Akron at Ohio

[GoZips]

Time-Warner has a replay of the OU game at eleven AM.

[bigzipguy]

Anybody think that some OU fans will watch the rerun??

[Dave in Green]

Just like you, I can't definitely tell from watching a play fail whether it was due to coach plan or player mis-execution. It is just frustrating to me to see that year after year, calling a time out to draw a play when we need a basket doesn't seem to improve our chances to get a good shot.

And since that has happened over the years, and with different teams and different players, the only common denominator is the coach. I may be wrong. This is just a fan opinion on a fan board, not a scientifically proven argument.

Anyways, my comment was not meant to steal the joy of the great win tonight. I guess I am just a perfectionist who can't enjoy a win without always looking for ways to get better and improve. And when I talk to KD, I don't get the feeling that he is so fragile and anti-criticism. Why do some of you (not directed to any one individual) feel that you have to protect him from his fans?

Thanks for taking the time to explain. I understand the fan frustration when things go wrong because I'm a fan and I get frustrated at times. Fans of all teams go through similar experiences. When I first started following basketball and saw something go wrong, I was quick to point a finger and blame someone. As a former professional basketball player and coach, my dad had been there and done that. He patiently explained to me all the things that can go wrong and how there can be many reasons that aren't obvious to a fan. That's the perspective I've had for many years.

I don't know where coach Dambrot stands among all college basketball coaches in terms of drawing up final plays. I've never seen a stat that ranks all coaches so we could know for sure who's below average and who's above average on that issue. I do know that fans are more sensitive to perception of shortcomings by their own coach and players. Whenever I see something go wrong I think back to my dad's words that coaches, players and fans all make mistakes, and it's not always clear who did what to whom.

[MDZip]

I just read their message board, and a zips fan posted on their board. Obvious he had been drinking in celebration of our win tonight, as there was poor punctuation and grammar. Anyway, the first person to comment about said zip fan, and hi. Lack of punctuation, made some snide remarks about it, and then failed tonuse any punctuation himself. Hillbillies

From the look of your post(s) I'm guessing said fan was you?

I find it bad form to go onto an opponents board and gloat after a tough loss as we would have all been feeling the same way had the same thing happened to the Zips. Losing at home to a hated rival when you were up by nine late in regulation and then by six late in OT? That's a stomach punch loss. Kudos to the Zips for never quitting. I think Jake Kretzer always torturing (torching?) them in their own building is punishment enough.

Doesn't look like a domiant team anywhere in the conference so looks like the Zips will likely be in the thick of things once again. I don't think a 14-4 is out of the question. Ohio isn't fabulous but beating them at thier place (only twice in the last 22 MAC games there has that happened, and both were by the Zips) is a good win. Wouldn't count OU out either. Toledo looked like they might be the class of the league but WMU brought the down to earth, but then they they barely beat Miami on the road (but maybe Miami is better). Buffalo is the only other 2-0 team but their two wins are EMU and NIU both at home. Nice start for the Zips to win two on the road.

And Ndour looks like he is a helluva player.

[Captain Kangaroo]

I just read their message board, and a zips fan posted on their board. Obvious he had been drinking in celebration of our win tonight, as there was poor punctuation and grammar. Anyway, the first person to comment about said zip fan, and hi. Lack of punctuation, made some snide remarks about it, and then failed tonuse any punctuation himself. Hillbillies

1.) I wish racer wouldn't go on opposing team's boards and post.

2.) OU fans seem far more interested in discussing punctuation and grammar than college basketball.

[Dr Z]

If one had to write a prescription to help this team last week, it might read "2OT win in Athens"

Hopefully this team uses that momentum to start playing some good basketball for the next two plus months.

PS Just wondering, did any ZN member not guess the play at the end of regulation during the timeout? If you didn't, subtract one from your total score.

"The low block is the answer for us,'' Dambrot said.

[UAZipster0305]

Great win for the Zips! I had this game down as a loss before the season even started. Let's hope it is an initiating event in what will become a run to another MAC East title.

What frustrates me (and I think a lot of other ZNO'ers) is that in general, KD's teams only play with consistent heart and to their potential in the MAC seasons. Though their have been flashes of strength in the OOC and post-seasons...the first half against Gonzaga, in spurts against ND, Mississippi State, Temple, Florida State...am I missing any?

[MontrealExposloveZippy]

Great win for the Zips! I had this game down as a loss before the season even started. Let's hope it is an initiating event in what will become a run to another MAC East title.

