So let me ask you this...

[akronzips71]

Is it "possible" that JD not only left after a horrible year, but also failed to do any proper recruiting? I mean, is it possible that iCoach got screwed by fate - after all, we didn't have a QB last year, so what do we have this year? The same PN who could not play last year? After they had to put an ad in the paper begging for anyone with QB experience to come forward (laughingstock of the entire country by the way) they could not go out and find someone anyplace to play QB for us?

This just reminds me of when I came to Akron in the fall of 1967. We were coming off GREAT basketball seasons (read Turner, Williams and a game against a guy named "the pearl") and there were NO replacements. We were HORRIBLE. The strategy was SLOW DOWN and try to win 2 - 0. Of course that didn't work. I think the coach was Tony Laterza (or maybe not, it was a long time ago, most of youse were not a gleam in your fathers eye yet), and the AD was Red Cochrane (I think).

But the next year we got a new coach, Wyatt Webb??? And a new cast of players - suddenly there was LEN PAUL and LARRY QUARLES and JINX JENKINS. And a trip to Evansville. And eventual D1 league play. And the unforgettable Harvey Glover (WHO??).

The point I think I am trying to make is simply this:

Is iCoach a total failure, or is he eating JDs' shit for not recruiting any quality players?

[bobbyake]

Is it "possible" that JD not only left after a horrible year, but also failed to do any proper recruiting? I mean, is it possible that iCoach got screwed by fate - after all, we didn't have a QB last year, so what do we have this year? The same PN who could not play last year? After they had to put an ad in the paper begging for anyone with QB experience to come forward (laughingstock of the entire country by the way) they could not go out and find someone anyplace to play QB for us?

This just reminds me of when I came to Akron in the fall of 1967. We were coming off GREAT basketball seasons (read Turner, Williams and a game against a guy named "the pearl") and there were NO replacements. We were HORRIBLE. The strategy was SLOW DOWN and try to win 2 - 0. Of course that didn't work. I think the coach was Tony Laterza (or maybe not, it was a long time ago, most of youse were not a gleam in your fathers eye yet), and the AD was Red Cochrane (I think).

But the next year we got a new coach, Wyatt Webb??? And a new cast of players - suddenly there was LEN PAUL and LARRY QUARLES and JINX JENKINS. And a trip to Evansville. And eventual D1 league play. And the unforgettable Harvey Glover (WHO??).

The point I think I am trying to make is simply this:

Is iCoach a total failure, or is he eating JDs' shit for not recruiting any quality players?

iCoach is a total failure and has no clue as a head coach. He's pushing a scheme on a team that's not suitable for it. He's got talent but doesn't know how to use it.

[RootforRoo44]

iCoach is a total failure and has no clue as a head coach. He's pushing a scheme on a team that's not suitable for it. He's got talent but doesn't know how to use it.

BINGO...judging from most of the threads about this (all 72 of them) and the general consensus among people i know I would say that most anyone who know's a thing about football sees that this guy was a HUGE MISTAKE.

[GoZips88]

NOT a coach.

By many accounts, including my own opportunity to meet him shortly after he arrived on campus, not a very nice/personable guy.

A BIG mistake, regardless of talent, that we're paying dearly for now and will continue to do so for quite some time.

[ZipRoo]

I will concede one point: JD was a fairly nice guy, but overmatched in this position. His recruiting over a 7-year period was hit-and-miss. He should've been gone in 2007. People who brag about the Zips bowl game in 2005 should look closer and see that we really "backed into" that one. It was not an impressive year, rather a very lucky year. So JD's tenure was mediocre to poor.

But JD puts this guy to shame in coaching. That's a sad, sad statement.

Wonder just how low Proenza will allow the program to sink before stepping in to rescue it? You know Wistrcill won't do it; Ianello was "his guy." Which totally says everything we need to know about YouTube Tom.

[Dr Z]

People who brag about the Zips bowl game in 2005 should look closer and see that we really "backed into" that one. It was not an impressive year, rather a very lucky year.

I've read this BS statement on this board umpteen times and have never commented on it once. After watching this year, this statement now brings my blood to a boil! I'd give my left pinky for another "lucky" year. Lucky.

[Captain Kangaroo]

People who brag about the Zips bowl game in 2005 should look closer and see that we really "backed into" that one. It was not an impressive year, rather a very lucky year.

I've read this BS statement on this board umpteen times and have never commented on it once. After watching this year, this statement now brings my blood to a boil! I'd give my left pinky for another "lucky" year. Lucky.

Lucky we beat NIU TWICE that season.

Lucky we had a team that stomped K.e.n.t. to clinch it.

