 are leaving - Finally in Beacon

[zipfan 81]

http://www.ohio.com/sports/18356289.html

[HOLLYWOODZIPPY]

Sounds to me like they were all a bunch of cry-baby little divas. I say good riddance. You can't build a program with attitudes like that. It's a shame about snowden though, but in my experience if you get homesick at college it's your own fault. You have to get out and make new friends and stay busy. Being a student-athlete, that should have been easy for her because you are almost forced to get to know people (i.e. all the other athletes). The team will be fine, step one in rebuilding is changing the attitude of the team and the perception of the team and I think coach is on the right track.

[GP1]

Good for Coach K! The culture of any organization is the hardest thing to change. Keeping malcontents around is not good for the program.This cleansing could be the best thing Coach K has done while at Akron.

[Valpo Zip]

This is a load of crap... she keeps dismissing everyone for violating team rules and she doesn't want to comment on their opinions. Sounds to me like someone is confused and doesn't have a good argument. Being a student athlete is one of the best things that can happen to a person and an great experience. Coach Kest is turning the great experience of her student athletes into a living nightmare. She is not only ruinning an already struggling program but also the lives of those young ladies.In the future, any HS girl being recruited by Akron will probably be very hesitant, not only does this team not win but also you can't enjoy your experience: things happening behind doors and insecurity etc...Five players and McCoy makes six in a single year. When we recruit them, they are the best thing since sliced bread but then a year or two later, we kick them out and say that they are garbage.I don't think that's a program moving in the right direction. I am not sure what does it take to finally start pointing the finger in the right direction.

[Quickzips]

This whole thing is very unsettling for me. Regardless of who is right, Coach Kest or the individual players, when half a dozen players and three Conference All-Freshman team players leave the program in the span of two years, something just isn't right there. I have no idea what it is, but this situation better get straightened out sooner rather than later.

[Hilltopper]

This is a load of crap... she keeps dismissing everyone for violating team rules and she doesn't want to comment on their opinions. Sounds to me like someone is confused and doesn't have a good argument. Being a student athlete is one of the best things that can happen to a person and an great experience. Coach Kest is turning the great experience of her student athletes into a living nightmare. She is not only ruinning a struggling program but also the lives of those young ladies.In the future, any HS girl being recruited by Akron will probably be very hesitant, not only does this team not win but also you can't even enjoy your experience: things happening behind doors and insecurity etc...Five players and McCoy makes six in a single year. When we recruit them, they are the best thing since sliced bread but then a year or two later, we kick them out and say that they are garbage.I don't think that's a program moving in the right direction. I am not sure what does it take to finally start pointing the finger in the right direction.

They are getting a free six figure education. I agree with coach K's letting them go if they cant follow the rules. As for her not commenting on the departing players statements, she is handling that correctly also. Do you really think it would be good for the program for her to spill any dirty laundry on what really happened to the media? Let them say their piece and move on.

[ZipAlumn]

This whole thing is very unsettling for me. Regardless of who is right, Coach Kest or the individual players, when half a dozen players and three Conference All-Freshman team players leave the program in the span of two years, something just isn't right there. I have no idea what it is, but this situation better get straightened out sooner rather than later.

I totally agree. A coach is in charge of his/her program, and getting a college education for playing a sport is one of the good thing that can happen to a young person. However losing a half dozen players in two years in this manner should cause somebody to step back and say "Whoa, just what is happening here?"

[zipfan 81]

This is a load of crap... she keeps dismissing everyone for violating team rules and she doesn't want to comment on their opinions. Sounds to me like someone is confused and doesn't have a good argument. Being a student athlete is one of the best things that can happen to a person and an great experience. Coach Kest is turning the great experience of her student athletes into a living nightmare. She is not only ruinning a struggling program but also the lives of those young ladies.In the future, any HS girl being recruited by Akron will probably be very hesitant, not only does this team not win but also you can't even enjoy your experience: things happening behind doors and insecurity etc...Five players and McCoy makes six in a single year. When we recruit them, they are the best thing since sliced bread but then a year or two later, we kick them out and say that they are garbage.I don't think that's a program moving in the right direction. I am not sure what does it take to finally start pointing the finger in the right direction.

