Potential College Football Scandal

[Dave in Green]

The originator of the massive thread I've been following posted a really brief summary today that gives a good idea of the scope of the FBI investigation. It appears that a lot more will become public by the end of January. Here's the brief summary of what to expect:

The FBI and DOJ are involved for three reasons. BingoGate, Lowder & Co., and the shopping of players. Look at the charges and understand the severity of each segment.

(1) BingoGate is an attack on the very foundation of Democracy - Maybe if it involved just one crook and politician, they would not be as concerned. But the depth and magnitude of this Network, combined with the ulterior motive to create such an elaborate organization, the Feds don't care for what they tried at all. Everyone's head will be had before the day is done.

(2) Shopping of Players is the least severe of the three but it deals with human traffic commerce, concentrated in urban areas preying on economically challenged youth - tantamount to slavery - again not good.

(3) With Colonial/Lowder, the Feds are looking for $2.9 Bln (that's with a "B") and they're pissed because we as taxpayers had to foot the bill to cover Dear Bobby's overdraft account. They want their money back, and they want it now. They don't take kindly to swindlers such as these and their conviction rate is pretty high.

[GP1]

The originator of the massive thread I've been following posted a really brief summary today that gives a good idea of the scope of the FBI investigation. It appears that a lot more will become public by the end of January. Here's the brief summary of what to expect:

The FBI and DOJ are involved for three reasons. BingoGate, Lowder & Co., and the shopping of players. Look at the charges and understand the severity of each segment.

(1) BingoGate is an attack on the very foundation of Democracy - Maybe if it involved just one crook and politician, they would not be as concerned. But the depth and magnitude of this Network, combined with the ulterior motive to create such an elaborate organization, the Feds don't care for what they tried at all. Everyone's head will be had before the day is done.

(2) Shopping of Players is the least severe of the three but it deals with human traffic commerce, concentrated in urban areas preying on economically challenged youth - tantamount to slavery - again not good.

(3) With Colonial/Lowder, the Feds are looking for $2.9 Bln (that's with a "B") and they're pissed because we as taxpayers had to foot the bill to cover Dear Bobby's overdraft account. They want their money back, and they want it now. They don't take kindly to swindlers such as these and their conviction rate is pretty high.

This is all interesting stuff; however, I'm not sure what direct ties there are to college football. The only link is a guy who was involved in bribes is also a Auburn booster. That's not unusual as a person who could issue a $180K bribe probably is one of the few people in Alabama who could purchase a casino.

There is an interesting logic to conspiracy theorists. If a conspiracy theory is proved wrong, to the conspiracy theorist, the conspiracy only becomes that much great and complex. Sort of like the people who think JFK was shot by the mob or Castro or "others". JFK was shot by a guy out of a building window.

This is what I think happened. Cam Newton father probably talked to some parents when his son was at Florida and realized some of them took large sums of money. Some parents drink before games and they all sit together. Loose lips sink ships. The Newtons didn't take any money on his way to Florida or the church is father preached out of in Atlanta wouldn't have been a falling down mess. When his son left Florida to go to JUCO, he realized Cam's rerecruitment to another school could land him a large sum of money to remodel his church. Newton's father actually got to live the old saying, "If I knew then what I know now, I would have..." I think that is where the story ends. I really don't care what posters on a thread have to say about it unless they work for the NCAA, FBI or they are a Federal prosecutor.

[Hilltopper]

The originator of the massive thread I've been following posted a really brief summary today that gives a good idea of the scope of the FBI investigation. It appears that a lot more will become public by the end of January. Here's the brief summary of what to expect:

The FBI and DOJ are involved for three reasons. BingoGate, Lowder & Co., and the shopping of players. Look at the charges and understand the severity of each segment.

(1) BingoGate is an attack on the very foundation of Democracy - Maybe if it involved just one crook and politician, they would not be as concerned. But the depth and magnitude of this Network, combined with the ulterior motive to create such an elaborate organization, the Feds don't care for what they tried at all. Everyone's head will be had before the day is done.