[Zipmeister]

Is it "possible" that JD not only left after a horrible year, but also failed to do any proper recruiting? I mean, is it possible that iCoach got screwed by fate - after all, we didn't have a QB last year, so what do we have this year? The same PN who could not play last year? After they had to put an ad in the paper begging for anyone with QB experience to come forward (laughingstock of the entire country by the way) they could not go out and find someone anyplace to play QB for us?

This just reminds me of when I came to Akron in the fall of 1967. We were coming off GREAT basketball seasons (read Turner, Williams and a game against a guy named "the pearl") and there were NO replacements. We were HORRIBLE. The strategy was SLOW DOWN and try to win 2 - 0. Of course that didn't work. I think the coach was Tony Laterza (or maybe not, it was a long time ago, most of youse were not a gleam in your fathers eye yet), and the AD was Red Cochrane (I think).

But the next year we got a new coach, Wyatt Webb??? And a new cast of players - suddenly there was LEN PAUL and LARRY QUARLES and JINX JENKINS. And a trip to Evansville. And eventual D1 league play. And the unforgettable Harvey Glover (WHO??).

The point I think I am trying to make is simply this:

Is iCoach a total failure, or is he eating JDs' shit for not recruiting any quality players?

iCoach is a total failure and has no clue as a head coach. He's pushing a scheme on a team that's not suitable for it. He's got talent but doesn't know how to use it.

I think you are overstating the case here. He is NOT a total failure, but it might not be long till he gets there.

[ZipRoo]

People who brag about the Zips bowl game in 2005 should look closer and see that we really "backed into" that one. It was not an impressive year, rather a very lucky year.

I've read this BS statement on this board umpteen times and have never commented on it once. After watching this year, this statement now brings my blood to a boil! I'd give my left pinky for another "lucky" year. Lucky.

Hey, every team needs a little luck. Akron just got it in buckets that year. 6-5 regular season (barely bowl-eligible)...then a totally-miraculous and improbable endzone catch to win the MAC (anyone who says it wasn't miraculous didn't see it)...followed by a loss in the Motor City Bowl. We only made the MAC playoff because of some odd formula (losses in division, or something).

Don't make it out to be more than it was. A fun time, certainly. But WAY lucky. JD hung his floppy hat on that season way too much and fooled a lot of people. He was never the guy for this job, either. But he's better than what we've got now.

[Dave in Green]

2004 6-5

2005 7-6

2006 5-7

2007 4-8

2008 5-7

2009 3-9

The record indicates that the Zips under Brookhart were on a slow downward spiral. That's likely due to some combination of inadequate recruiting and coaching.

Is it realistic to believe that the Zips would have improved last year's 3-9 record if Brookhart were still coaching this group of players with all of its known shortcomings?

Is it realistic to believe that a rookie head coach, subject to the same kind of freshman mistakes made by freshman players, would instantly produce better results than Brookhart?

We know the new head coach has made plenty of rookie mistakes. We really don't know how successfull Ianello will ultimately be as a head coach at UA and beyond.

Nobody likes losing, and the more losses the less we fans like it. The important question is what is a fair length of time to give a rookie head coach the opportunity to prove whether or not he can turn around a program that was going nowhere but down long before he arrived?

[Wally B]

I've never commented here "politically", but it amazes me how Akron coaching parallels our political landscape! Think about it. Our nations fortunes were sliding before the last presidential election, and now the american populace can't decide who's at fault (following mostly party lines). Those who liked Bush, are not impressed by Obama and feel that he has "rubbed them the wrong way" and can't lead us to better economic times. While those opposed to Bush feel Obama was given a rough situation, and needs to be given more time to turn things around!

I'm sure there's a masters thesis in here somewhere

DISCLAIMER: Please do not use my musings to turn this thread into a political debate! I'm merely stating a generic observation and enjoy Zipsnation as a source for Zips Sports.... nothing else! thx.

[Lee Adams]

People who brag about the Zips bowl game in 2005 should look closer and see that we really "backed into" that one. It was not an impressive year, rather a very lucky year.

I've read this BS statement on this board umpteen times and have never commented on it once. After watching this year, this statement now brings my blood to a boil! I'd give my left pinky for another "lucky" year. Lucky.

Hey, every team needs a little luck. Akron just got it in buckets that year. 6-5 regular season (barely bowl-eligible)...then a totally-miraculous and improbable endzone catch to win the MAC (anyone who says it wasn't miraculous didn't see it)...followed by a loss in the Motor City Bowl. We only made the MAC playoff because of some odd formula (losses in division, or something).

Don't make it out to be more than it was. A fun time, certainly. But WAY lucky. JD hung his floppy hat on that season way too much and fooled a lot of people. He was never the guy for this job, either. But he's better than what we've got now.