They are getting a free six figure education. I agree with coach K's letting them go if they cant follow the rules. As for her not commenting on the departing players statements, she is handling that correctly also. Do you really think it would be good for the program for her to spill any dirty laundry on what really happened to the media? Let them say their piece and move on.

If that is the case, then probably every other sport at U of A should let their athletes go because I doubt any of them are "following the rules". Are you serious?

[FORE!zips]

As for her not commenting on the departing players statements, she is handling that correctly also.

Obviously, Coach Kest knows how to handle the media in this situation. The girls that moved on definitely let things fly during their interviews and I believe if I were in their position I would have said something a little differently instead of burning bridges.The article was very unsettling to me as well, but the thing that I read that sticks with me is that the administration supports Coach Kest's decisions. If they are coming out to the public that they support her, then the fans need to show that type of support too. When you build a program you can have bandaids...bandaids aren't permanent!

[Valpo Zip]

This is a load of crap... she keeps dismissing everyone for violating team rules and she doesn't want to comment on their opinions. Sounds to me like someone is confused and doesn't have a good argument. Being a student athlete is one of the best things that can happen to a person and an great experience. Coach Kest is turning the great experience of her student athletes into a living nightmare. She is not only ruinning a struggling program but also the lives of those young ladies.In the future, any HS girl being recruited by Akron will probably be very hesitant, not only does this team not win but also you can't even enjoy your experience: things happening behind doors and insecurity etc...Five players and McCoy makes six in a single year. When we recruit them, they are the best thing since sliced bread but then a year or two later, we kick them out and say that they are garbage.I don't think that's a program moving in the right direction. I am not sure what does it take to finally start pointing the finger in the right direction.

They are getting a free six figure education. I agree with coach K's letting them go if they cant follow the rules. As for her not commenting on the departing players statements, she is handling that correctly also. Do you really think it would be good for the program for her to spill any dirty laundry on what really happened to the media? Let them say their piece and move on.

Hilltopper, with all due respect, this "following the rules" thing is a big joke that people in charge can use according to their needs. One person cannot make the rules and judge who is following them and who is not. At least not in this country, maybe in China or Sudan but not here.I would love to see the the athletic department forming a hearing committee to listen to what those girls have to say. Or maybe the university making a judicial board to hear both sides of the stoy.Let me create an analogy to something we all deal with in our daily lives:Let's say you are driving your car at 30mph on a 25mph road. you are VIOLATING THE RULES right? some cops will let you go with it, some will give you a warning, and some will even give you a ticket. How about one that will permanently suspend your driving license without no court appearance and no chance to do anything?The cop is not God and he can make a mistake or he can be a jerk or he can have a hidden agenda, that's why there is a judicial system. Coach Kest is not God either! she is not willing to convince me that those girls did anything bad. she is not commenting on what they say and i am leaning towards believing that she is the problem.And talking about dirty laundry, are you serious? does it get any dirtier?

[GP1]

The cop is not God and he can make a mistake or he can be a jerk or he can have a hidden agenda, that's why there is a judicial system. Coach Kest is not God either! she is not willing to convince me that those girls did anything bad. she is not commenting on what they say and i am leaning towards believing that she is the problem.

Don't the cop and Coach Kest function under different rules? The cop is forced to follow due process according to the Constitution. Coach Kest functions largely as a dictator constrained only by the NCAA and the Athletic Director. She can do whatever she wants to do until the NCAA or the AD stop her and she does not have to ask permission to do so.For those of you who think she needs to solve the problem, what is the solution? I think getting rid of malcontents is a pretty good solution to a potential problem. Malcontents are very difficult to make happy because they are always upset about something. In the end, JK will spend all of her time trying to make the malcontents happy and does not pay attention to those who have bought into what she is trying to do. At that point, the malcontents spread their cancer into those who buy in because they have shown the only way to get what you want is to whine and cry about the problem. Keeping six players who have bought in to what she is trying to do is more important than losing six players who want to have their cake and eat it too.I wonder how Pat Summitt dealt with malcontents when she started at Tennessee? My guess is she did not give a crap about her players feelings. How many national championships does she have now? Keep doing what you are doing Coach Kest. Don't get distracted.