(2) Shopping of Players is the least severe of the three but it deals with human traffic commerce, concentrated in urban areas preying on economically challenged youth - tantamount to slavery - again not good.

(3) With Colonial/Lowder, the Feds are looking for $2.9 Bln (that's with a "B") and they're pissed because we as taxpayers had to foot the bill to cover Dear Bobby's overdraft account. They want their money back, and they want it now. They don't take kindly to swindlers such as these and their conviction rate is pretty high.

This is all interesting stuff; however, I'm not sure what direct ties there are to college football. The only link is a guy who was involved in bribes is also a Auburn booster. That's not unusual as a person who could issue a $180K bribe probably is one of the few people in Alabama who could purchase a casino.

There is an interesting logic to conspiracy theorists. If a conspiracy theory is proved wrong, to the conspiracy theorist, the conspiracy only becomes that much great and complex. Sort of like the people who think JFK was shot by the mob or Castro or "others". JFK was shot by a guy out of a building window.

This is what I think happened. Cam Newton father probably talked to some parents when his son was at Florida and realized some of them took large sums of money. Some parents drink before games and they all sit together. Loose lips sink ships. The Newtons didn't take any money on his way to Florida or the church is father preached out of in Atlanta wouldn't have been a falling down mess. When his son left Florida to go to JUCO, he realized Cam's rerecruitment to another school could land him a large sum of money to remodel his church. Newton's father actually got to live the old saying, "If I knew then what I know now, I would have..." I think that is where the story ends. I really don't care what posters on a thread have to say about it unless they work for the NCAA, FBI or they are a Federal prosecutor.

So you agree that the real reason that the SEC is so good, is that they are all a bunch of cheaters?

[Dave in Green]

The human trafficking portion of the investigation goes beyond Auburn and the Newtons, and the story is being tracked by many major news organizations beyond an internet forum. It involves questionable agents hiding behind non-profit and pseudo-religious groups taking minors on "recruiting trips" across state lines without their parents' permission. The following Fox Sports story from one small town in Louisiana hints at what the FBI stumbled across while investigating bribery, gambling fraud and a major bank failure:

Fox Sports Story

[GP1]

So you agree that the real reason that the SEC is so good, is that they are all a bunch of cheaters?

No, I don't agree with the question. The reason the SEC is good goes far beyond money to climate, population, culture, etc.

Cheating going on in college football is like gambling going on in Casablanca. It goes on in the SEC...It goes on in the Big Ten....It goes on in the PAC 10...etc. It's going on everywhere and has been since the beginning of college athletics. The only difference is whether or not you get caught.

[ZachTheZip]

So you agree that the real reason that the SEC is so good, is that they are all a bunch of cheaters?

No, I don't agree with the question. The reason the SEC is good goes far beyond money to climate, population, culture, etc.

Cheating going on in college football is like gambling going on in Casablanca. It goes on in the SEC...It goes on in the Big Ten....It goes on in the PAC 10...etc. It's going on everywhere and has been since the beginning of college athletics. The only difference is whether or not you get caught.

The reason the SEC is so good is because of the practice of oversigning. The MAC needs to adapt this tactic until the NCAA closes the loophole.

[Dave in Green]

If "everyone is cheating" to gain an advantage, then the biggest cheaters would be more likely to gain the biggest advantage and become the biggest winners.

Recall that when SMU went down, SMU boosters were at the forefront of exposing other teams in their conference for doing similar cheating, and the whole conference suffered.

The biggest fear in the SEC right now is that if Auburn goes down, Auburn boosters will lead the charge to expose other SEC teams for doing similar things, and the SEC's current advantage over other conferences could be severely compromised.

[meatwad]

So you agree that the real reason that the SEC is so good, is that they are all a bunch of cheaters?

No, I don't agree with the question. The reason the SEC is good goes far beyond money to climate, population, culture, etc.

Cheating going on in college football is like gambling going on in Casablanca. It goes on in the SEC...It goes on in the Big Ten....It goes on in the PAC 10...etc. It's going on everywhere and has been since the beginning of college athletics. The only difference is whether or not you get caught.