Even JD was willing to admit they got lucky before they got good. It was not about winning much this year. But it should be about seeing some improvement and competetiveness on the field.

[MaxZIP]

Icoach lost to a bad FCS team...JD won average 5 games/season including a mac title game...Icoach is getting blown out at home by bottom rung MAC teams.

[RootforRoo44]

I've never commented here "politically", but it amazes me how Akron coaching parallels our political landscape! Think about it. Our nations fortunes were sliding before the last presidential election, and now the american populace can't decide who's at fault (following mostly party lines). Those who liked Bush, are not impressed by Obama and feel that he has "rubbed them the wrong way" and can't lead us to better economic times. While those opposed to Bush feel Obama was given a rough situation, and needs to be given more time to turn things around!

I'm sure there's a masters thesis in here somewhere

DISCLAIMER: Please do not use my musings to turn this thread into a political debate! I'm merely stating a generic observation and enjoy Zipsnation as a source for Zips Sports.... nothing else! thx.

Good way to look at it...though i believe you could find an example like that in a lot of places. People don't want to be wrong or want "their guy" to fail. They will apologize for him whatever way they can.

Problem with Icoach (or Obama)....no apologizing in the world can change the facts that he is a COMPLETE-TOTAL-FAILURE.

[Dave in Green]

..... People don't want to be wrong or want "their guy" to fail. They will apologize for him whatever way they can. .....

By that logic, those who predicted Ianello would fail before he coached his first game also don't want to be proven wrong and do want the guy to fail. They will rip on him whatever way they can.

Then there are those who never took a hard pro or con position, but only hoped that Ianello would become a good head coach and turn the Zips around from their downward spiral of the last few years if given a fair opportunity to do so.

Reasonable people can disagree on how much time a new head coach should be given to stop a losing team's slide. But most reasonable people will agree that one year or less is not adequate.

Whether the Ianello lovers or the Ianello haters eventually prove to be correct in their assessment of his ability to succeed, the most important thing is for the Zips to start winning, whether under Ianello or whoever might ultimately replace him.

Who really cares who "wins" a stupid sports forum debate?

[zen]

2004 6-5

2005 7-6

2006 5-7

2007 4-8

2008 5-7

2009 3-9

The record indicates that the Zips under Brookhart were on a slow downward spiral. That's likely due to some combination of inadequate recruiting and coaching.

0-12

COMBO BREAKER!

lol, someone brought up politics in this thread... and this is mine.

First off, the "slow downward spiral" is debatable.

I mean, I actually tend to agree with you, just because of the feel of things that I got off being a fan of the team through those years, but those records show some ups and downs and overall remain marginally average.

0-12 is a completely new ballpark... it's not a "downward spiral", it's an instantaneous thundering thud.

[Dave in Green]

..... First off, the "slow downward spiral" is debatable.

I mean, I actually tend to agree with you, just because of the feel of things that I got off being a fan of the team through those years, but those records show some ups and downs and overall remain marginally average. .....

Using 2004 as the base year, let's look at it on a year-to-year basis by winning percentage with a plus for every year where the winning percentage improved and a minus where it fell:

2004 6-5 .545

2005 7-6 .538 -

2006 5-7 .417 -

2007 4-8 .333 -

2008 5-7 .417 +

2009 3-9 .250 -

In only one of five seasons was there an improvement in winning percentage over the previous season, and that one was immediately followed by the lowest winning percentage of the JD era in his final season. Although not perfectly linear, I think that "slow downward spiral" is a reasonably accurate description if you allow for the occasional updraft in a general descent.

Maybe slow downward trend would be a more accurate way to describe it.

[ZipRoo]

Dave in Green is quite the Ianello apologist.

[skip-zip]

..... First off, the "slow downward spiral" is debatable.

I mean, I actually tend to agree with you, just because of the feel of things that I got off being a fan of the team through those years, but those records show some ups and downs and overall remain marginally average. .....

Using 2004 as the base year, let's look at it on a year-to-year basis by winning percentage with a plus for every year where the winning percentage improved and a minus where it fell:

2004 6-5 .545

2005 7-6 .538 -

2006 5-7 .417 -

2007 4-8 .333 -

2008 5-7 .417 +

2009 3-9 .250 -

In only one of five seasons was there an improvement in winning percentage over the previous season, and that one was immediately followed by the lowest winning percentage of the JD era in his final season. Although not perfectly linear, I think that "slow downward spiral" is a reasonably accurate description if you allow for the occasional updraft in a general descent.

Maybe slow downward trend would be a more accurate way to describe it.

I was always disappointed that JD never followed up the bowl appearance with another good season over the next 4 years. But I think some people forget that in mid-November of 2008 we were in the middle of a multiple-overtime game at the Rubber Bowl against Buffalo with a chance to take control of the MAC East.