[Zip Watcher]

You're not God, Nickerson. You're just a typing teacher.

[ZachTheZip]

A whole hell of a lot was left unsaid in that article. The incident that sparked this was what I would consider to be a borderline offense, and certainly would not warrant the type of reaction that we have witnessed. I'm guessing that it goes much deeper than the girls "breaking a few rules" at some house party or on spring break, as is usually the case with college athletes. Just look at the players reactions; they wanted to get out, and were waiting for an excuse. I also think that coach Kest was waiting for an excuse to get those girls off the team. She removed two players with bad attitudes, and the resulting fallout caused three more to leave on their own. I think this was in the making for quite a while.I wonder if the team will hold tryouts for walkons now.

[flipthezip]

I fully support Coach Kest in the way see is handling "her" program (as long as the growth continues). Further, I believe Mack would not have allowed these players to be dismissed if he believed the issues were borderline or in a grey area.What my real concern is that we seem to keep getting all these "whiners" and "malcontents". These girls all supposedly have bad attitudes and don't wish to work hard. They want follow simple team rules. ???????UMMM. One or two such athletes in a program - OK. But a half dozen +. What is going on in the recruiting process that these supposed flaws in these girls characters and work ethics aren't being discovered? Or, if there is a personality clash between these athletes and the coach, wouldn't that be more obvious during the process. There is usually several face to face meetings and at minimum 2-3 dozen phone calls between them before a scholarship offer is made and accepted.

[RACER]

i have no idea how she decides who follows the rules.my old boss told me anyone can be replaced even him.the point isyou try to work with people that have some value in your organization.firing somebody should only be used as last resort.you don't think other recruits see what she is doing at akron.why would they go there if they are going to lose the scholly a year from now.the reality of this is almost nobody really cares about girls d-1 ball at any school.you have some exceptions at a few schools like tn,but most people could care less about girls b-ball.in the end she could get rid of all the team,and only a few people would care about it.

[Z.I.P.]

i have no idea how she decides who follows the rules.my old boss told me anyone can be replaced even him.the point isyou try to work with people that have some value in your organization.firing somebody should only be used as last resort.you don't think other recruits see what she is doing at akron.why would they go there if they are going to lose the scholly a year from now.the reality of this is almost nobody really cares about girls d-1 ball at any school.you have some exceptions at a few schools like tn,but most people could care less about girls b-ball.in the end she could get rid of all the team,and only a few people would care about it.

Anyone can be replaced? Let's start with Jody Kest. She has lost my respect as a coach. I have NEVER heard of an entire team being asked -- or told - to leave a school, and that is basically what has happened here. How can this NOT reflect on the coach? Most of these players are her own recruits anyway. What does that say about her decision making and leadership? As those who have read my posts this past season know, I have a deep commitment to the UA WBB squad. Changes have to happen -- sooner rather than later.

[Ryno aka Menace]

i have no idea how she decides who follows the rules.my old boss told me anyone can be replaced even him.the point isyou try to work with people that have some value in your organization.firing somebody should only be used as last resort.you don't think other recruits see what she is doing at akron.why would they go there if they are going to lose the scholly a year from now.the reality of this is almost nobody really cares about girls d-1 ball at any school.you have some exceptions at a few schools like tn,but most people could care less about girls b-ball.in the end she could get rid of all the team,and only a few people would care about it.

Anyone can be replaced? Let's start with Jody Kest. She has lost my respect as a coach. I have NEVER heard of an entire team being asked -- or told - to leave a school, and that is basically what has happened here. How can this NOT reflect on the coach? Most of these players are her own recruits anyway. What does that say about her decision making and leadership? As those who have read my posts this past season know, I have a deep commitment to the UA WBB squad. Changes have to happen -- sooner rather than later.

Well in Kest defense of recruiting all a coach has to go on when judging character is... 1. Film, how the act during competition2. What their high school coach says about the athlete3. What teachers say about the athlete - and most don't take it this far.Is that enough to judge a young persons character? Are those 2-3 things enough to know how a teenager is going to act when they are out from under mom and dad's roof, and roaming a college campus?I think the main thing everyone is missing is that she has the administrations support!!!! And a senior on the team said everything is spelled out in the rule book, so their is no excuse period!!!