The reason the SEC is so good is because of the practice of oversigning. The MAC needs to adapt this tactic until the NCAA closes the loophole.

Zach,

Thanks for posting that link. I honestly don't know why oversigning is not a major news story. I had vaguely heard of it, but that site clearly exposed the problems and unethical nature of it.

I hope you weren't serious when you said the MAC should do it too.

[Buckzip]

You can't spell ChEatS without SEC.

There is cheating everywhere. Like someone said, it depends if you get caught.

I don't know if the SECheats, cheats more than anyone else, I just think they are much more unethical than most other conferences as a whole.

Over signing, players being cut to make room for other players, supposed injury exemptions, and a lower entrance requirement for student athletes than other major conferences. There are a lot of players on SEC rosters that wouldn't qualify or keep elegibilty in other conferences.

I am not saying the SEC schools are not good schools. There are some great schools down there. I am talking only athletics.

I also disagree with weather being a huge difference maker and where talent is. There is talent everywhere.

There is a lot of talent in Ohio, PA, Michigan, Illinois too. SEC teams get more outdoor time because of weather and guys get more practice in than the guys in the north do. Guys are outside doing there own thing 365 days a year.

If weather was that much of a concern, Hawaii would be great.

I used to argue with some that would say USC got the great recruits because of the weather. Of course they could never counter when I asked what the excuse was for UCLA, SDSU, Cal, and all the other great weather teams.

Someone posted that schools from the north have to "steal" players from the south to be competitive. That is ludicrous.

If you look at the offers from the SEC schools, you will see they offer a lot of the same kids as OSU, ND, PSU, etc ,from the north. The difference is that it seems guys from the south are more likely to come to a north school, than guys from the North going to a south school. I agree that if you look at rosters, it appears that there are few guys from the north on the south rosters. It's because guys don't go there. It's not because the SEC schools aren't trying.

This is only an example, so no need to attack. But look at the OSU recruiting class. Nearly all of there commits were also offered by the big SEC schools. There is talent everywhere.

A big difference in the schools, IMHO, is coaching. Look at the coaching in the B10 compared to the coaching in the SEC.

It's not even close. The SEC has much better coaching top to bottom. Not just the head coaches either. Look at the assistants. There assistants are paid much higher than those in the B10. Florida just got Weis as their OC. he was a failure as a HC, but he is a former OC for a multiple super bowl winner. The SEC has the best coaching in all of college football and it's not really that close IMHO.

Until the B10 and other conferences, as a whole, decide to start paying for top notch coaches the SEC will continue to dominate.

The thing that is more amazing to me than the SEC winning these consecutive NC, is, other than UF, that it is by different teams. That is truly remarkable to me.

[GP1]

The reason the SEC is so good is because of the practice of oversigning.

Good point. ESPN recently did an Outside the Lines story on this. There are a few legal cases pending pertaining to oversigning that will prove to be very interesting.

[GP1]

Someone posted that schools from the north have to "steal" players from the south to be competitive. That is ludicrous.

If you look at the offers from the SEC schools, you will see they offer a lot of the same kids as OSU, ND, PSU, etc ,from the north. The difference is that it seems guys from the south are more likely to come to a north school, than guys from the North going to a south school. I agree that if you look at rosters, it appears that there are few guys from the north on the south rosters. It's because guys don't go there. It's not because the SEC schools aren't trying.

Maybe they look at the rosters of the schools in the south and figure they won't get on the field. If you are good enough to be offered a scholarship to an SEC school, you are probably more likely to get on the field sooner at a Big Ten school. Kids want to play. The same kid might sit on the bench for a couple years in the SEC and then get bounced because of oversigning.

One point about the SEC that nobody has made. This is going to come off as mean, but here it goes. You can be a near retard and get a scholarship to an SEC school if you are a good football player.

[Buckzip]

Someone posted that schools from the north have to "steal" players from the south to be competitive. That is ludicrous.