I'd go crazy with excitement if we could even equal that position these days.

[ZachTheZip]

http://www.southbendtribune.com/article/20.../101029476/1130

From bad to worse

If you think the current Notre Dame coaches had an rough weekend, some former ND coaches have them beat.

Actually, it's been a trying year for former Irish assistants Rob Ianello, John Latina and Ron Powlus.

Ianello is the first-year head coach at the University of Akron, Latina the offensive coordinator and tight ends coach, Powlus the passing game coordinator and quarterbacks coach. None of them has been able to add a win to their résumé since leaving ND.

The Zips (0-8) are definitely living up to their name, for once. They were the first team in the Football Bowl Subdivision to be eliminated from bowl contention and are one of only two winless teams in the 120-team division (0-7 New Mexico is the other).

Not even Gerry Faust had an winless team at Akron, though he did go 1-10 in his final season with the Zips in 1994.

Statistically, the best thing Akron does this season is punt. The Zips are ranked 67th in the nation in net punting. It's the only one of the 17 major team statistics the NCAA tracks in which Akron rates higher than 87th,

They Zips rank 100 of below in 12 of those 17 statistical categories.

Among Akron's four remaining opponents is Miami of Ohio (4-4), coached by former Irish offensive coordinator Mike Haywood.

Perhaps Ianello can take solace in the fact Haywood and Miami were 1-11 last season.

[RowdyZip]

2004 6-5

2005 7-6

2006 5-7

2007 4-8

2008 5-7

2009 3-9

The record indicates that the Zips under Brookhart were on a slow downward spiral. That's likely due to some combination of inadequate recruiting and coaching.

0-12

COMBO BREAKER!

lol, someone brought up politics in this thread... and this is mine.

First off, the "slow downward spiral" is debatable.

I mean, I actually tend to agree with you, just because of the feel of things that I got off being a fan of the team through those years, but those records show some ups and downs and overall remain marginally average.

0-12 is a completely new ballpark... it's not a "downward spiral", it's an instantaneous thundering thud.

What an ignorant cartoon!

0-12 will happen, not because of coaching and not because of talent. 0-12 will happen because these are kids that don't care (whether we believe they should or not).

[Dave in Green]

Dave in Green is quite the Ianello apologist.

You'll need to be more original than that to gain traction on ZN.O.

[ZipRoo]

Dave in Green is quite the Ianello apologist.

You'll need to be more original than that to gain traction on ZN.O.

I'll stand by it. Every one of Dave in Green's posts defends the coach/program. Strange.

[MaxZIP]

Dave in Green is quite the Ianello apologist.

You'll need to be more original than that to gain traction on ZN.O.

I'll stand by it. Every one of Dave in Green's posts defends the coach/program. Strange.

Wait until you read some of his basketball posts. He is a valued member of ZNO.

[GP1]

Is it realistic to believe that the Zips would have improved last year's 3-9 record if Brookhart were still coaching this group of players with all of its known shortcomings?

Is it realistic to believe that a rookie head coach, subject to the same kind of freshman mistakes made by freshman players, would instantly produce better results than Brookhart?

We know the new head coach has made plenty of rookie mistakes. We really don't know how successfull Ianello will ultimately be as a head coach at UA and beyond.

Nobody knows the answer to the first question. What we do know is JD would have had 16-17 returnig starters on his team in his system. That is enough material for Coach I to do SOMETHING with beyond potentially 0-12. So if the question is whether or not it is realistic to believe JD could have done better than 3 wins, I guess it falls within the world of reality. It's within the world of reality to believe Coach I, or any coach, could win 3-4 games with those numbers.

The answer to question #2 is yes. See the number of returning starters. Owens took over a terrible team with far less talent than there is on the current Zips team and won more games than Faust. It can be done. It isn't getting done. When an AD fires a coach, what he is saying is, "I can hire someone who can produce more wins than the current guy." The expectation for more than 3 wins is realistic. It happens all the time in college football. We are talking about going from 3-4 wins...this isn't asking very much.

You're right, nobody can see the future. What we do know is if we go 0-12, the damage to Coach I's reputation, as it is taken advantage of by coaches recruiting against us, may be insurmountable. Fans focus too much on their own program and don't take into consideration how a program's shortcomings can be taken advantage of by other programs. If we go 0-12, we are in huge trouble the next couple of off seasons and seasons. This team really, really, really, really needs to avoid an 0-12 season.

In terms of Coach I's future, if he goes 0-12, there isn't a program in the country that would hire him in D-I or even I-AA. He may be a good assistant, but he'll never get another head coach job again. That's just the reality of college football.