Detroit Titans

[MaxZIP]

Yesterday's game was great entertainment. Thanks to Tree, Diggs, Evans, Reggie, Jake, Harney, and PAT! Pat really impressed me yesterday. He was aggressive down low and didn't lose focus. I really appreciate the team making a Wednesday night fun. Game was full of drama but for the first time this year the crowd roared enough to force a visitor timeout.

[Dave in Green]

One of the cool things about Pat's aggressivness on shot blocking, rebounding and defense in general is that he picked up only 1 personal foul, which means that he also played smart and under control. On the offensive end his shots weren't dropping, and some of the shots were forced. But every player has off shooting nights. Pat's progress is critical to being able to go up against teams with big centers the Zips will face this season.

[Zips Win!]

He's proven he can provide 8-or-so serviceable minutes

Really?

Five on Five in the second half was much better than three on five in the first half.

[johnnyzip84]

Several posters have already captured most of my thoughts, but here are a few others:

1. I’m in the camp who hopes KD has seen enough of this particular starting lineup. One of these times the team won’t be able to pull itself out of the hole created by having Melo and, to a certain extent Deji, on the floor at the opening tip.

2. I’ll give Deji credit for turning himself into a serviceable player. But I don’t want him taking any more of Q’s minutes than absolutely necessary.

3. I wonder what Q’s time would be in the 200? I suspect it might be reasonably competitive with the track team. His tendinitis must be progressing pretty well after seeing his display last night. I know he forces things now and then (like when he picked up his 4th foul on the attempted no-look back-pass), but I’ll gladly take those moments for what he brings to the floor as a whole.

4. Zips were much better against the press than they were on Monday. I assume they worked on that some during Tuesday’s practice. Pat is a pretty effective outlet passer (and receiver) from center court.

5. The AK-Rowdie heaving the ball in angst onto the scoreboard’s abyss after losing musical chairs was pretty funny. Willy might disagree

[Warriors4life]

Ok, can someone explain why Kwan Cheatham jr isn't getting any playing time. You have a 6'10 kid who can play . How do you except for him to get better if you don't play him. He might be that kid that can help clog up the middle. I'm confused!!!

[LZIp]

Ok, can someone explain why Kwan Cheatham jr isn't getting any playing time. You have a 6'10 kid who can play . How do you except for him to get better if you don't play him. He might be that kid that can help clog up the middle. I'm confused!!!

I'm sure Kwan knows.

[Captain Kangaroo]

Really?

Five on Five in the second half was much better than three on five in the first half.

I think 8 serviceable minutes against Bethune-Cookman, and 4-5 minutes against a decent team is what he merits.

I agree placing Ibitayo and Betancourt on the court at the same time is, at-best 4-on-5. And often 3-on-5. I'm guessing Iowa State and Oregon State's guards would make them look a lot worse than Detroit's did. And Detroit exposed them pretty badly.

[akronzips71]

Ok, can someone explain why Kwan Cheatham jr isn't getting any playing time. You have a 6'10 kid who can play . How do you except for him to get better if you don't play him. He might be that kid that can help clog up the middle. I'm confused!!!

Are you a family member?

[Dave in Green]

One of the reasons why the Zips have so much zip in the second half is due to having a deep rotation. The Zips currently lack enough backcourt depth to take both Melo and Deji out of the rotation. Melo's minutes per game have been steadily declining since the second game of the season as Nyles and Q have steadily improved their PG skills to the point that a third PG is not required in the rotation. But that depends on both Nyles and Q being healthy. Q should not be expected to play 30+ minutes on a sore knee. It's important that he gets enough rest that his knee fully recovers.

Q's biggest value to the team right now is at the 1, not the 2, so that's where most of his minutes should be played. That opens up minutes for Deji at the 2, and it makes sense that most of those minutes should come early in the game. Deji is not an option late in the game due to his poor free throw shooting. But when you look at all of Deji's stats, free throw shooting is the only area where he's a liability. He's improved every other aspect of his game on both offense and defense. Every minute Deji contributes early in the game allows one of the Zips' bigger contributors to have a little more energy left late in the game.

Bottom line is that if Melo is the odd man out, Deji becomes critical to having adequate depth in the backcourt.

[Warriors4life]

Are you a family member?

No. why you ask? I'm just a fan who has been following him since his high school career.

[Zips Win!]

