Upgrading the Zips' Schedule

[Captain Kangaroo]

Why are we complaining again about how things are progressing? Why are we complaining about schedules when it's working?

I don't see it as complaining. I see it as discussing. The old saying goes "Those who don't learn from history are condemned to repeat it." I don't want to see another 2007, and it is easy to avoid it. Continue to schedule better. To silence Joe Hyperbole here: Should we schedule UNC, Kansas and Oklahoma? No. Should we upgrade our schedule commensurate with the increase in Zips team talent and ability? Yes.We were 1/2 an eyelash away from sweating out a CBI bid this season. And I'm good with that...I think our 2008-9 schedule was good for our 2008-9 talent and experience. But I don't think we should be in that position again anytime soon. Our program is now in a position where, should we stub our toe in the MAC tourney, the breadth of our season's accomplishments should be sufficient to place us in NCAA "bubble" discussions, and be a lock for an NIT. Dambrot said in a recent column that it was good to have his players compete against LeBron in open gyms to humble them, and to remind them "how bad they really are". Likewise, the Zips team needs to measure itself against top-tier talent every so often to gauge where they are collectively.

[Zip N' Dots]

Zips Win...perfect. Brings us right back to the very reason I started this thread.We only need to look at our last couple of years of MAC Tournament history to know that anything can happen. We've now lost the MAC tournament with the best team in the MAC, and won it with a #5 seeded team. And I'm just not satisfied with continuing to rest our postseason opportunities on a situation where any one of 13 teams can have everything fall their way at the right time. I'm really quite surprised that anyone is fine with us continuing along satisfied with only having one chance to get into the big dance, when there are things you can do to improve your chances at getting a 2nd opportunity.

It's not yet been 11 days since the Zips won the MAC Title .. and already Skip is throwing a stinky wet blanket on the smoldering embers of excitement for Zips hoops. Well done Skip .. well done. Great effort. Please cite a post where ANYONE is fine with only having one chance to dance. People here are coming to the realization that the building of the program is WORKING .. that the schedule needs to fit the team when it's early in the process (the last couple of years) and that as the team establishes winning habits, we expect the scheduling to grow and get more difficult. The RESULTS (SEE: 2009 MAC TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONSHIP) prove that KD's plan is WORKING. Would other plans be working? Perhaps .. but the important thing is that his vision and strategy IS panning out.Do you honestly think that KD is going to sit on his laurels and pretend that the status quo will fill the trophy case? What possible evidence is there to indicate he will?Nothing about how the past 5 years have gone suggests to me that this is a one and done thing. The Zips won the title with nobody averaging 12 ppg. They won the title with 1 senior. They won the title with no short-term hired guns. They won the title with depth and team play. These are components to building a championship program .. not just building a championship team. I think there's a clear difference, and I think the Zips fit squarely in the former category. B) B) Repeat after me .. start slowly if you have to: THE ZIPS ARE THE 2009 MAC CHAMPIONS! THE ZIPS ARE THE 2009 MAC CHAMPIONS! :champs: :champs: Go Zips!!

Great posts Watcher, I have enjoyed everything you have written, I completely agree about the process and that the current road we are on is the right one. If we continue, I believe as we grow our program the MAC itself will get better cause teams will begin to feel pressure to compete. A stronger MAC will yield more bids to the tourney (ie Horizon this year: Butler and CSU). If the MAC schools decide not to step it up then you have your Gonzaga of the East.

[GP1]

Interesting last few posts.Sports are a funny. A few plays go the right way for you here or there and the coach is a genious. When they don't go your way, the coach is average and the program can't get over the hump. It kind of proves what I always say about coaches. There are few great coaches. There are few terrible coaches. Most are somewhere in the good category because they all go to the same seminars and learn the same things and have made coaching their career.I think KD is a good coach. I don't think he is a great coach or some great visionary that saw the path to success at Akron (Akron has been good in the past before he got here, let's not kid ourselves). I think the last two games of the year were an eye opener for him as he realized offense wins big games and defense beats average to bad teams. Trust me, I watched Bill Cowher do it for years with the Steelers. He won a lot of games with defense and a good running game in low scoring games, but couldn't get over the hump in the big games until he had an offense that could score a lot of points in big games. Not only did he have the offense, but he took the chains off of the offense and let them score. To KD's credit, he did that in the Championship game. Hats off. The Zips went on a roll at the end of the year which is the sign of a good team. Was there some luck? Of course, but you need luck also if you want to win a championship. Luck, however you want to define it, is nothing to be ashamed of. The Zips had the perfect storm this year.....a little luck, some hard working players, experience in the championship game, Buffalo forgot how to play basketball and a good coach. I don't think winning tournament games is as much of an indicator of a program's current state as what they do during the regular season. The Zips played well this season with a very young team. This team has been good for a few years now, they just weren't able to get over the hump. All I ask out of the Zips basketball team is 20 wins a year and a strong showing in the Tournament with a championship sprinkled here or there. The past few years they have satisfied what I want. If you remain good year after year, championships will follow.