[akronad]

Regardles of what WE think, the bottom line is this: the coach (and I don't care who or what school we are talking about) is the coach and the players are the players. What the coach says, goes. In HS, if my coach had told me to run thru a brick wall, I sure as heck would have run thru a brick wall.My son works for a D2 school in Arkansas. Their female & male soccer coach left the program at the end of the season. There were many soccer players that liked him and decided that if he was not going to be there, that they would ask for their walking papers. The adminisration at the school gladly acommodated them and are now rebuilding both programs from the 1st bldg. block.Let's just allow Coach Kest to do her job. I'm sure that if she doesn't, Mac will take the apprrpriate actions.

[GP1]

I wonder if so many of you would be as hard on JK if she was a he. In business, hard charging men are often called "tough leaders" and "no nonsense". If a woman is hard charging in business, she is often called a bitch.Another analogy. In the movie Hoosiers, Gene Hackman plays a tough coach who kicks kids off the team for not doing exactly what he wants. During their first game, he plays only four players to make a point to a malcontent and the rest of the team. At the end of the game, he tells the team they need to do exactly what he wants them to do or basically leave the team. In the end, his type of leadership attracts the best player in the school to go out for the team because he believes in how the coach is handling the team and the school wins the state championship. At this point in the WBB program, they need a coach like that character because everything is so broken there is little room for compromise. When you guys who say bad things about Coach K watch the movie Hoosiers, do you relate to what the coach in Hoosiers does or do you say he is being too hard on the players and should have just put the malcontent back in the game because they needed five? Or do you think he should listen to the town's people who want to tell him how to run his program? I bet not.Lastly, I would like to take a minute to praise the young ladies who have stayed on the team and I would like to encourage them to have an even stronger committment to the team next season. Keep a positive attitude. The malcontents would have only destroyed your spirit. Those of us on this board know it can't be easy winning only 7-8 games a year. In lieu of worrying about players leaving, we should be praising those staying.Keep the hard line JK.

[Ryno aka Menace]

I wonder if so many of you would be as hard on JK if she was a he. In business, hard charging men are often called "tough leaders" and "no nonsense". If a woman is hard charging in business, she is often called a bitch.Another analogy. In the movie Hoosiers, Gene Hackman plays a tough coach who kicks kids off the team for not doing exactly what he wants. During their first game, he plays only four players to make a point to a malcontent and the rest of the team. At the end of the game, he tells the team they need to do exactly what he wants them to do or basically leave the team. In the end, his type of leadership attracts the best player in the school to go out for the team because he believes in how the coach is handling the team and the school wins the state championship. At this point in the WBB program, they need a coach like that character because everything is so broken there is little room for compromise. When you guys who say bad things about Coach K watch the movie Hoosiers, do you relate to what the coach in Hoosiers does or do you say he is being too hard on the players and should have just put the malcontent back in the game because they needed five? Or do you think he should listen to the town's people who want to tell him how to run his program? I bet not.Lastly, I would like to take a minute to praise the young ladies who have stayed on the team and I would like to encourage them to have an even stronger committment to the team next season. Keep a positive attitude. The malcontents would have only destroyed your spirit. Those of us on this board know it can't be easy winning only 7-8 games a year. In lieu of worrying about players leaving, we should be praising those staying.Keep the hard line JK.

Amen! Preach brotha Preach..they ain't ready for church this early in the morn'n!!

[FORE!zips]

Well in Kest defense of recruiting all a coach has to go on when judging character is... 1. Film, how the act during competition2. What their high school coach says about the athlete3. What teachers say about the athlete - and most don't take it this far.Is that enough to judge a young persons character? Are those 2-3 things enough to know how a teenager is going to act when they are out from under mom and dad's roof, and roaming a college campus?I think the main thing everyone is missing is that she has the administrations support!!!! And a senior on the team said everything is spelled out in the rule book, so their is no excuse period!!!

