Game 7—BGSU Falcons

[Buckzip]

That game was coach I esque.

Other than the Power 5 games, we have at least been competitive. Against BGSU this team didn't deserve to be on the field.

So shocked by the defense. That D-Line isn't what was expected. The LB's-meh.

Pittman and Marcus have regressed since coming here. Coe doesn't make a lot of plays. Grice is Grice.

Does anyone know where Boxen is? Is he hurt and will he be back soon?

Not a lot of weapons on offense.

4 years in and we still can't even compete with the better teams in the MAC. Toledo would beat us even worse than BG did.

Not sure we can get better than Bowden, especially knowing that anyone better would be gone in a few years anyway.

How the hell does Toledo, BG, NIU, etc keep getting their coaches taken by bigger programs yet always find a good replacement?

[Zipgrad01]

You don't think BG had better players?

They did for sure, but I was pointing out that you made no sense. You say good luck to finding someone who can recruit better than Bowden, but you also say the reason we lost is because their players are better, which means we got out recruited. By your rationale, we will never be able to out recruit anyone in the top half of the mac because they all have better players than we do.

[a-zip]

Good luck getting recruits when there are 4K people at the game during recruiting trips

[ctmjbowes@sbcglobal.net]

The thing that I struggle with is that seemingly every program in the MAC has caught lightning in a bottle at least once in the last 15-20 years, except for Akron and Eastern. I'm not including 2005 which was flukey and the team was not a powerhouse, although they had a good year that ended really well. I used to ask the question endlessly here, which some didn't appreciate, about why that is. Your point about coaches, and the implicitly coupled question about recruiting, is one I wish we understood better. Even Can't had a couple of rocking seasons not long ago. If UA is destined to be a middling-to-crappy program I can get behind that in the same way that Cubs fans loved their lovable losers for decades. It would be helpful to fully understand the whys.

That game was coach I esque.

Other than the Power 5 games, we have at least been competitive. Against BGSU this team didn't deserve to be on the field.

So shocked by the defense. That D-Line isn't what was expected. The LB's-meh.

Pittman and Marcus have regressed since coming here. Coe doesn't make a lot of plays. Grice is Grice.

Does anyone know where Boxen is? Is he hurt and will he be back soon?

Not a lot of weapons on offense.

4 years in and we still can't even compete with the better teams in the MAC. Toledo would beat us even worse than BG did.

Not sure we can get better than Bowden, especially knowing that anyone better would be gone in a few years anyway.

How the hell does Toledo, BG, NIU, etc keep getting their coaches taken by bigger programs yet always find a good replacement?

[Lee Adams]

Another ugly loss to BG and to a good MAC team. Oh,and Can't won on the road. Anyway,by the numbers.

On the offensive side there is 41 rushes for 158. On the surface that doesn't look too bad. Hundley had 69 on 16 carries. Passing 15-30 for 104(Woodson was 13-28) and 2 Woodson picks.

Now those splits wouldn't be bad. They tried to run to control the ball. But,they had 4 total T/O's and could only put up 10 points. None in the 2nd half. And,they were already down by 18 at half.

Too many 'empty' plays being called and run. 262 total yards,71 plays at 3.7 per play. BG ran 'only'75 plays but had over 500 total at 7.1 per play.

But,stick with Woodson. Lets see how he bounces back. Pohl is not the future.

The defensive numbers are a train wreck. 59 points,thats half a hundred + again. 412 yards passing. 5 passing TD's. No picks. A porous pass defense is still porous. Lewis had 118 with 2 TD's. BG had 120 on the ground. No fumbles.

9 penalties for 75 yards is also a killer. But,thats the Zips.

Someone said it a week or so ago,wrong kind of D being played by Akron to slow down BG. I think the Akron D has been sufficiently exposed against good teams thus far this season

On the TV show earlier in the week Bowden sounded more hopeful than prepared or confident. His players played like they were too hopeful and not well enough prepared.

Nobody will get fired during the season or at least should not. But, Bowden's group has shown again that they are not up to the challenge of beating the really good MAC programs.

The rest of the season will be difficult simply because of the 2 losses to the two of the better teams in the MAC not to mention the East.

Whether they can run the table and get to 7 wins is now highly questionable. Fortunately the MAC schedule this year is relatively easy. CMU is the toughest game left,except for Can't.

Anything less than 6 wins will certainly invite a lot of scrutiny at season's end.