[Zips Win!]

I like the trend, progress and results...But let's not forget it took a miracle 3- point shot and inbounds/ assist to get us here.

Good teams make their own luck.Penno's shot in 2007 was a miracle shot. The CSU shot @ Syracuse was a miracle shot. The plays against UT were 2 difficult basketball plays made in the heat of the game. One was a squared up look from normal 3 point range, and another was a great pass by a player with court vision and a habit of winning.They were great plays .. not miracles.In a year, this is what fans will remember .. a little bit more than what happened on Tuesday.

Everyone will be gunning for us next year....

Indeed they will. Sucks for them that the Zips will be a better, more seasoned team than this year. B) Go Zips!

Again, I'm not complaining....just discussing....And enjoying the MAC championship as much as anyone...But, you can call it what you want? I will call it a miracle in basketball terms...In fact a couple of miracles..In many ways, our win vs. Toledo was more dramatic than the Penno shot and much more than "great plays" if you see what happened to get us to the "shot" and the "pass".Did everyone forget that Brett McKnight was an inch away from being out of bounds as he flipped the ball to Humpty for the shot. Great hussle on Brett's part, but ever so close from being game over before he ever took the shot.In OT, the ball was deflected out of bounds off of JC(I believe) before we got it with 1.5 seconds. That could have very easily been called Toledo ball..even though it was ours..Then, after the pass, BM's shot kind of hung on the rim and fell in...Again, ever so close from rolling off.I'll take it and enjoy the fact that a couple of breaks came our way. Here is a situation where the Zips have to continue "building" the program (I know how much GP1 likes to build) if we want to get to be Gonzaga of the east. And speaking of Gonzaga, Joe Jakubick and I will have our Carolina lids on pulling for the Tar Heels later this week.

[Captain Kangaroo]

FYI - CSU's non-conference schedule, as it stands today:Home games: West Virginia, Wichita State, Robert Morris, John Carroll. Road games: Ohio State, Kansas State, Xavier (tentative), tournament in Hawaii TBA.Seems appropriate for an upper-echelon Horizon League program. Plus they will get two chances to beat a Top-40 (maybe 25) program in Butler.FYI - A non-conference game vs. CSU would sell out the JAR. That would be cool...if, of course, you like those types of games. Make it happen, Mack. Ink a 2-year, home/home deal with CSU. NE Ohio wants that game. Ch43 or 19 will pick it up. It would be HUGE.

[BirdZip]

OK, so I asked why we're complaining when perhaps we're just discussing, but it just seemed to me we're already implying next year's schedule won't be up to par and we haven't even seen it yet! This year's schedule was better than last year's--let's see what we come up with.And as for the Toledo game, yes we had to hit a couple of last-second shots, but we hit them! When we should have won a game but lost it, we label them as crapping down their legs. When they win a game they had no chance of coming back and winning, we go the "could have lost it there" route. Don't miss the significance of that Toledo game! Their legs came out clean! They found the Imodium, took it, and while their tummies may have been a little rumbly, they didn't implode. These are freshman and sophomores and toward the end they started winning the games where they were buried. They didn't fold, they rallied. Turning point?!?!?And finally, to look at one season and say, "Well, anything can happen"--that's fine. Two years aren't statistically significant. But when you look at a 6-year stretch where it's a continuous upward trend, claiming that means nothing seems a little like an ostrich with its head in the sand. "I refuse to acknowledge what's right before me."

[zip37]

The solution to the problem is in the works, in a couple of years, the Zips will, hopefully have a walk to the MAC Champion i.e. Memphis, so ooc won't mean a whole lot. Calipari [sp?] as brilliant in not going to BE., he has a walk to conf championship yearly

[Captain Kangaroo]

But when you look at a 6-year stretch where it's a continuous upward trend, claiming that means nothing seems a little like an ostrich with its head in the sand. "I refuse to see what's right before me."

That is the heart of my disagreement with some within this thread - Those relegated to the old company line "...we only have one chance to make the NCAA's, so the regular season is irrelevant...play a bunch of cupcakes...get a bunch of wins...and hope you win the MAC tourney.If people want to place their heads in the sand and ignore that fact that the present, and future of our basketball program is better than that...that it isn't tethered to the same "let's hope we win the MAC tourney because nothing else matters" fate...I'll disagree. I believe our program is past that stage. We aren't Eastern Michigan...Central Michigan...Northern Illinois...etc. To those programs, the same-old-same-old applies. To the Zips, it doesn't.Who's Joe Jakubik anyhow? Until I see him in a UA golf shirt or ball cap, he's a myth.