I hope that Coach Kest is talking to her recruits on the phone regularly as well. That would be a sure fire way to see any red flags. And even that's not enough.You have to remember though...Coach Kest isn't doing ALL of the recruiting...she has assistants too. Of course, I'm sure she has the final say in things. The point I'm making is...with so many different positions to recruit for, she can't do all of the recruiting herself. And I'm sure it is hard for her to know each recruit personally because there probably isn't enough time in the day to do that. So...she probably puts alot of trust in her assistants to help her out with that.And if you ever read Pat Summitt's book "Reach for the Summitt", you would know she doesn't put up with ANYTHING. Most winningest coach in basketball ever...I think if any coach followed Summitt they can't go wrong.

[flipthezip]

Well in Kest defense of recruiting all a coach has to go on when judging character is... 1. Film, how the act during competition2. What their high school coach says about the athlete3. What teachers say about the athlete - and most don't take it this far.Is that enough to judge a young persons character? Are those 2-3 things enough to know how a teenager is going to act when they are out from under mom and dad's roof, and roaming a college campus?I think the main thing everyone is missing is that she has the administrations support!!!! And a senior on the team said everything is spelled out in the rule book, so their is no excuse period!!!

I hope that Coach Kest is talking to her recruits on the phone regularly as well. That would be a sure fire way to see any red flags. And even that's not enough.You have to remember though...Coach Kest isn't doing ALL of the recruiting...she has assistants too. Of course, I'm sure she has the final say in things. The point I'm making is...with so many different positions to recruit for, she can't do all of the recruiting herself. And I'm sure it is hard for her to know each recruit personally because there probably isn't enough time in the day to do that. So...she probably puts alot of trust in her assistants to help her out with that.And if you ever read Pat Summitt's book "Reach for the Summitt", you would know she doesn't put up with ANYTHING. Most winningest coach in basketball ever...I think if any coach followed Summitt they can't go wrong.

I can appreciate that Coach kest is busy and may not be able to spend as much time getting to know all the recruits as well as she would like during the early stages of the recruiting process. But once it becomes clear that a young lady is a definate possibilty for the offering of a scholarship, she needs to be very involved in getting to know that recruit. It's not as if we making a large # of offers.

[Hilltopper]

This is a load of crap... she keeps dismissing everyone for violating team rules and she doesn't want to comment on their opinions. Sounds to me like someone is confused and doesn't have a good argument. Being a student athlete is one of the best things that can happen to a person and an great experience. Coach Kest is turning the great experience of her student athletes into a living nightmare. She is not only ruinning a struggling program but also the lives of those young ladies.In the future, any HS girl being recruited by Akron will probably be very hesitant, not only does this team not win but also you can't even enjoy your experience: things happening behind doors and insecurity etc...Five players and McCoy makes six in a single year. When we recruit them, they are the best thing since sliced bread but then a year or two later, we kick them out and say that they are garbage.I don't think that's a program moving in the right direction. I am not sure what does it take to finally start pointing the finger in the right direction.

They are getting a free six figure education. I agree with coach K's letting them go if they cant follow the rules. As for her not commenting on the departing players statements, she is handling that correctly also. Do you really think it would be good for the program for her to spill any dirty laundry on what really happened to the media? Let them say their piece and move on.

Hilltopper, with all due respect, this "following the rules" thing is a big joke that people in charge can use according to their needs. One person cannot make the rules and judge who is following them and who is not. At least not in this country, maybe in China or Sudan but not here.I would love to see the the athletic department forming a hearing committee to listen to what those girls have to say. Or maybe the university making a judicial board to hear both sides of the stoy.

Try that theory out with your boss. I am sure that all UA athletes sign a code of conduct that clearly outlines their responsibilities to remain in the program. This is not a criminal case in the judicial system.

[FORE!zips]

Try that theory out with your boss. I am sure that all UA athletes sign a code of conduct that clearly outlines their responsibilities to remain in the program. This is not a criminal case in the judicial system.

It would be pointless to form some type of committee to hear these girls out. It will turn into a "she said, she said" pissin contest and nothing beneficial would come from it except to hear everyone's harbored opinions.

[Captain Kangaroo]

Everyone is so judgmental, yet no one has any clue what's gone on inside the women's locker room. Until now. I was sent this audio file of a Coach Kest halftime speech. It was obviously from a Zips/Purdue scrimmage. You judge for yourself if you cold play for her.