Roles of new and previously limited PT players in 2012-13

[GJGood]

How much playing time and how important of a role do you all see the incoming freshman and returning inexperienced players on the Zips roster getting in 2012-13?

I am particularly interested in how much playing time some of the returnees like Justice, Ibitayo, and Egner will be getting next season. How big a role would you like to see these guys and the incoming freshmen have next season? How deep can the rotation go effectively?

[Blue & Gold]

I think Mello is going to have to come right in and contribute meaningful minutes at backup PG.

I really don't know what kind of contributions Ibitayo & Justice can make on our current team. They both seem like odd-men-out as we don't really run w/a 2-guard anymore. We seem to want to run w/a PG & 2 wings. Ibitayo, though only 6'3", with his 6'9" wingspan could probably fill that role. Justice however, I see as a role player who comes in and just strokes the 3.

Egner's been, to me, very underwhelming. I hope he can give some quality minutes next year. Losing Nik, we're going to be thin in the post (Zeke, Tree, Harney... Egner.) Three post players, however, may be sufficient.

Once things shake out (around 1/3rd-ish of the way into next season?) this is how I envision our rotation:

PG: Rico, Mello

W: Gilliam, Walsh, Q

P: Zeke, Tree, Harney

That's a solid 8-man rotation. All contributors. All getting plenty of PT.

I think incoming wings Kretzer (6'7") & McAdams (6'6") will both be redshirted and made ready to take over for Gilliam and Q the following year.

[akronzips71]

I think Mello is going to have to come right in and contribute meaningful minutes at backup PG.

I really don't know what kind of contributions Ibitayo & Justice can make on our current team. They both seem like odd-men-out as we don't really run w/a 2-guard anymore. We seem to want to run w/a PG & 2 wings. Ibitayo, though only 6'3", with his 6'9" wingspan could probably fill that role. Justice however, I see as a role player who comes in and just strokes the 3.

Egner's been, to me, very underwhelming. I hope he can give some quality minutes next year. Losing Nik, we're going to be thin in the post (Zeke, Tree, Harney... Egner.) Three post players, however, may be sufficient.

Once things shake out (around 1/3rd-ish of the way into next season?) this is how I envision our rotation:

PG: Rico, Mello

W: Gilliam, Walsh, Q

P: Zeke, Tree, Harney

That's a solid 8-man rotation. All contributors. All getting plenty of PT.

I think incoming wings Kretzer (6'7") & McAdams (6'6") will both be redshirted and made ready to take over for Gilliam and Q the following year.

I don't think McAdams will be a redshirt. He was heavily recruited as a quarterback, and probably could have been a starter in football somewhere in Div I. He is going to want to play his chosen sport, or he could walk.

[Quickzips]

Egner: Best case scenario he plays 15 minutes a night split between backup C and a few minutes at PF. He gives us some energy and defense off the bench, along with a few fouls. Not much different than a shorter, but more athletic Mike Bardo. Worst case scenario is that he doesn't see the floor most of the season (for a 3rd straight year), leaving us pretty thin in the frontcourt and he transfers out at the end of the year.

Ibitayo: I can actually see a role for him next year if he has his head committed to defense. He could do well in this league as a defensive stopper coming in against guys like Kellogg, Holt and Offut. He will have to also develop his outside shot some more. KD simply does not play guards/wings who can't stroke it from 3. Best case scenario, he sees 15 minutes per night as a defensive specialist.

Justice: Very curious to see what he can provide to this team, but I don't think we will ever get the chance. There just aren't enough minutes to go around at the 1/2/3 spots for us and Blake by all accounts seems like the odd man out. I wouldn't be surprised to see him pull a Michael Green and transfer out in search of playing time around mid-season.

Betancourt: As others have said, we need him to be able to play 10-15 minutes per night as Abreu's backup and do it right away. Q as our backup PG is a less than ideal situation for us, and Carmelo is touted as a guy who should be able to contribute meaningful minutes right away. A lot of reports say that between Carmelo and Alex, Melo is the better player. If that holds true I will be VERY happy with our PG situation for the next 4 years.

McAdams: Redshirt. I don't buy for a second that redshirting him will cause him to transfer right away. There is a reason he chose basketball despite bigger offers in football. If he really wants to make his mark in hoops he is going to have to wait a year for playing time. He isn't going to get much behind Walsh, Gilliam, Q and possibly Ibitayo/Justice.

Kretzer: Redshirt. Much like McAdams, he is going to have to wait his turn.

[skip-zip]

Betancourt: As others have said, we need him to be able to play 10-15 minutes per night as Abreu's backup and do it right away. Q as our backup PG is a less than ideal situation for us, and Carmelo is touted as a guy who should be able to contribute meaningful minutes right away. A lot of reports say that between Carmelo and Alex, Melo is the better player. If that holds true I will be VERY happy with our PG situation for the next 4 years.

This is exactly what I am hearing too. If it's true, look out. I'm a skeptic when it comes to newcomers, but I think this is the most optimistic I have ever been about a guy possibly coming in and having the potential to be a star very quickly.

