Penn State - What should NCAA do?

[LZIp]

Criminal acts were committed against children. Let the criminal justice system deal with that. They've done quite a bit so far. If it were a matter of Penn State Athletics illegally creating an advantage on the playing field, then let the NCAA deals with that.

The thing is, Penn State DID create a competitive advantage. Penn State swept this under the rug to protect their image. It would have had a negative impact on the school and football program even if it were self-reported. They would have lost blue-chip players, affecting the programs performance. It would have had an impact on Joe Pa in recruiting with his "Penn State way".

[GP1]

In this case, what's odd is that the NCAA may have just destroyed the economy of Central Pennsylvania.

I don't know about the whole economy of central PA, but there will be people impacted.

Who else is impacted? Well, how about the loads of Title IX programs the revenue from the football team was carrying? psu is going to have to make cuts.

What about the Big Ten? They basically just lost one of the only three teams people around the US have any interest in. I don't think psu vs. Big Ten Team X is going to be quite the draw it once was. An average-good conference just became average. I wouldn't be surprised if the Big Ten gives the boot to psu within 10 years.

This is the whole point about fear leading to suffering. It isn't going to happen tomorrow, but a lot of innocent people will suffer because of this penalty. The ncaa took the path to the Dark Side today.

[GP1]

The thing is, Penn State DID create a competitive advantage. Penn State swept this under the rug to protect their image. It would have had a negative impact on the school and football program even if it were self-reported. They would have lost blue-chip players, affecting the programs performance. It would have had an impact on Joe Pa in recruiting with his "Penn State way".

Or, the problem could have been dealt with in a proactive manner that wouldn't have had such drastic results. Paterno could have been forced to step down years ago and a modern coach could have taken control of the team. psu would be a lot better off today.

It is a leap of logic I'm not willing to take to believe a competitive edge was created by this. One could easily argue Paterno staying around for as long as he did kept psu at a competitive disadvantage.

[Dave in Green]

Everyone wants anyone remotely connected to the Sandusky case to be harshly punished because the crime was so heinous. But there's a reason why Lady Justice is usually depicted wearing a blindfold. The scales in her right hand measure the pros and cons of a case, the double-edge sword in her left hand symbolizes the power of reason and justice, and the blindfold represents blind justice and impartiality without fear or favor.

The question here is whether the NCAA's swift action represents the spirit of Lady Justice that most Americans believe helps make this country so great, or was it a premature, emotional reaction to demonstrate to the public that the NCAA is just as horrified and angry about what happened at PSU as the American public?

For every journalist who's already written that PSU got exactly what it deserved from the NCAA, there's another saying, wait a minute, let's try to look at this a little more dispassionately and analytically and try to understand if the NCAA may have overstepped its authority here:

NCAA's Mark Emmert overstepped bounds in hammering Penn State

NCAA deals unprecedented blow

And Graham Spanier, the number one man at PSU when the crimes were covered up, hasn't even had a chance to be heard yet:

Graham Spanier wants to be heard

The facts were all in on Sandusky's actions. He got his fair trial and justice was served. The rest is still a big, hot, stinking mess that's yet to be completely untangled. But the usually slow and deliberate NCAA has already swung its sword, and now, for better or worse, it has to live with the ultimate results of that action every bit as much as PSU.

This is far from over.

[Class of 82]

I know I'm spot on. Fans are the same everywhere. After what I saw last year, I won't go to another Zips game until they are better. My time is too valuable to me. I still love them, but I can't put time/money into something that doesn't make me happy. Teams win, lots of fans go to games. Teams lose, lots of fans stop going. At the end of the day, it is a financial transaction. If fans see the value in going to a game, they will spend their money to go. If they don't, they won't. The fair weather fan is the best type of all because he cares and won't accept watching crap.

Lol... you're not only insightful and thoughtful, but humble to boot!

I generally agree with what you say here, but Penn State football isn't going to die simply because their future teams won't win very often. That will just be gasoline on a fire that's already fully involved the entire building.

You still have objective reasons to love Akron and the Zips, whether you go to watch them lose or not. Quite a few Penn State fans and alumni are wondering if there's anything left for them to love.

[skip-zip]

I don't know about the whole economy of central PA, but there will be people impacted.

Who else is impacted? Well, how about the loads of Title IX programs the revenue from the football team was carrying? psu is going to have to make cuts.

What about the Big Ten? They basically just lost one of the only three teams people around the US have any interest in. I don't think psu vs. Big Ten Team X is going to be quite the draw it once was. An average-good conference just became average. I wouldn't be surprised if the Big Ten gives the boot to psu within 10 years.

This is the whole point about fear leading to suffering. It isn't going to happen tomorrow, but a lot of innocent people will suffer because of this penalty. The ncaa took the path to the Dark Side today.

You might as well just keep adding to the list. How about every buisness engaged in the sale of Penn State merchandise?