One of the reasons why the Zips have so much zip in the second half is due to having a deep rotation. The Zips currently lack enough backcourt depth to take both Melo and Deji out of the rotation. Melo's minutes per game have been steadily declining since the second game of the season as Nyles and Q have steadily improved their PG skills to the point that a third PG is not required in the rotation. But that depends on both Nyles and Q being healthy. Q should not be expected to play 30+ minutes on a sore knee. It's important that he gets enough rest that his knee fully recovers.

Q's biggest value to the team right now is at the 1, not the 2, so that's where most of his minutes should be played. That opens up minutes for Deji at the 2, and it makes sense that most of those minutes should come early in the game. Deji is not an option late in the game due to his poor free throw shooting. But when you look at all of Deji's stats, free throw shooting is the only area where he's a liability. He's improved every other aspect of his game on both offense and defense. Every minute Deji contributes early in the game allows one of the Zips' bigger contributors to have a little more energy left late in the game.

Bottom line is that if Melo is the odd man out, Deji becomes critical to having adequate depth in the backcourt.

Baloney- But keep typing my man.

Playing a bunch of guys doesn't give you depth. It may give you a loss, but not depth.

Playing a bunch of guys that can contribute will give you depth.

[LZIp]

Baloney- But keep typing my man.

Playing a bunch of guys doesn't give you depth. It may give you a loss, but not depth.

Playing a bunch of guys that can contribute will give you depth.

Betancourt doesn't give us depth. I understand many people have been against Deji for multiple seasons, even called for him to transfer on many occassions, but he has shown that he can provide value to the team. He isn't in the main rotation now, nor should he be, but he deserves to get his time a game. He sucks at FT shooting...so does the vast majority of our team. Look at the overall %. Not good.

edit: also- Im sure if McAdams was the ball handler everyone thought he could be, he would be getting more minutes at the two (even 1) rather than almost exclusively at the 3.

[Captain Kangaroo]

He sucks at FT shooting...so does the vast majority of our team. Look at the overall %. Not good.

edit: also- Im sure if McAdams was the ball handler everyone thought he could be, he would be getting more minutes at the two (even 1) rather than almost exclusively at the 3.

I would say - "There's "suck," and then there's "SUCK."

Suck is 61.8% from the FT line for a guard.

SUCK is 31.8%. And we're in mid-December. It isn't like he's 1-3 on November 13th.

I would contend McAdams isn't playing the 1 or 2 because his best attribute is his catch-and-shoot, 3-point ability.

Personally, I think he's a much better 1 or 2 than Ibitayo or Betancourt. But KD is trying whatever is possible to not waste McAdams primary strength. If Betancourt moves any closer down the bench towards the orange Igloo cooler, it wouldn't surprise me to see McAdams get a little PT at the point.

Hopefully is doesn't come to that scenario, and Evans and Diggs can handle it.

[Captain Kangaroo]

Thanks for the insight on the matter. I will never put that question up for discussion.

It is ignorant of anyone to ask personal questions regarding any member's identity. It is important to me to keep anyone's actual identity private. And it is a basic foundation of this board to respect everyone's anonymity.

If someone wants to offer their identity, that is fine. If they don't, it is ignorant to request it in our forum.

I apologize for a member asking you for your personal identity.

The Moderators.

[Hilltopper]

Ok, can someone explain why Kwan Cheatham jr isn't getting any playing time. You have a 6'10 kid who can play . How do you except for him to get better if you don't play him. He might be that kid that can help clog up the middle. I'm confused!!!

I would expect that Kwan will see time on the court when he proves to the coaching staff that he knows where to be on defense and when he knows the plays on offense. Based on what I'v seen in games and practice, he's not quite there yet. Yes he is 6'10" and has lots of potential, but you still have to perform when its crunch time. He did get quite a bit of PT against Bethune-Cookman and I would say the the results were mixed. I would say that offensively he has looked OK. But he still needs to work on his defense. Another way to look at it he has played 20 minutes more than Jackson or Gladden, so that must mean something, Right?

[akronzips71]

It is ignorant of anyone to ask personal questions regarding any member's identity. It is important to me to keep anyone's actual identity private. And it is a basic foundation of this board to respect everyone's anonymity.

If someone wants to offer their identity, that is fine. If they don't, it is ignorant to request it in our forum.

I apologize for a member asking you for your personal identity.

The Moderators.

I apologize for giving that impression. His screen name coupled with his question reminded me of another person who ruffled some feathers with similar questions last year. I thought the player was very good, but Coach decides who plays, this is not the place to advocate against the Coach.