[odhgibo]

Egner: Best case scenario he plays 15 minutes a night split between backup C and a few minutes at PF. He gives us some energy and defense off the bench, along with a few fouls. Not much different than a shorter, but more athletic Mike Bardo. Worst case scenario is that he doesn't see the floor most of the season (for a 3rd straight year), leaving us pretty thin in the frontcourt and he transfers out at the end of the year.

Having seen Egner for several years at Jackson, I never thought of him as a D1 back-to-the-basket post player. I definitely do not see him filling the same role as Mike Bardo did in 2010-11. Even to get the point where he could fill a Nik-like role, he would need to add ~20 pounds and change (or adapt) his mindset.

On the flip side, his outside shot isn't consistent enough to permit him to play a true wing.

He's a bit of a tweener, much like Harney. Both can slash and pick up some garbage points off rebounds, although Harney's offensive game is more polished than Egner's.

In HS, Egner was best when he could freelance on D and run the floor on O. Neither of those sound like a Coach KD team, do they?

Mark Henniger appears to be in a similar situation at that school to the east: not a good fit for the system. The only time he left the bench from February onward was during a timeout.

I have no basis for this, but I wouldn't be surprised to see one or both depart prior to next year (perhaps joining their HS coach who now is at Mount Union or their HS PG at Walsh?). I'm not rooting for it, but it wouldn't surprise me.

[K92]

If we have a freshman (Betancourt) coming in who is better than our best player (Abreu), things are looking up for the Zips. I hope CB comes as advertised.

[Zipmeister]

I think Mello is going to have to come right in and contribute meaningful minutes at backup PG.

I really don't know what kind of contributions Ibitayo & Justice can make on our current team. They both seem like odd-men-out as we don't really run w/a 2-guard anymore. We seem to want to run w/a PG & 2 wings. Ibitayo, though only 6'3", with his 6'9" wingspan could probably fill that role. Justice however, I see as a role player who comes in and just strokes the 3.

Egner's been, to me, very underwhelming. I hope he can give some quality minutes next year. Losing Nik, we're going to be thin in the post (Zeke, Tree, Harney... Egner.) Three post players, however, may be sufficient.

Once things shake out (around 1/3rd-ish of the way into next season?) this is how I envision our rotation:

PG: Rico, Mello

W: Gilliam, Walsh, Q

P: Zeke, Tree, Harney

That's a solid 8-man rotation. All contributors. All getting plenty of PT.

I think incoming wings Kretzer (6'7") & McAdams (6'6") will both be redshirted and made ready to take over for Gilliam and Q the following year.

I'm willing to place a small wager on McAdams redshirting. That Kid can fill it up.

[akronzips71]

I'm willing to place a small wager on McAdams redshirting. That Kid can fill it up.

Are you betting for or against?

[Quickzips]

I'll chime in again here on the Reggie redshirt situation.

This is strictly my view on things, with no real inside information.

Reggie is going to be a wing on this team. He has some skills that could allow him to play PG in a pinch, but with Abreu and presumably Betancourt getting the bulk of the minutes at PG, I doubt you will see Reggie bringing the ball up the court and triggering the offense for us too much, particularly next season. I also feel like Q, Walsh and Deji would all see PG minutes before Reggie would at this point.

On the wing you already have 3 established players in Q, Gilliam and Walsh who will each play 20+ minutes per night. We lose McClanahan who was barely seeing 10 minutes per night by the end of the season. I expect that those 10 minutes will go to Q while the 10 minutes or so per night that Q played at PG will go to Betancourt. For clarification sake, here are the minutes from last season and the minutes I expect to see this year from our PG's and Wings.

2011/12

Abreu-30

Diggs-25

Walsh-25

McClanahan-19

Gilliam-17

Other (Harney/Ibitayo/Oldam/etc.)-4

2012/13

Abreu-30 (same as last year)

Diggs-28 (10 less minutes at PG (to Betancourt), 13 more minutes per night on the wing (from McClanahan)).

Walsh-25 (same as last year)

Gilliam-23 (6 more minutes per night (from McClanahan)).

Betancourt-10 (from Diggs' PG minutes)

That still leaves 4 more minutes on the wings. Which leads to two questions:

1) Is it really worth burning the redshirt on Reggie for 4 minutes per night?

2) Who of the above listed 5 do you take minutes away from to get Reggie more run?

For me, the answer to 1 is a resounding no. I've watched us make that mistake with Euton, Egner and Ibitayo the last 2 seasons. I don't want to see us waste another redshirt season this year. Particularly given how deep this team is. I think you can fill out the remaining minutes on the wing with some combo of Harney (in a big lineup), Ibitayo or Justice and be perfectly fine.