I actually hadn't even thought about the impact on the interest in Big 10 football. And that was a league that was already struggling to keep pace nationally.

[Class of 82]

Everyone wants anyone remotely connected to the Sandusky case to be harshly punished because the crime was so heinous. But there's a reason why Lady Justice is usually depicted wearing a blindfold. The scales in her right hand measure the pros and cons of a case, the double-edge sword in her left hand symbolizes the power of reason and justice, and the blindfold represents blind justice and impartiality without fear or favor.

The question here is whether the NCAA's swift action represents the spirit of Lady Justice that most Americans believe helps make this country so great, or was it a premature, emotional reaction to demonstrate to the public that the NCAA is just as horrified and angry about what happened at PSU as the American public?

For every journalist who's already written that PSU got exactly what it deserved from the NCAA, there's another saying, wait a minute, let's try to look at this a little more dispassionately and analytically and try to understand if the NCAA may have overstepped its authority here:

NCAA's Mark Emmert overstepped bounds in hammering Penn State

NCAA deals unprecedented blow

And Graham Spanier, the number one man at PSU when the crimes were covered up, hasn't even had a chance to be heard yet:

Graham Spanier wants to be heard

The facts were all in on Sandusky's actions. He got his fair trial and justice was served. The rest is still a big, hot, stinking mess that's yet to be completely untangled. But the usually slow and deliberate NCAA has already swung its sword, and now, for better or worse, it has to live with the ultimate results of that action every bit as much as PSU.

This is far from over.

Agreed... in spades.

[GP1]

The question here is whether the NCAA's swift action represents the spirit of Lady Justice that most Americans believe helps make this country so great, or was it a premature, emotional reaction to demonstrate to the public that the NCAA is just as horrified and angry about what happened at PSU as the American public?

I'd respectfully say there is a third option at work.

That option is the creation of a tyrant in the president of the ncaa. The ncaa members today gave dictatorial powers to the president of the ncaa, just like the Galactic Senate gave power to the Sith Emperor in Star Wars. In Star Wars, the Senate gives up power because they lived in FEAR of some uprisings so they created a dictator and it brought everyone suffering because fear leads to suffering and the Dark Side. Everytime something comes up now, the ncaa members are going to want their dictator to deal with it because they are in fear of having to do anything about it. No good is going to come out of what happened today.

[LZIp]

Or, the problem could have been dealt with in a proactive manner that wouldn't have had such drastic results. Paterno could have been forced to step down years ago and a modern coach could have taken control of the team. psu would be a lot better off today.

It is a leap of logic I'm not willing to take to believe a competitive edge was created by this.

1. I agree with the first paragraph, the results would not have been as "drastic", but there would have been a negative impact nonetheless.

2. You are in denial if, after my post, you do not believe a competitive advantage was not created by the cover up.

[GP1]

I actually hadn't even thought about the impact on the interest in Big 10 football. And that was a league that was already struggling to keep pace nationally.

My brother just sent me a text saying, "Welcome to the Big Ten Notre Dame." Notre Dame isn't a better program than psu, but they have a big name. Short term it is a good move. I think the statement, Big Hat, No Cattle (or something like that) applies to Notre Dame.

[LZIp]

Everyone wants anyone remotely connected to the Sandusky case to be harshly punished because the crime was so heinous. But there's a reason why Lady Justice is usually depicted wearing a blindfold. The scales in her right hand measure the pros and cons of a case, the double-edge sword in her left hand symbolizes the power of reason and justice, and the blindfold represents blind justice and impartiality without fear or favor.

The question here is whether the NCAA's swift action represents the spirit of Lady Justice that most Americans believe helps make this country so great, or was it a premature, emotional reaction to demonstrate to the public that the NCAA is just as horrified and angry about what happened at PSU as the American public?

For every journalist who's already written that PSU got exactly what it deserved from the NCAA, there's another saying, wait a minute, let's try to look at this a little more dispassionately and analytically and try to understand if the NCAA may have overstepped its authority here:

NCAA's Mark Emmert overstepped bounds in hammering Penn State

NCAA deals unprecedented blow

And Graham Spanier, the number one man at PSU when the crimes were covered up, hasn't even had a chance to be heard yet:

Graham Spanier wants to be heard

The facts were all in on Sandusky's actions. He got his fair trial and justice was served. The rest is still a big, hot, stinking mess that's yet to be completely untangled. But the usually slow and deliberate NCAA has already swung its sword, and now, for better or worse, it has to live with the ultimate results of that action every bit as much as PSU.

This is far from over.

Penn State is not required to be a member of the NCAA. If they dont like it, they can just leave.

[LZIp]

My brother just sent me a text saying, "Welcome to the Big Ten Notre Dame." Notre Dame isn't a better program than psu, but they have a big name. Short term it is a good move. I think the statement, Big Hat, No Cattle (or something like that) applies to Notre Dame.