What frustrates me (and I think a lot of other ZNO'ers) is that in general, KD's teams only play with consistent heart and to their potential in the MAC seasons. Though their have been flashes of strength in the OOC and post-seasons...the first half against Gonzaga, in spurts against ND, Mississippi State, Temple, Florida State...am I missing any?

Coppin State?

[MaxZIP]

Coppin State?

They seem to treat non-conference games like bowl season. Might be a philosophical thread to pull on here.

[MaxZIP]

It was nice to watch a game against OU without thugs and poor sports Cooper and Keeley. Those two guys were dirty punks.

[skip-zip]

I don't think a 14-4 is out of the question.

And Ndour looks like he is a heluva player.

Heck, now that an OU road win is in the books, a 14-4 conference mark is certainly well within reason. And if we get past Toledo on Saturday, I may even change my mind about whether there's even 4 losses out there.

But for now, I will hang onto having serious doubts that this team can play with nearly the consistency of the teams of the last 7 or so years, in MAC play. So, 4 or more bad conference performances is still on the table. But, will we have the guts to pull any of those out in the end?

We have absolutely no answer for a guy as big and as athletic as N'Dour without playing a zone.

[skip-zip]

It was nice to watch a game against OU without thugs and poor sports Cooper and Keeley. Those two guys were dirty punks.

But at the same time, that's what made those 3 victories last year so much sweeter.

[Dave in Green]

N'dour is a big challenge because he's not your typical MAC-level player. As Elton wrote, he was highly recruited by Big East and Conference USA teams:

At Monroe College in New York last season, N'dour averaged 15.9 points, and 10.5 rebounds while shooting 52 percent overall, 41.7 percent on 3-pointers, and 81.1 percent on free throws. Highly recruited by nearly every program in the Big East and Conference USA, Ndour picked the Bobcats for one big reason.

"I came here because of the fit,'' N'dour said. "I saw I could come here and play. I didn't want to go to a high major school and sit. I wanted to go where I could play right away. Ohio University was a great fit for me.''

Athletically, like many Africans, N'dour's experience playing soccer only enhances his ability on the basketball court. The new rules regarding fouls enhances the need for great footwork. But he brings both offense and defense to the court.

"He's 'Q' with a jump shot,'' Christian said, referring to Haminn Quaintance, a 6-8 center he coached at Can't State when the Flashes advanced to the 2008 NCAA Tournament.

[MaxZIP]

But at the same time, that's what made those 3 victories last year so much sweeter.

Somewhere on a Grecian beach, DJ Cooper is lounging in his bikini dreaming of the days when the world was his oyster. Choosing between a career as a rap mogul and a quickly forgotten bobkitten punk must have been tough. I hope he was watching OU lose on the crappy washed-out internet stream remembering losing three to the Zips last year.

[johnnyzip84]

Somewhere on a Grecian beach, DJ Cooper is lounging in his bikini dreaming of the days when the world was his oyster. Choosing between a career as a rap mogul and a quickly forgotten bobkitten punk must have been tough. I hope he was watching OU lose on the crappy washed-out internet stream remembering losing three to the Zips last year.

Nice!

[Dave in Green]

Elton does one of his best analyses of the Zips, including the following:

... Akron's issues remain. But the fact is, at the mid-major level, every team has issues to overcome. Last season, without Quincy Diggs, the Zips lacked perimeter athleticism, but still wound up with a share of the Mid-American Conference regular season title and the overall MAC Tournament crown.

This season Diggs and his athleticism are back, but Akron is without a traditional point guard. The perimeter shooting is hit-or-miss, and the free throw line remains a danger zone. Deal with it, and carry on.

Until proven otherwise, Akron still has the most dominant baseline in the league, and a capable finisher in Diggs. That is where the Zips win. ...

... Waiting for point guards Nyles Evans (0-for-5 shooting, two huge missed free throws in OT) or Carmelo Betancourt (0 points, 2 turnovers) to change their stripes seems a lost cause.

The Zips will have to live with Diggs with the ball down the stretch and hope most nights end as it did in Athens. The 6-6 senior offset his five turnovers with 20 points and seven rebounds, 14 of those points coming in the final four minutes of regulation and the double OT. ...

[BirdZip]

...the lack of ability to draw a play has cost us games before and I don't want it to cost us again.

Interestingly, here's a quote from the ESPN.com conversation after the game:

Be nice to have a decent play called after you use a timeout!

The interesting part is that it's an OU fan talking about Jim Christian.