[Dr Z]

I think KD is a good coach. I don't think he is a great coach or some great visionary that saw the path to success at Akron (Akron has been good in the past before he got here, let's not kid ourselves). I think the last two games of the year were an eye opener for him as he realized offense wins big games and defense beats average to bad teams. Trust me, I watched Bill Cowher do it for years with the Steelers. He won a lot of games with defense and a good running game in low scoring games, but couldn't get over the hump in the big games until he had an offense that could score a lot of points in big games. Not only did he have the offense, but he took the chains off of the offense and let them score. To KD's credit, he did that in the Championship game. Hats off.

I think that is a pretty good observation. The one thing that I would add is that sometimes a "good" coach gets a great player and that is what helps him win the big one. Cowher never won the big one w/o Ben. Will Zeke be KD's Ben? I hope so.Again, congrats to KD and the boys for a great ride this year. STILL wish we could have rushed the floor at the Q.

[meatwad]

And speaking of Gonzaga, Joe Jakubick and I will have our Carolina lids on pulling for the Tar Heels later this week.

Are you serious? Why the heck would you cheer for NC over Gonzaga?

[Zips Win!]

And speaking of Gonzaga, Joe Jakubick and I will have our Carolina lids on pulling for the Tar Heels later this week.

Are you serious? Why the heck would you cheer for NC over Gonzaga?

Why not? I know Gonzaga was the mid-major blueprint for success. I hope we can emulate it.That said, I saw the Gonzaga faithful in person in Portland. Today, they are about as "mid-major" as I am a buckeye fan...Besides, I hope someone knocks the heck out of Heytfelt (sp?)

[WinZip]

I believe that KD and the staff are doing a great job working with the talent they are fortunate enough to have. I'll give the players loads of credit here too! KD has a plan and results really don't lie. We have shown continued progress over the last few years, and hopefully will keep raising the bar for many more. I love the direction Akron basketball is heading.

/\ |

Reflecting on more than a few occasions I understand the fine line we walk. Imagine what we would be talking about if we lost to a lackluster Toledo team (perhaps the same things we are now, but I honestly think not). Things change in an instant, be it a shot or 1.5seconds. You never know what will happen! The point is, we won that game, taking advantage of opportunity and playing our hearts out. Down to the wire games like this can bring a team together, allowing them to play at another level. We should schedule games that help the program to grow, games that challenge our young guys and force them to keep their heads. Success is something to grab onto, not to let slip through your fingertips

[meatwad]

Why not? I know Gonzaga was the mid-major blueprint for success. I hope we can emulate it.That said, I saw the Gonzaga faithful in person in Portland. Today, they are about as "mid-major" as I am a buckeye fan...Besides, I hope someone knocks the heck out of Heytfelt (sp?)

They are still a hell of a lot more "mid-major" than UNC. And all of the Gonzaga fans that I came across (here, on their board, and at the game) were classy and complimentary of the Zips program.F the Tar Heels.

[Zips Win!]

And all of the Gonzaga fans that I came across (here, on their board, and at the game) were classy and complimentary of the Zips program.

Agree. But it's easy to be complimentary when you win...

[skip-zip]

But when you look at a 6-year stretch where it's a continuous upward trend, claiming that means nothing seems a little like an ostrich with its head in the sand. "I refuse to see what's right before me."

That is the heart of my disagreement with some within this thread - Those relegated to the old company line "...we only have one chance to make the NCAA's, so the regular season is irrelevant...play a bunch of cupcakes...get a bunch of wins...and hope you win the MAC tourney.If people want to place their heads in the sand and ignore that fact that the present, and future of our basketball program is better than that...that it isn't tethered to the same "let's hope we win the MAC tourney because nothing else matters" fate...I'll disagree. I believe our program is past that stage. We aren't Eastern Michigan...Central Michigan...Northern Illinois...etc. To those programs, the same-old-same-old applies. To the Zips, it doesn't.

For lack of time to respond to everything, although I love this topic...right THERE is the response that pretty much sums it all up for me.Thanks for all of your responses, especially those who are reminding all of us that participating in this discussion is not a bashing of our coach, our program or our championship team. I knew this thread would would generate a lot of interest.

[Valpo Zip]

I am with the captain on this one. If we can guarrantee a MAC championship year in year out, that will be great. However, why would you kill the season between (Nov-Feb) and Just play in March every year?Unless we play a competitive OOC schedule and run for an at large bid, then why play the regular seasson?How would you convince recruits to come here and practice the whole year if you're not going to play a tough competitive season allaround?Whether we beat St Francis by 20 or by 25 will not make any difference with recruits, selection committee or Joe Akron. Beating a good team will.

[Captain Kangaroo]

F the Tar Heels.