In regards to 2, I don't see anyone you can take minutes away from barring an injury. Abreu is the catalyst for this team and will likely get all the minutes he can handle. Diggs is the reigning 6th man of the year and our most diverse player on both ends of the floor. Walsh is probably our most consistent player all around. Maybe you take a few minutes away from Gilliam, but personally, I don't think I am the only one on here who wanted to see more of Chauncey at times last year. Betancourt gives us a true PG to give Abreu a blow as needed. Outside of Abreu and maybe Diggs it wouldn't hurt to find a few more minutes for each of those 5.

So to my mind, unless Reggie comes into camp and is just an obvious world beater and we are going to be a significantly better team with him on the floor right away, I think you almost have to redshirt him. Then in 2013/2014 you will be without Diggs and Gilliam and Reggie should be in line for plenty of playing time.

Anyways, that is just my .02. Feel free to disagree. We have another 7 months to find out.

[Z.I.P.]

From everything I've heard, MacAdams could be the best freshman in the MAC next year. I see him challenging Tree and Harney for PT right away.

Now...if Justice and Egner were to decide their futures were brighter elsewhere, could we bring in better alternatives for 12-13?

[GJGood]

I'd actually like to see Justice earn some playing time. Going into this recently completed season I heard a lot of the same expectations for him that I heard for Gilliam, and he has turned out all right.

[Dave in Green]

The "curse" of a team getting more and more qualified players is that there's not enough PT to go around, and some pretty good players end up on the bench, or transferring.

Quickzips has done a great job of summarizing my thoughts. There are always intangibles and surprises. But the starting point for me is that the Zips are returning 7 players from this season's regular rotation, and 2 more players with at least a fair amount of sub time. That's a total of 9 players who are familiar with the system from game experience.

I have to agree from everything I've heard that it would be a shock if Bettancourt does not get at least modest backup minutes at the point. That's 10 players. Then there are those who believe that Justice and MacAdams are too talented to sit. Now we're up to 12 players.

And then there are those who are calling for a shorter rotation of 7-8 players.

I wish I could predict who's going to rise to the occasion and who's going to get left behind. But I've been surprised many times in the past, and I expect to be surprised when next season unfolds.

[Captain Kangaroo]

Egner: Best case scenario he plays 15 minutes a night split between backup C and a few minutes at PF. He gives us some energy and defense off the bench, along with a few fouls. Not much different than a shorter, but more athletic Mike Bardo. Worst case scenario is that he doesn't see the floor most of the season (for a 3rd straight year), leaving us pretty thin in the frontcourt and he transfers out at the end of the year.

Ibitayo: I can actually see a role for him next year if he has his head committed to defense. He could do well in this league as a defensive stopper coming in against guys like Kellogg, Holt and Offut. He will have to also develop his outside shot some more. KD simply does not play guards/wings who can't stroke it from 3. Best case scenario, he sees 15 minutes per night as a defensive specialist.

Justice: Very curious to see what he can provide to this team, but I don't think we will ever get the chance. There just aren't enough minutes to go around at the 1/2/3 spots for us and Blake by all accounts seems like the odd man out. I wouldn't be surprised to see him pull a Michael Green and transfer out in search of playing time around mid-season.

Betancourt: As others have said, we need him to be able to play 10-15 minutes per night as Abreu's backup and do it right away. Q as our backup PG is a less than ideal situation for us, and Carmelo is touted as a guy who should be able to contribute meaningful minutes right away. A lot of reports say that between Carmelo and Alex, Melo is the better player. If that holds true I will be VERY happy with our PG situation for the next 4 years.

McAdams: Redshirt. I don't buy for a second that redshirting him will cause him to transfer right away. There is a reason he chose basketball despite bigger offers in football. If he really wants to make his mark in hoops he is going to have to wait a year for playing time. He isn't going to get much behind Walsh, Gilliam, Q and possibly Ibitayo/Justice.

Kretzer: Redshirt. Much like McAdams, he is going to have to wait his turn.

Egner: Needs to get a lot stronger in the off season to have any chance of PT in 2012-13. How will he lift weights with a bad back?

Ibitayo: Long arms, and a long shot for meaningful minutes in 2012-13. He was very overmatched in his limited PT this season. Maybe due to injury, but my gut says he's a major project. Maybe a Conyers-like development curve.

Justice: I predict he's a surprise contributor for 2012-13, assuming he can hit the open 3. Look at OU's build - A bunch of guards who can nail 3-pointers. Justice could be our Kellog/Offutt?

Betancourt: Biggest addition for 2012-13. Any 2011-12 guard other than Abreu dribbled and passed like their hands we on fire. Diggs will really benefit from Melo's addition.

McAdams: I agree. Redshirt. I think he'll be a Linhart-type player. Tough kid, just needs to get stronger for D1 college hoops.

Kretzer: I agree - Redshirt. Great potential, but no room on the floor this season

[Hilltopper]

I would love to see the Zips be able to redshirt as many incoming freshmen as possible. KD has been a little too quick in burning redshirts the last few seasons. I agree with CK's assement of Justice. We need as many 3 point shooters as we can get, to spread the floor and give Zeke et all some room to work.