Dave in Green Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Sorry for the confusion. I was wrong. I misread the footnote that tiebreaker B (division record) is used to determine the division champion, and thought that meant it wasn't used for tournament seeding. But it's also used for tournament seeding ahead of C (winning percentage vs. ranked teams). If the footnote had said also used to determine the division champion, it would have been much clearer to me. WMU currently has a better record in the Western Division than Toledo.Carrying that over to the Eastern Division, if the Zips lose their final game and OU wins, it would leave them with a tied conference record of 11-7. But OU would own the tiebreaker with a 6-4 record in the Eastern Division to 5-5 for the Zips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachTheZip Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Just win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 WOW...Toledo's ineligibility last year totally screwed me up. Thanks for the correction.So, my original thought was right.#5 has to play Mon. AND Wed.#4 has a bye all the way until Thurs.So, how HUGE is this game on Friday now ???By the way, I like the way the brackets are setting up for us if we get the #4. The only thing that would make it darn near perfect for me would be if EMU gets the #5 instead of OU, which would likely make them our quarterfinal opponent. And then, like I said earlier, WMU would be our semi opponent, and I like that matchup the best out of the top 3 seeds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippyfan34 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 WOW...Toledo's ineligibility last year totally screwed me up. Thanks for the correction.So, my original thought was right.#5 has to play Mon. AND Wed.#4 has a bye all the way until Thurs.So, how HUGE is this game on Friday now ???By the way, I like the way the brackets are setting up for us if we get the #4. The only thing that would make it darn near perfect for me would be if EMU gets the #5 instead of OU, which would likely make them our quarterfinal opponent. And then, like I said earlier, WMU would be our semi opponent, and I like that matchup the best out of the top 3 seeds. My preference would be to play OU instead of EMU at #5. EMU's zone scares me if we have an off shooting night. Plus EMU has beaten Toledo so getting them in Toledo's side of the bracket would be nice as Toledo is the team I would least like to face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 In previous seasons I've been concerned about the matchups the Zips draw at the Q. This Zips team is starting to make me think that the matchup is not as important this season because the team seems to be increasingly adaptable to whatever opponent they're up against. The main powers they may face at the Q are Toledo, WMU, Buffalo, OU and EMU.Starting from the latter, the Zips beat EMU twice. That's no guarantee that they own EMU. But I like the Zips' chances on a neutral court.The Zips beat OU in Athens and lost at the JAR with Jake, Nick and Reggie out. I like the Zips' chances on a neutral court at full strength.The Zips lost a close one at Buffalo with Nick and Reggie out and Jake out for the last 12 minutes, and then beat Buffalo at the JAR with Jake still out and Reggie playing only briefly. I like the Zips' chances on a neutral court at full strength.The Zips lost a close one at WMU with Nick out and Reggie playing but suffering from yet undiagnosed mono. I like the Zips' chances on a neutral court at full strength.The Zips lost pretty badly to Toledo at the JAR while playing at full strength, which would appear to make the Rockettes the toughest matchup. But it was the 4th conference game of the season, and I don't need to tell anyone here that this Zips team has had huge growing pains this season. The Zips team I've seen recently is a far cry from the team that couldn't handle Toledo earlier in the season. Toledo came to the JAR primed to make a statement, and the Zips were a bunch of players who seemed to barely know each other's names and were just playing another early season conference game. Nyles, Melo and Deji had shown nothing of what they've shown in recent games. I really want to see this matchup at the Q. It doesn't matter to me if it's a semi-final or the championship game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle66 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Sorry for the confusion. I was wrong. I misread the footnote that tiebreaker B (division record) is used to determine the division champion, and thought that meant it wasn't used for tournament seeding. But it's also used for tournament seeding ahead of C (winning percentage vs. ranked teams). If the footnote had said also used to determine the division champion, it would have been much clearer to me. WMU currently has a better record in the Western Division than Toledo.Carrying that over to the Eastern Division, if the Zips lose their final game and OU wins, it would leave them with a tied conference record of 11-7. But OU would own the tiebreaker with a 6-4 record in the Eastern Division to 5-5 for the Zips.I read it the same way you originally did Dave. I thought it is only used to determine a Division Champ, other wise it would be skipped. I thought that's how its been in the past (see tie for 6th last year and 8th in 2012). Did you find some clarification to the contrary?If it is skipped and Akron loses to Can't while Ohio beats Miami, Akron still gets the 4 seed if EMU beats Toledo to make it a 3 way tie for 4th. Akron has a .750 winning percentage vs the tied teams (2-0 vs EMU, 1-1 vs Ohio) Ohio is .667 (1-0 vs EMU, 1-1 vs Akron) and EMU is winless against Akron and Ohio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 @Eagle66, I've read a number of MAC tournament seeding scenario stories, and they all agree that division records are used for tournament seeding. Now they might all be wrong. But I have to believe that at least one of the many writers checked with the MAC before drawing that conclusion. Here's an example of just one of the many stories I've read:2014 MAC Tournament Seeding Update: Chaos Looms Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle66 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 @Eagle66, I've read a number of MAC tournament seeding scenario stories, and they all agree that division records are used for tournament seeding. Now they might all be wrong. But I have to believe that at least one of the many writers checked with the MAC before drawing that conclusion. Here's an example of just one of the many stories I've read:2014 MAC Tournament Seeding Update: Chaos LoomsFYI... After I posted this morning, I tweeted Jeremy Guy for clarification. He responded a little bit ago and confirmed division record is skipped if not determining a