UAZip0510 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I know we've discussed this at length, I'm just curious where people stand now that the decision will likely be coming in the next few months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Normally, I don't care a lot about this kind of thing. In this case, I think after the Zips losing yesterday it is time to turn the page on some things within the program. AA is someone they need to turn the page with and look for fresh blood. KD needs to get him away from the program.NE Ohio fans tend to believe it only takes one person to turn things around. It's a very bizarre savior complex. Many people in NE Ohio believed the economy of Cleveland hinged upon the return of Lebron James.An approaching 25 year old, chubby point guard with a drug violation followed by a probation violation isn't the savior I'm looking for. The team doesn't need a saint, but they don't need that either. Bringing AA back tells me there could be problems with the program beyond the point guard position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I'd be okay with it if KD and all the players want him back. I'm not going to pretend I'm some moral authority on 2nd chances. He's no savior, but he could help.. A lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balsy Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 @GP1 +1. The two years we needed Abreu was last year and this year. We have no need for him next year. This team could have been something special the last two years (or more special than it was) had he been here. Without him, it needs to move forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I'll just say this about the parole violation. One of the most common and least serious parole violations is a first time offender not reporting in to his parole officer on the first specified date due to not fully understanding how the system works the way career criminals do. I would not consider that to be a major factor in judging anyone's character. The focus should be on the nature of the violation that led to being put on probation in the first place.In addition to the coaching staff and players, it's also important that whatever decision is made be fully supported by UA leadership. This is a decision that reflects on the university as a whole and not just the basketball program. It's not an easy decision to make even when you have access to all the facts. While it's important to try to do what's best for every individual, it's even more important to do what's best for the university as a whole. My position continues to be that if UA does a fair and thorough analysis of all the facts, I'll respect their decision whichever way it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UAZip0510 Posted March 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I can fully accept if people don't think the baggage that will come with AA is worth it, but I'm amazed at how much some are discounting the impact he could have on the basketball side of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I think there is this underlying notion that KD couldn't find someone to replace him. I'm of the opinion it wouldn't be hard to do. I'd much rather see KD take a shot at bringing in a better player than trying to recycle a guy who has been away from the game for a year."What got us here won't get us there." We need to think about these words when we look at the AA issue. I think KD needs to look at the entire program, and that means assistant coaches as well, and think about those words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UAZip0510 Posted March 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I think there is this underlying notion that KD couldn't find someone to replace him. I'm of the opinion it wouldn't be hard to do. I'd much rather see KD take a shot at bringing in a better player than trying to recycle a guy who has been away from the game for a year."What got us here won't get us there." We need to think about these words when we look at the AA issue. I think KD needs to look at the entire program, and that means assistant coaches as well, and think about those words.This is where we disagree. Averaged 10/6 last year while shooting 39% from three-point range. And, most importantly, has three years of experience running KD's system.He'd make Treadwell, Kretzer, McAdams, and everyone else better. He'd immediately be the 2nd best player on the team behind Tree. He'd could be the difference between a result like last night's and a MAC Championship next year.I'd love to find a JUCO that could have the same impact. I'm just not sure that's realistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I'd like to add another caveat to my post. If he is in shape, as well. We saw the shape he was in while playing a D-1 sport. I have my doubts that he has stayed in game shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 This is where we disagree. Averaged 10/6 last year while shooting 39% from three-point range. And, most importantly, has three years of experience running KD's system.Get six points per game out of the point guards next year and find 4-8 somewhere else. More points off of turnovers, better offensive sets, offset scoring with better defense, get better at offensive rebounds, get better at defensive rebounds, better foul shooting, use different players to bring the ball up, get better offensive production out of the remainder of the team, etc. It really isn't that hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy5 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 More points off of turnovers, better offensive sets, offset scoring with better defense, get better at offensive rebounds, get better at defensive rebounds, better foul shooting, use different players to bring the ball up, get better offensive production out of the remainder of the team, etc. It really isn't that hard.Oh that's all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Obviously it really isn't that hard to make a list of areas for teams to improve. Sports fan forums are full of such lists. Making the list is the easiest part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LZIp Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Very timely creation of the thread. Our PG play is not the reason we lost last night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quickzips Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Thought a lot about this, and I have to agree that Alex just needs to stay away.1) He let down his teammates. Big time. It wasn't just he had a bad game or he didn't work hard enough to come back from an injury. He put his own selfish desires ahead of those of his teammates and the program. That isn't the guy I would want to be leaning on. Particularly if I am someone like Tree, Betancourt, Kretzer, McAdams, etc. and I was on that team and had to live through it.2) It would be a black eye on the program and the University. This is a guy who was brought up on felony drug charges. To let him back on the team and put him in a high profile position as your starting PG sends the wrong message. Not to mention the fact that he already had a couple of suspensions on his record before this.3) I have serious doubts that he would be able to come back and be an effective PG. Conditioning was always a problem for him anyways. I seriously doubt that 18 months away has helped that much. I know we are desperate for help at PG, but is an overweight and out of shape Abreu really the answer?There is a time and a place for second chances and there is a time and a place to move on. For the Zips, when it comes to Alex Abreu, it is time to move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quickzips Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Thought a lot about this, and I have to agree that Alex just needs to stay away.1) He let down his teammates. Big time. It wasn't just he had a bad game or he didn't work hard enough to come back from an injury. He put his own selfish desires ahead of those of his teammates and the program. That isn't the guy I would want to be leaning on. Particularly if I am someone like Tree, Betancourt, Kretzer, McAdams, etc. and I was on that team and had to live through it.2) It would be a black eye on the program and the University. This is a guy who was brought up on felony drug charges. To