If you look at the offers from the SEC schools, you will see they offer a lot of the same kids as OSU, ND, PSU, etc ,from the north. The difference is that it seems guys from the south are more likely to come to a north school, than guys from the North going to a south school. I agree that if you look at rosters, it appears that there are few guys from the north on the south rosters. It's because guys don't go there. It's not because the SEC schools aren't trying.

Maybe they look at the rosters of the schools in the south and figure they won't get on the field. If you are good enough to be offered a scholarship to an SEC school, you are probably more likely to get on the field sooner at a Big Ten school. Kids want to play. The same kid might sit on the bench for a couple years in the SEC and then get bounced because of oversigning.

One point about the SEC that nobody has made. This is going to come off as mean, but here it goes. You can be a near retard and get a scholarship to an SEC school if you are a good football player.

You may be right about the playing time. There is no way to know though.

I did mention the grades to play at an SEC school are much more lax than most. That gives a huge advantage.

If you heard some of the interviews with SEC players during bowl games, you would realize the academic standards are less.

I respect the hell out of the programs that are top notch and have high standards. Stanford comes to mind immediately.

Although with Harbaugh leaving they will probably drop.

[Dave in Green]

USA Today joins the growing list of national media slowly beginning to focus in on Cam Newton and Auburn. Seems as if Auburn's athletic director told the media before the game that Auburn and Cam's father, Cecil, had reached an agreement that Cecil would not be attending the game. Then, of course, after the game, Cam ran up into the stands to embrace his father.

The funniest part of the USA Today story is how Newton's attorney tried to spin this to the media, as if Cecil could have been watching the game at a sports bar and been magically transported into the stands right where Cam was looking minutes after the game ended.

The national media is really beginning to smell blood in the water on this.

USA Today Story

[Zipmeister]

Someone posted that schools from the north have to "steal" players from the south to be competitive. That is ludicrous.

If you look at the offers from the SEC schools, you will see they offer a lot of the same kids as OSU, ND, PSU, etc ,from the north. The difference is that it seems guys from the south are more likely to come to a north school, than guys from the North going to a south school. I agree that if you look at rosters, it appears that there are few guys from the north on the south rosters. It's because guys don't go there. It's not because the SEC schools aren't trying.

Maybe they look at the rosters of the schools in the south and figure they won't get on the field. If you are good enough to be offered a scholarship to an SEC school, you are probably more likely to get on the field sooner at a Big Ten school. Kids want to play. The same kid might sit on the bench for a couple years in the SEC and then get bounced because of oversigning.

One point about the SEC that nobody has made. This is going to come off as mean, but here it goes. You can be a near retard and get a scholarship to an SEC school if you are a good football player.

That's how Forest Gump hooked up with Bama.

[Zipmeister]

Someone posted that schools from the north have to "steal" players from the south to be competitive. That is ludicrous.

If you look at the offers from the SEC schools, you will see they offer a lot of the same kids as OSU, ND, PSU, etc ,from the north. The difference is that it seems guys from the south are more likely to come to a north school, than guys from the North going to a south school. I agree that if you look at rosters, it appears that there are few guys from the north on the south rosters. It's because guys don't go there. It's not because the SEC schools aren't trying.

Maybe they look at the rosters of the schools in the south and figure they won't get on the field. If you are good enough to be offered a scholarship to an SEC school, you are probably more likely to get on the field sooner at a Big Ten school. Kids want to play. The same kid might sit on the bench for a couple years in the SEC and then get bounced because of oversigning.

One point about the SEC that nobody has made. This is going to come off as mean, but here it goes. You can be a near retard and get a scholarship to an SEC school if you are a good football player.

You may be right about the playing time. There is no way to know though.

I did mention the grades to play at an SEC school are much more lax than most. That gives a huge advantage.

If you heard some of the interviews with SEC players during bowl games, you would realize the academic standards are less.

I respect the hell out of the programs that are top notch and have high standards. Stanford comes to mind immediately.

Although with Harbaugh leaving they will probably drop.

Excellent prognostication. Anyone familiar with that school knows they were considered the LSU of California before Harbaugh became their coach.