division champ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 @Eagle66, if Jeremy Guy is to be trusted that means that my original guess about the convoluted workings of the MAC was correct. That's scary! That also means that all the stories out there counting on tiebreaker B for tournament seeding are all wrong. Maybe the MAC needs to have an English major go over the wording of their tiebreakers explanation and be a little more specific about what tiebreaker B means and doesn't mean.In any case, it doesn't change the situation in the MAC East. If any combination of wins and losses in the final game creates an overall conference record tie between the Zips and Buffalo or OU, the Bulls and Kitties own tiebreaker C. So the Zips can't move up to #3 even if they win and Buffalo loses, but they could drop down to the #5 if they lose and OU wins. Zips still control their own destiny in holding onto the #4 seed.The goofy part is that a team could win its division championship based on tiebreaker B but be seeded lower in the tournament than the division runnerup based on tiebreaker C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle66 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 @DiG I agree about the wording. I also find it interesting Ohio would win a two way to breaker against Akron, but finish second in a 3 way tie breaker to Akron (with EMU). Gotta love the unbalanced schedules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Z Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 I also find it interesting Ohio would win a two way to breaker against Akron, but finish second in a 3 way tie breaker to Akron (with EMU). Gotta love the unbalanced schedules.Same thing happens in the NFL. It would have been implemented this year, if not for a missed call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 FYI about playing in Cleveland:With Ken+ likely being unable to contend this year, Akron clearly has the homecourt advantage. It's like 3/4 of a home game for us. Ken+ is the only other school capable of bringing the numbers to Cleveland to make it seem anywhere close to "neutral" when Akron is playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 I honestly think OU travels better than Can't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 I honestly think OU travels better than Can'tHmm. Interesting. Maybe I wasn't thinking about traveling students as much as people/alums/fans in general that go to those games. It seems like when we've played Ken+ in the past, they can do a pretty decent job of coming close to equaling us in total numbers. I don't see that from OU, although they do make an attempt to be very "together" and vocal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted March 7, 2014 Report Share Posted March 7, 2014 Hmm. Interesting. Maybe I wasn't thinking about traveling students as much as people/alums/fans in general that go to those games. It seems like when we've played Ken+ in the past, they can do a pretty decent job of coming close to equaling us in total numbers. I don't see that from OU, although they do make an attempt to be very "together" and vocal.I was thinking fans/alums too, maybe it's just the green and annoying OU oh yeah chant.. but seems like they bring a ton every year. Lots of Cleveland alums. I do believe the 08 championship vs Can't was better attended than last years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Zips clinch #4 seed and WMU clinches #1 seed tonight. So if the Zips win Thursday at the Q, they will face WMU Friday in the semi-finals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippyfan34 Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Both Thursday and Friday's games are the first games of the night which makes it easier for me taking the little one up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Both Thursday and Friday's games are the first games of the night which makes it easier for me taking the little one up.I like the idea of playing in the early game, if it wasn't for the fact that it's a rush to get up there after the work day.I especially like playing early on semi-final night. If you win, you get to relax and watch the late game (your next opponent), and come into the title game the next night with a little more rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearTheRoo Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 What time is the game Friday? I hear the Thursday game is st 6:30. It sure would be nice if our conference's website had this information readily available! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyZip Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 If the Zips advance, they'll play at 6:30 on Thursday, Friday and Saturday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 What time is the game Friday? I hear the Thursday game is st 6:30. It sure would be nice if our conference's website had this information readily available!I know. The MAC website is NOT where I found the game time information.6:30...geez. Makes it even more difficult to get there on time. In the past, I am pretty sure that the Friday games started at 7pm. FYI: Does everyone know that I-77 is going to be closed up near I-480 ALL weekend during the tournament?? This isn't a joke. I was told this by someone who works up there. They must have seen that the Cavs will not be in town, and thought it was a good time to do it. How stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 If all the higher-ranked teams win in the first 2 rounds of the MAC tournament, the Zips will face the #5 seed Thursday night. Right now that's OU. But if the Kitties loses at Miami today (noon game) and EMU wins at Toledo (2 p.m. start), EMU would get the #5 seed on a tiebreaker. Hustle Belt has all the updated seeding scenarios here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Skip, thanks for pointing out the I-77 construction. Here's the bad news:Weather permitting, crews will close all lanes of I-77 in both directions between I-480 and Ohio 21 on Friday, March 14, at 7 p.m., to set up the first phase of traffic rerouting. The section will stay closed until Monday, March 17, at 6 a.m.Motorists will be rerouted onto Ohio 176 and I-490. Traffic leaving downtown Cleveland on I-77 South will be detoured onto I-490 West and then to Ohio 176 South.Interstate 77 section closing during second weekend in March Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Sweaters up 4 on OU with 3 and a half left. Would love to see OU on the other side of the bracket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigzipguy Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Sweaters blow it in regulation, lose in O.T. They missed the front end of back to back 1-1's near end of regulation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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