I despise Notre Dame and their fans. Lets add another program that is associated with centuries of child molestation coverups.

With that said, Notre Dame and Nebraska are better additions than Missouri and Texas A&M

[GP1]

2. You are in denial if, after my post, you do not believe a competitive advantage was not created by the cover up.

Paterno turning Sandusky into the cops, standing up for a thorough investigation/prosecution and standing up against child abuse would have made him even more popular. It would have reinforced what people believe when they thought of Paterno: Honor, Integrity, etc. People wouldn't have had enough good things to say about him.

[LZIp]

Paterno turning Sandusky into the cops, standing up for a thorough investigation/prosecution and standing up against child abuse would have made him even more popular. It would have reinforced what people believe when they thought of Paterno: Honor, Integrity, etc. People wouldn't have had enough good things to say about him.

So do you believe a child molestor being caught working for the football program wouldn't have caused 1 recruit to stray away from Penn State.

Some weirdo fan, yes just a fan, posted a picture of Alex Anzalone on twitter. Anzalone found out he was a sex offender and decommited immediately.

These situations do have an impact.

[Class of 82]

Penn State is not required to be a member of the NCAA. If they dont like it, they can just leave.

The problem, as I see it, LZip is that the NCAA simply made a calculation that the wisest public-relations course for them to take was to pile on and pile on now while the story remains a hot topic and while they could strong-arm the university into accepting just about anything the NCAA believes can make the NCAA look both responsible and all-powerful. And believe me, this whole NCAA thing is all about public relations. It has zilch to do with anything that might be called justice, not to mention integrity or honesty.

The point Dave was making is that a huge part of the idea of justice in this country is due process, where judgments are meted out only after full consideration of all available facts. Indeed, due process is written all over the NCAA's bylaws. Members are supposedly entitled to it... unless, we've now discovered, the NCAA decides maintaining its image is more important than the rights of member institutions.

And make no mistake... as much as they tried to strongly imply that this was a "one-time" event that sets no precedent for the future, that is an outright falsehood. They just let a genie out of a bottle, and it's never going back in again.

[Dr Z]

My brother just sent me a text saying, "Welcome to the Big Ten Notre Dame."

Text him this back.

[GP1]

So do you believe a child molestor being caught working for the football program wouldn't have caused 1 recruit to stray away from Penn State.

Some weirdo fan, yes just a fan, posted a picture of Alex Anzalone on twitter. Anzalone found out he was a sex offender and decommited immediately.

These situations do have an impact.

No doubt they have an impact. Handled properly, a negative can be turned into a positive.

One recruit might stay away. Handled properly, ten more might replace him.

Anzalone was pretty squishy about going to tosu in the first place and the whole twitter thing was his reason for getting out of something he was having second thoughts about.

[GP1]

Text him this back.

I can't read it because I'm not an important Insider. Does the article say something like, "nd is a good fit for the acc as they are pitt and syracuse bad and the existing membership doesn't have to worry about them dominating the league like va tech and miami did when they entered."

nd joins the acc and they are in the wilderness of college football five years from now. they have some hope if they join the big ten.

[Zipmeister]

Text him this back.

Or you could text this back.

[akronzips71]

Akron offer Ross Douglas has decommitted to PSU.

You link also says he has no interest.

[Zipmeister]

You link also says he has no interest.

If major scandals turn up at about 19 other schools, I think we have a shot.

[ZachTheZip]

Does this mean that we won one more game in the 1999, 2004, 2006, and 2009 seasons?

[Zipgrad01]

Does this mean that we won one more game in the 1999, 2004, 2006, and 2009 seasons?

No. It is like the game never happened. We don't get awarded wins.

[Zipmeister]

While watching Mark Emmert, head NCAA guy, hand down sanctions yesterday I couldn't help but notice that beautiful hair. How this guy isn't a U.S. Congressman is beyond me. He looks exactly like 80% of them.

[Hilltopper]

Marla gets it right.

Some might believe the NCAA overstepped its bounds. But there are no bounds when Sandusky was convicted on 45 counts of abuse of 10 boys from disadvantaged homes, lured by Sandusky’s ties to the football program even after he retired in 1999. There are more victims, including one of Sandusky’s adopted sons who volunteered to testify. According to the Freeh Report, Paterno convinced Penn State officials to look the other way starting in 1998, allowing the most evil of sexual predators free reign in the football building. Penn State wouldn’t have paid so heavily had it taken away Sandusky’s key to the castle when a victim’s mother first brought Sandusky’s pedophilia to light. But it chose the program over the children. Unprecedented crimes should result in unprecedented penalties

Penn State supporters argue that the bowl ban and scholarship losses are the areas where the NCAA is punishing those who had nothing to do with Sandusky’s unchecked abuse. They believe criminal charges against its ousted leaders would suffice. Those might still be coming. But the NCAA was totally within its right to punish Penn State when the cover-up was committed with the sole intention of preserving the football program.