[GP1]

I respect the hell out of the programs that are top notch and have high standards. Stanford comes to mind immediately.

Although with Harbaugh leaving they will probably drop.

In football, Stanford normallyis to the Pac10 what Northwestern is to the Big Ten, what Vandy is to the SEC, what Baylor is to the Big 12 and what Wake/Duke are to the ACC and what Columbia is to the Ivy League (I have no idea where I pulled that last one out of). At times they get good, but most of the time they are average at best. I guess on some leve I respect them, but I wouldn't be stupid enough to be a season ticket holder to one of the......wait a minute, I am a season ticket holder to one of them.

[Buckzip]

I respect the hell out of the programs that are top notch and have high standards. Stanford comes to mind immediately.

Although with Harbaugh leaving they will probably drop.

In football, Stanford normallyis to the Pac10 what Northwestern is to the Big Ten, what Vandy is to the SEC, what Baylor is to the Big 12 and what Wake/Duke are to the ACC and what Columbia is to the Ivy League (I have no idea where I pulled that last one out of). At times they get good, but most of the time they are average at best. I guess on some leve I respect them, but I wouldn't be stupid enough to be a season ticket holder to one of the......wait a minute, I am a season ticket holder to one of them.

I agree. You are absolutely correct. But this past season is all I am talking about. I think Stanford is a little above Vandy, Wake, Duke and Baylor. They are in the middle of the PAC of the PAC 10 usually.

It was great to see a school with very high standards make it to and win a BCS game. I doubt you will see that very often.

[johnnyzip84]

One point about the SEC that nobody has made. This is going to come off as mean, but here it goes. You can be a near retard and get a scholarship to an SEC school if you are a good football player.

That's how Forest Gump hooked up with Bama.

Your best line in a long time!

[Blue & Gold]

One point about the SEC that nobody has made. This is going to come off as mean, but here it goes. You can be a near retard and get a scholarship to an SEC school if you are a good football player.

That's how Forest Gump hooked up with Bama.

Your best line in a long time!

Agreed. The 'Meister's best line in a LOOOOOOOOOONG time!

[Dave in Green]

I mentioned earlier that this was a deadly serious case due to the deaths under questionable circumstances of several people who might be loosely associated with certain aspects of the case.

In addition, one of those indicted was reported to have been previously investigated by the FBI in connection with a suspected a murder for hire case, and that same person has been charged in this case with threatening an FBI agent.

The latest development on this front is that the former casino lobbyist who last month pled guilty and agreed to testify against the others turned himself in to authorities today. He requested to begin serving time immediately in a federal prison even though he will not be sentenced until this September.

There is much speculation that he wanted to be placed in prison immediately for his own self protection because he didn't want to end up dead with a gunshot to the head or in a plastic bag at the bottom of a pond as happened to those mentioned above.

Still no direct connection between this and Auburn football, the Newtons or pay for play. But more is expected to become public in the coming weeks and months as investigations by the FBI, Department of Justice, NCAA and SEC continue.

Associated Press Story

[Dave in Green]

Here's a brief update on my previous post above about the self-confessed lobbyist in the Alabama gambling scandal who volunteered to start serving his prison sentence long before he actually went to court to receive his sentence. Yet another person indicted in this case had his bond revoked after a judge found him guilty of trying to bribe the lobbyist above into not revealing all he knew about others in the case:

The Gadsden (Alabama) Times Link

Another area potentially related to human trafficking and pay-for-play that is coming under scrutiny is the way that various organizations are conducting seven-on-seven youth football. It's believed that some of these organizations may be getting paid off to steer the youths to certain schools. The NCAA has recently taken an interest in this, and Sports Illustrated had a big story on it today:

Sports Illustrated Link

[GP1]

Another area potentially related to human trafficking and pay-for-play that is coming under scrutiny is the way that various organizations are conducting seven-on-seven youth football. It's believed that some of these organizations may be getting paid off to steer the youths to certain schools. The NCAA has recently taken an interest in this, and Sports Illustrated had a big story on it today:

Sports Illustrated Link

I like the AAU comparison. Something always smelled funny to me about AAU basketball.