[Dave in Green]

The odd part about Deji's free throw shooting is that he averaged 68.8% as a freshman when the rest of his game was weak, 56.2% as a sophomore when the rest of his game was improving, and just 30.8% so far this season even as the rest of his game has become respectable. Deji was a career 60%+ free throw shooter coming into this season, and there are currently 6 other players in the Zips lineup shooting less than 60% from the free throw line. If Deji can break out of his slump and match his career free throw shooting percentage, he'd be the 5th best free throw shooter on this season's team.

[skip-zip]

I would say - "There's "suck," and then there's "SUCK."

Suck is 61.8% from the FT line for a guard.

SUCK is 31.8%. And we're in mid-December. It isn't like he's 1-3 on November 13th.

I would contend McAdams isn't playing the 1 or 2 because his best attribute is his catch-and-shoot, 3-point ability.

Personally, I think he's a much better 1 or 2 than Ibitayo or Betancourt. But KD is trying whatever is possible to not waste McAdams primary strength. If Betancourt moves any closer down the bench towards the orange Igloo cooler, it wouldn't surprise me to see McAdams get a little PT at the point.

Hopefully is doesn't come to that scenario, and Evans and Diggs can handle it.

Playing Diggs at the 1 spot and making him a full court ball handler is wasting a player's primary strength too.

[Dave in Green]

Playing Diggs at the 1 spot and making him a full court ball handler is wasting a player's primary strength too.

What's a good alternative?

[LZIp]

What's a good alternative?

Betancourt, duh

[Dave in Green]

Q's primary strength is defined by his biggest college award -- MAC 6th Man of the Year. At the college level, Q can play the 1-4 positions. If he gets to the next level, it would likely be on the strength of being able to play the 1-2 positions. I don't think that Q should be pigeonholed at any one position. He's a multi-talented player. At the highest level of basketball, PGs are expected to be able to bring the ball upcourt, create shots for their teammates and score both inside and out, sometimes leading the team in scoring. Who's best qualified to do that for UA right now? If Q can do that at UA, he might be able to do it at the next level. What would be a waste would be to limit Q to one position when his greatest strength is his flexibility.

[zippy5]

A 6'6" kid running point is only gonna help his chances at the league

[Quickzips]

I'll weigh in with my two cents on some of these issues:

Nyles and Q help this team much more coming off the bench than they do starting. The W-L columns speak to that. If keeping these guys in the roles that are best for the team means that Melo has to start, play 3 minutes and then plant his butt on the bench the rest of the night so be it.

I've never been a Deji fan and never will, but right now he is playing valuable minutes. His FT shooting is absolutely puzzling, but he's hitting the occasional 3, he's playing fairly decent defense, he's avoiding the boneheaded plays that plagued him the last few seasons and we're getting 10 or so solid minutes a night out of the guy. Unless we are going to burn the redshirt on B.J. or Aaron we need Deji's minutes at the 2 guard.

I understand that there are some people on here who are apparently close to Kwan who are upset about his playing time. I hate to be Debbie Downer, but you guys should have known what you were getting into when he signed here. Dambrot's history shows that he rarely gives freshmen a lot of minutes and this team returned two quality players at his position (no, Kwan is not a C, he's a PF who can occasionally play C) from last years team, one of which is a conference MVP candidate. Kwan's time will come, but you guys need to have some patience.

If McAdams has to start logging serious minutes at PG this season is over. Reggie does a lot of things well. He's a solid defender and he's right there with Jake as the best catch and shoot 3 ball man on the roster. He's not a PG. His ball-handling skills make him a passable secondary ball-handler, but he is NOT a PG. Can we please bury that idea somewhere deep in the Zipsnation graveyard and never bring it up again.

As far as the PG issues go, I really think we all need to take a step back and take a deep breath. This program was successful in the past without having a true PG on the roster (I'm thinking specifically of the Dials/Middleton days through the McNees/Roberts days). We got spoiled the last couple of years by having a true PG like Abreu running the show, but Alex isn't on this team anymore and we don't have anyone else on the roster who is capable of doing all of the things that he did. It doesn't mean we are doomed to a sub-par season or that the program is going crumble around KD. It just means the team has to adapt their play and we as fans have to adapt our expectations out of the PG position.

[Balsy]

I'll weigh in with my two cents on some of these issues:

Nyles and Q help this team much more coming off the bench than they do starting. The W-L columns speak to that. If keeping these guys in the roles that are best for the team means that Melo has to start, play 3 minutes and then plant his butt on the bench the rest of the night so be it.