[zippy5]

Once again, no one mentioned the play KD drew up on our next to last possession that led to an easy layup by Harney.

[Captain Kangaroo]

Certainly one of the best non-tourney wins of the Keith Dambrot era.

The back-to-back MAC Champ Zips get everyone's best shot, so pulling off a double OT win in Athens is about as good as it gets.

The win certainly reinforces what we saw in Cleveland last March - the the Zips can beat anyone in the MAC, even without Abreu.

That said - For the "Think Bigger" crowd, I think our performances against upper-tier mid-majors and BCS-tier opposition since Abreu's departure shows we aren't exactly ready for an ACC invite either. "Performing Bigger" (beating noteworthy teams outside the MAC) is probably on the back-burner until Abreu is adequately replaced.

Back on topic - when Tree, Harney and Q are on their game, we can overcome a lot of shortcomings against MAC competition. When Kretzer and McAdams are hot too, the Zips can be unbeatable.

I like that Harney and Forsythe stepped up. I hope it is a trend. Harney has always played his best when he starts. I think Forsythe enjoyed not facing a "BCS big" like he has so many times this year.

Diggs makes his share of mistakes, but continues to offset them with clutch plays and hustle. Evans (who was that guy we saw vs. Oregon State?) and Betancourt make more mistakes, and are not offsetting them with any good ones.

After CB's 2nd reach in foul within about 20 seconds, Frenchie yells "YOU CAN'T KEEP DOING THAT!!" into the mike. Glad we're not the only ones getting frustrated.

Again - great win by the Zips. It really showed the potential for a supremely successful MAC season. Perhaps it even showed the benefit of playing such a tough non-conference schedule...I don't know that we'd have the grit and confidence necessary to pull off such a big road win if we'd have played our traditional early OOC cup cakes.

Beat Miami. And then send a message to the MAC with a throttling of Toledo on Saturday.

And on a completely unrelated note - Many of us were surprised when Elton Alexander had BG in his "Top 5 in Ohio." His buddy Louis Orr hasn't won squat in his way-too-long tenure at the Stroh's Light Center. Elton also didn't have the Zips rated in his Top 10, let alone Top 5.

Where's BG? Where are the Zips?

[zippy5]

Reghi informed us that we are undefeated when Harney hits double digits. He got to 10 before he fouled out last night. 15-0 or something like that when Nick hits 10+ points in his career.

[Dave in Green]

Once again, no one mentioned the play KD drew up on our next to last possession that led to an easy layup by Harney.

Everyone knows that was just another poorly planned play from Coach Dambrot that only succeeded due to an OU defensive failure.

[skip-zip]

Somewhere on a Grecian beach, DJ Cooper is lounging in his bikini dreaming of the days when the world was his oyster. Choosing between a career as a rap mogul and a quickly forgotten bobkitten punk must have been tough. I hope he was watching OU lose on the crappy washed-out internet stream remembering losing three to the Zips last year.

And not being able to hit a single bucket in the last of those 3 meetings.

[skip-zip]

Perhaps it even showed the benefit of playing such a tough non-conference schedule...I don't know that we'd have the grit and confidence necessary to pull off such a big road win if we'd have played our traditional early OOC cup cakes.

As I've pointed out many times, there's many more benefits to challenging yourself against higher level competition than just a higher SOS and RPI.

[RACER]

C\K it was not me posting on their board. I would not waste my time.

[Valpo Zip]

Thanks for taking the time to explain. I understand the fan frustration when things go wrong because I'm a fan and I get frustrated at times. Fans of all teams go through similar experiences. When I first started following basketball and saw something go wrong, I was quick to point a finger and blame someone. As a former professional basketball player and coach, my dad had been there and done that. He patiently explained to me all the things that can go wrong and how there can be many reasons that aren't obvious to a fan. That's the perspective I've had for many years.

I don't know where coach Dambrot stands among all college basketball coaches in terms of drawing up final plays. I've never seen a stat that ranks all coaches so we could know for sure who's below average and who's above average on that issue. I do know that fans are more sensitive to perception of shortcomings by their own coach and players. Whenever I see something go wrong I think back to my dad's words that coaches, players and fans all make mistakes, and it's not always clear who did what to whom.

Thank YOU Dave. It is a pleasure reading your posts and having discussions with you.

What you're stating about being too critical of one's own coach is absolutely correct. You'll never ever see me complain about Senderoff being out coached or Jim Christian failing to draw a play. On the other hand, If KD was the second best coach in the world, I am going to point at his shortcomings in hopes that he will become the best.