[Dave in Green]

There must be millions of posts on various internet forums about whether or not Auburn is the biggest cheater in college football, and whether or not the Alabama gambling scandal will spill over into college football and take Auburn down. I know that most folks on Zips Nation aren't interested in the preliminaries, and are waiting for the big hammer to fall somewhere if it ever does. So I try not to post everything here that grabs my interest on the subject.

I think the following post is interesting because it comes from someone closely related to another SEC school. It sounds credible, but I can't vouch for that. It could be a figment of someone's imagination, which is common on internet sports forums. But it made me think about how dominant the SEC has become in college football, and how SEC schools are probably pushing the envelope more than other conferences. But if they think one of their own has crossed the line, it has to burn them that they may have lost their shot at the national championship because another SEC school literally ripped the envelope to shreds.

With that said, here's a post I found more interesting than most (UGA = University of Georgia and AU = Auburn University):

...for the first time I can confirm that UGA has some real concerns about how AU is conducting its business on the recruiting trail. For a while, my thoughts were that they were aware of what was going on but were taking a passive wait and see stance. Now I know that is definitely not the case.

Not going to get into names because nothing good to come from that. Can tell you for 100% fact however that UGA is in the process of gathering information and that it will be submitted through the proper channels. This isn't stuff involving boosters and fans. This is information being gathered by members of the administration and the athletic department (compliance). They feel what they have gathered so far is real and needs to be heard.

Of major concern is the obvious (extra benefits) and the methods used to contact prospects ie going around HS coaches. The latter isn't necessarily against NCAA rules but there are HS coaches in Georgia that aren't happy about a lot of "off campus" meetings arranged by the AU coaching staff without the knowledge of the HS coach.

Sorry if this is vague but I am glad they are doing the things they are doing. Coach Richt and his staff are under a tremendous amount of pressure and being undermined by this kind of stuff in your back yard is reason to speak up.

[Dave in Green]

While Auburn supporters continue to tell everyone that the NCAA is no longer investigating Auburn on play-for-pay issues, Fox Sports reports today that "NCAA expands probe into Auburn recruiting":

Fox Sports Link

[Dave in Green]

Latest developments in this case are that a key executive in Alabama's Colonial Bank fraud case that led to the bank's failure has pled guilty and agreed to testify against others, and an even higher-ranking executive has announced intention to plead guilty.

On Thursday, the former treasurer at Taylor Bean, Desiree Brown, pleaded guilty to conspiracy to commit bank, wire and securities fraud and faces up to 30 years in prison and a $250,000 fine when she is sentenced in June in the Eastern District of Virginia.

Court records show that Catherine L. Kissick, the senior vice president and director of Colonial's Institutional Services Division and Mortgage Warehouse Lending Division, is scheduled to enter a plea Wednesday before U.S. District Leonie M. Brinkema. Kissick is believed to be a co-conspirator in a $1.9 billion fraud scheme involving high-level officials at both institutions.

Speculation is that their testimony will result in Bobby Lowder being indicted as the big fish in this bank fraud case. Lowder, known for his micromanagement style while controlling Colonial Bank as CEO for 25 years, is also known for his similar style in managing Auburn University's athletic programs as a member of Auburn's board of directors for nearly three decades. He is currently sitting chairman of Auburn's finance committee, and is suspected by many of being the key person behind any Auburn football indiscretions that may come out as a result of wiretaps related to the bank failure and Alabama gambling bribery cases.

Short summary is that the fed's investigation is gathering speed, and if there turns out to be a connection to college football, the whole house of cards will be getting shaky. Latest speculation on that front is that the SEC may take a heavy hit in this, with the scandal extending beyond Auburn.

Too much speculation on too many fronts to cite all the possibilities here. But some are saying if pay-for-play is found to run deep in the SEC and college football in general that the U.S. Congress may get involved, and it could shake the NCAA to its core.

So the title of this thread remains accurate: Potential College Football Scandal.

Court Plea Story