let him back on the team and put him in a high profile position as your starting PG sends the wrong message. Not to mention the fact that he already had a couple of suspensions on his record before this.3) I have serious doubts that he would be able to come back and be an effective PG. Conditioning was always a problem for him anyways. I seriously doubt that 18 months away has helped that much. I know we are desperate for help at PG, but is an overweight and out of shape Abreu really the answer?There is a time and a place for second chances and there is a time and a place to move on. For the Zips, when it comes to Alex Abreu, it is time to move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UAZip0510 Posted March 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Very timely creation of the thread. Our PG play is not the reason we lost last night.But they sure as hell need another reliable scorer with Diggs gone next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LZIp Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 There is a time and a place for second chances and there is a time and a place to move on. For the Zips, when it comes to Alex Abreu, it is time to move on.You couldn't have said it any better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LZIp Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 But they sure as hell need another reliable scorer with Diggs gone next season. So this is your reasoning for wanting him back? Look, I would love the basketball player Alex Abreu back as well. I didn't realize how valuable he was to the team until after he was gone.But im not about to put my morals aside to have increase our chances at winning. I care about the perception of our program. I think it is the coach's job to adjust and bring in/develop the talent he has recruited to makeup for the loss. As Quickzips said, people deserve second chances, but at some point you have to draw the line. If how Abreu has handled the situation was the same way Quincy handled his situation, I think I would be willing to accept him back..but unfortunately, I do not believe he has really learned his lesson.I truly wish Abreu the best of luck in whatever he does for the rest of his life, I just hope his time is done in a Zips uniform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1 Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Oh that's all?He can't play at Akron forever. At some point he would be replaced. Four points shouldn't be hard to find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Z Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 I would have voted for; non-scholarship, pays his own way, is in shape, is truly sorry, turns his life around, wins an ncaa tournament game, graduates, gets a great job after graduation, has a nice family, makes a difference in his community...and doesn't get many minutes because we have better options at PG. I didn't see that option, so I selected the second one.Go Zips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mivid12 Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 i hope to God none of you self important folk never need a second chance at something...good grief you act like he murdered someone....he was involved with something that is decriminalized for the most part and legal in two states...and grows uninhibited from mother earthvehicular homicide...sure...i get it...but not this...as always...just my opine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quickzips Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 i hope to God none of you self important folk never need a second chance at something...good grief you act like he murdered someone....he was involved with something that is decriminalized for the most part and legal in two states...and grows uninhibited from mother earthvehicular homicide...sure...i get it...but not this...as always...just my opineTime for a reality check man. Legal in two states is by no means "decriminalized". Do me a favor, go out and grow some of your own and start selling it on the street in broad daylight in Ohio (or any of the other 48 states). You'll find out real quick just how "decriminalized" it is.After your criminal trial is done and you've served whatever sentence you are hit with you can then try explaining the whole situation to your boss. I'm sure he or she will be more than forgiving and willing to give you a second chance.When you are done extracting your bosses doorknob from your rear end you can try explaining your criminal conviction to potential new employers during job interviews, presuming they even bring you in for an interview with your record. Of course someone will eventually hire you, but the reality is you have most likely slashed your earnings potential by a pretty significant amount.Life doesn't always give you a second chance. That is just something they tell kids in grade school to make them feel better.Some people are also forgetting that Alex has already had a couple of second chances. He was suspended multiple times in his first 2 1/2 years in the program. Exactly how many "second chances" are we supposed to give him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UAZip0510 Posted March 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 So this is your reasoning for wanting him back? Look, I would love the basketball player Alex Abreu back as well. I didn't realize how valuable he was to the team until after he was gone.But im not about to put my morals aside to have increase our chances at winning. I care about the perception of our program. I think it is the coach's job to adjust and bring in/develop the talent he has recruited to makeup for the loss. As Quickzips said, people deserve second chances, but at some point you have to draw the line. If how Abreu has handled the situation was the same way Quincy handled his situation, I think I would be willing to accept him back..but unfortunately, I do not believe he has really learned his lesson.I truly wish Abreu the best of luck in whatever he does for the rest of his life, I just hope his time is done in a Zips uniform.Actually, I haven't given my opinion on wanting him back or not - I've just shared my initial point that some on this forum are severely undervaluing Abreu's basketball ability. Your comment that "PG play wasn't the reason we lost last night" seemed to insinuate that Abreu wouldn't have made a difference against WMU. I disagree wholeheartedly. But since you seem to want to know, yes, I would take Abreu back if the coaches think he deserves a 2nd chance. I don't know Alex, and you don't either. The difference is you're pretending to know if he's learned his lesson while I'm basing my opinion on those who know him best, who know the situation, and who I trust - our coaching staff. You really don't know how he's handled the situation. I'm a believer in 2nd chances if a young person has deemed themselves worthy of it. If the coaches decide he is, I hope he's back. I do believe some sacrifice must be made with a 2nd chance - which is why I'm only in favor if Alex returns as a walk-on. Never forget - while the situations are not the same, this program's turnaround is all because UA decided to give another man who made a big mistake a second chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LZIp Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 But since you seem to want to know, yes, I would take Abreu back if the coaches think he deserves a 2nd chance. I don't know Alex, and you don't either. The difference is you're pretending to know if he's learned his lesson while I'm basing my opinion on those who know him best, who know the situation, and who I trust - our coaching staff. You really don't know how he's handled the situation. . Don't know why you continue to tell me what I do or do not know. You have no idea what I do or do not know.I have no reason to make baseless statements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UAZip0510 Posted March 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Don't know why you continue to tell me what I do or do not know. You have no idea what I do or do not know.I have no reason to make baseless statements.I'll ask you directly then. Do you know Alex Abreu? How many conversations have you had with him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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