I've never been a Deji fan and never will, but right now he is playing valuable minutes. His FT shooting is absolutely puzzling, but he's hitting the occasional 3, he's playing fairly decent defense, he's avoiding the boneheaded plays that plagued him the last few seasons and we're getting 10 or so solid minutes a night out of the guy. Unless we are going to burn the redshirt on B.J. or Aaron we need Deji's minutes at the 2 guard.

I understand that there are some people on here who are apparently close to Kwan who are upset about his playing time. I hate to be Debbie Downer, but you guys should have known what you were getting into when he signed here. Dambrot's history shows that he rarely gives freshmen a lot of minutes and this team returned two quality players at his position (no, Kwan is not a C, he's a PF who can occasionally play C) from last years team, one of which is a conference MVP candidate. Kwan's time will come, but you guys need to have some patience.

If McAdams has to start logging serious minutes at PG this season is over. Reggie does a lot of things well. He's a solid defender and he's right there with Jake as the best catch and shoot 3 ball man on the roster. He's not a PG. His ball-handling skills make him a passable secondary ball-handler, but he is NOT a PG. Can we please bury that idea somewhere deep in the Zipsnation graveyard and never bring it up again.

As far as the PG issues go, I really think we all need to take a step back and take a deep breath. This program was successful in the past without having a true PG on the roster (I'm thinking specifically of the Dials/Middleton days through the McNees/Roberts days). We got spoiled the last couple of years by having a true PG like Abreu running the show, but Alex isn't on this team anymore and we don't have anyone else on the roster who is capable of doing all of the things that he did. It doesn't mean we are doomed to a sub-par season or that the program is going crumble around KD. It just means the team has to adapt their play and we as fans have to adapt our expectations out of the PG position.

+1

[Captain Kangaroo]

Nyles and Q help this team much more coming off the bench than they do starting. The W-L columns speak to that.

I would say our W-L speaks more to the level of our competition. And the fact that the majority of the team is playing very well. If Diggs and Evan were starting, our record would be identical.

If keeping these guys in the roles that are best for the team means that Melo has to start, play 3 minutes and then plant his butt on the bench the rest of the night so be it.

Giving Betancourt 3 minutes is just enough time for him to get a couple turnovers, and dig us into a hole that, thankfully, we've had sufficient time to rise above. Start him and Ibitayo vs. Iowa State or Oregon State, and the hole may be more difficult to overcome.

I've never been a Deji fan and never will, but right now he is playing valuable minutes. His FT shooting is absolutely puzzling, but he's hitting the occasional 3, he's playing fairly decent defense, he's avoiding the boneheaded plays that plagued him the last few seasons and we're getting 10 or so solid minutes a night out of the guy. Unless we are going to burn the redshirt on B.J. or Aaron we need Deji's minutes at the 2 guard.

Against Bethune Cookman, give him his 10 minutes and rest the better players a bit. In Hawaii, 10 minutes of Deji isn't in our best interest.

If McAdams has to start logging serious minutes at PG this season is over. Reggie does a lot of things well. He's a solid defender and he's right there with Jake as the best catch and shoot 3 ball man on the roster. He's not a PG. His ball-handling skills make him a passable secondary ball-handler, but he is NOT a PG. Can we please bury that idea somewhere deep in the Zipsnation graveyard and never bring it up again.

No one suggested McAdams get "serious minutes" at the PG. Except you. But I would contend giving Betancourt's 3-5 minutes to McAdams would save us 2-3 turnovers, and give us some assists and points, rather than the goose eggs we're presently posting.

As far as the PG issues go, I really think we all need to take a step back and take a deep breath. This program was successful in the past without having a true PG on the roster (I'm thinking specifically of the Dials/Middleton days through the McNees/Roberts days). We got spoiled the last couple of years by having a true PG like Abreu running the show, but Alex isn't on this team anymore and we don't have anyone else on the roster who is capable of doing all of the things that he did. It doesn't mean we are doomed to a sub-par season or that the program is going crumble around KD. It just means the team has to adapt their play and we as fans have to adapt our expectations out of the PG position.

I would give my left nut for pedestrian point guard play like Dials, Middleton, McNees or Roberts offered. It is light years ahead of what we presently have. Hell, right now I'd kill for Ali Kart.

Dambrot's played mad scientist a little with the line up thus far, and given a extra long leash for mistakes to some, but the season starts Sunday. I expect the non-producers will start seeing more pine time, and the Top 8-9 guys will log the key minutes. Audition time is over.