[Dave in Green]

Assuming that we're all first and foremost Zips fans, someone is going to have to explain to me just how it benefits the Zips for North Carolina to beat the Zags. I can think of a few good reasons why it benefits the Zips if the Zags beat UNC. But, for the life of me, I can't think of one good reason why the Zips benefit from the team that beat them in the NCAA tournament not going deep into the tourney and perhaps even winning a national championship.And, by the way, the Zags fans were mostly classy and complimentary both before and after they beat the Zips.

[BirdZip]

If people want to place their heads in the sand and ignore that fact that the present, and future of our basketball program is better than that...that it isn't tethered to the same "let's hope we win the MAC tourney because nothing else matters" fate...I'll disagree. I believe our program is past that stage. We aren't Eastern Michigan...Central Michigan...Northern Illinois...etc. To those programs, the same-old-same-old applies. To the Zips, it doesn't.

Agreed. I'd like to see a basketball schedule with a nice balance on it. A few cupcakes, a number of solid mid-majors, and a few of the majors. I'm just not ready to bash next year's schedule when it hasn't come out yet.Now, if it's OK with everyone, I'm going to spend a few more weeks enjoying that the Zips are .

[Hilltopper]

Screw UNC!

[Zip Watcher]

Agreed. I'd like to see a basketball schedule with a nice balance on it. A few cupcakes, a number of solid mid-majors, and a few of the majors. I'm just not ready to bash next year's schedule when it hasn't come out yet.Now, if it's OK with everyone, I'm going to spend a few more weeks enjoying that the Zips are .

Agreed on point 2.On point 1, aren't the Zips guaranteed 16 .. er .. 19 games against cupcakes from January - March? B) B)

[Zips Win!]

Assuming that we're all first and foremost Zips fans, someone is going to have to explain to me just how it benefits the Zips for North Carolina to beat the Zags. I can think of a few good reasons why it benefits the Zips if the Zags beat UNC. But, for the life of me, I can't think of one good reason why the Zips benefit from the team that beat them in the NCAA tournament not going deep into the tourney and perhaps even winning a national championship.And, by the way, the Zags fans were mostly classy and complimentary both before and after they beat the Zips.

There is zero benefit to the Zips if UNC wins and zero benefit to the Zips if Gonzaga wins. Let me know how UA benefits from a Gonzaga win..And yes, the Gonzaga fans were complimentary. But they were favored to win and they won...Hence the before and after thing,,,....The problem was that there were so many in the building on Thursday evening in Portland that the underdog Zips never got the benefit of having all the "other" fans pulling for the underdog. Case in point, Villanova played a first round game in Philadelphia versus American. I heard that the arena, in Philly no less was pulling for American. Yet in an arena 4 hours from Spokane the building was full of loud fans pulling for Gonzaga. Great for them. The reality is is that they are not a Mid-major program and there is no real benefit to UA if they win...Sorry....

[geno]

Schedule needs a big upgrade, without a doubt. Need more early season games like Pittsburgh and Louisville a couple years back. A local CSU or YSU yearly rivalry would be nice as a regular draw but won't help us nationally. Need more tough road games. Even next years bracket buster with Valpo coming here will not be much to look forward to, as Valpo had a bunch of seniors and will be rebuilding. Need to play some hitters.

[Hilltopper]

Case in point, Villanova played a first round game in Philadelphia versus American. I heard that the arena, in Philly no less was pulling for American.

Come on, they booed Santa in Philly, what do you expect? Philly Fans Boo Santa

[Zips Win!]

And as for the Toledo game, yes we had to hit a couple of last-second shots, but we hit them! When we should have won a game but lost it, we label them as crapping down their legs. When they win a game they had no chance of coming back and winning, we go the "could have lost it there" route. Don't miss the significance of that Toledo game! Their legs came out clean! They found the Imodium, took it, and while their tummies may have been a little rumbly, they didn't implode. These are freshman and sophomores and toward the end they started winning the games where they were buried. They didn't fold, they rallied. Turning point?!?!?

Yes, I am the first call us out for losing when we seem to find a way to come from ahead and find a way to lose. And yes I pointed out that it took several miracles to beat Toledo and therefore we could have lost. The point I was attempting to make (and did a poor job) was that I am just not a firm believer in the 2004-2009 "trend" that was posted earlier.Sure, steps have been taken to win the MAC championship in 2009. But when the 2007 and 2009 titles basically come down to one or two plays, I'm not buying in on a trend. If we win in 2007 and lose in 2009, where is the trend? As for the significance of the Toledo game? It was huge. Freshman and sophmores, making big plays and hitting big shots while getting invaluable experience. We finally proved that we can break through and win a big game. How will this impact 2009-10? Not real sure, but with everyone except Nate returning, I hope it pays dividends. As others have posted, the schedule needs to be upgraded and the team needs to come back with the understanding that the MACC will have to be earned again. Winning a championship in 2009 doesn't guarantee one in 2010.