[ZippyRulz]

The thing that I struggle with is that seemingly every program in the MAC has caught lightning in a bottle at least once in the last 15-20 years, except for Akron and Eastern. I'm not including 2005 which was flukey and the team was not a powerhouse, although they had a good year that ended really well. I used to ask the question endlessly here, which some didn't appreciate, about why that is. Your point about coaches, and the implicitly coupled question about recruiting, is one I wish we understood better. Even Can't had a couple of rocking seasons not long ago. If UA is destined to be a middling-to-crappy program I can get behind that in the same way that Cubs fans loved their lovable losers for decades. It would be helpful to fully understand the whys.

If UA is destined to be a middling-to-crappy program, it's time to put the football millions to more productive uses.

Edited October 20, 2015 by ZippyRulz

[zipsoutsider]

His players played like they were too hopeful and not well enough prepared.

Care to give any examples?

[LZIp]

Because Saban, Meyer, and Harbaugh are not interested in the job. Who do you have in mind that will do a better job?

Paul Winters is currently a loser at the D2 level. He may be interested if asked again. RI was supposed to be a recruiter. That worked out great the first time. Maybe we can give him another chance.

[Lee Adams]

Care to give any examples?

59-10; 3.7 yds/play by the offense(either they were playing a great defense or the play calling was really bad); 500+ yds given up by the D; over 7yds per play given up by the D:9 penalties for 75 yds......and on....

[K92]

I was kinda hoping for some more discussion about this game, but I guess not.

[Dr Z]

I was kinda hoping for some more discussion about this game, but I guess not.

I will rewatch the game on ESPN3 sometime this week and give my thoughts then. I have a difficult time evaluating what an offense and defense are doing from field level. Actually, I have two weeks to watch. I can comment on one thing now. I have seen Zips teams in the past take a butt beating while "playfullness" was occurring on the sideline. That was NOT the case Saturday. As a group, everyone looked sick to their stomachs, or angry. I hope it motivates to intensify practice. Overall, I thought they seemed flat Saturday.

Edited October 19, 2015 by Dr Z

[zipsoutsider]

59-10; 3.7 yds/play by the offense(either they were playing a great defense or the play calling was really bad); 500+ yds given up by the D; over 7yds per play given up by the D:9 penalties for 75 yds......and on....

Go look at the stats from every previous game BG has played this year - all, including Tennessee and Memphis gave up over 500 yards in D. I thought the one 15 yard penalty where Monroe was charged with roughing the passer was BS.

We got beat by better players, period. Woodson will improve and will be very good for us as he does.

[K92]

I will rewatch the game on ESPN3 sometime this week and give my thoughts then. I have a difficult time evaluating what an offense and defense are doing from field level. Actually, I have two weeks to watch. I can comment on one thing now. I have seen Zips teams in the past take a butt beating while "playfullness" was occurring on the sideline. That was NOT the case Saturday. As a group, everyone looked sick to their stomachs, or angry. I hope it motivates to intensify practice. Overall, I thought they seemed flat Saturday.

I tried to rewatch it yesterday, but into the 2nd quarter it started to get too depressing. I am planning to try and get through the rest of it after work tonight.

[LoyalZIP]

Cody Grice tells it like it is in GT's write up.

“It just [stunk],” senior defensive lineman Cody Grice said. “Everybody played terrible. We played terrible. The coaches coached terrible. It was just a bad effort as a whole.”

Last year, the Zips were blown out by Marshall at home following a week three bye. This year, a home game follows the bye again, but it will be week 8 and the opponent will be a solid Central Michigan squad.

[Zipgrad01]

Go look at the stats from every previous game BG has played this year - all, including Tennessee and Memphis gave up over 500 yards in D. I thought the one 15 yard penalty where Monroe was charged with roughing the passer was BS.

We got beat by better players, period. Woodson will improve and will be very good for us as he does.

Quit making excuses. There is no reason Bowling Green should have players so much better that they beat us by 49. The sad part is that they could have beaten us by 69 had they wanted to.

You sound like a complete apologist.

[K92]

Quit making excuses. There is no reason Bowling Green should have players so much better that they beat us by 49. The sad part is that they could have beaten us by 69 had they wanted to.

You sound like a complete apologist.

I don't think we got out athleted as much as we got out schemed. There are a couple of players on Bowling Green's offense that were definitely nice gets. Roger Lewis is a prime-time player who had a laundry list of offers that somehow landed at BG. He caught 6 balls for 118 yards. He wasn't a Zip killer. He probably could have been if needed, because the guy is probably going to be drafted, but they spread the ball to 9 receivers if you want to count the grab by the qb on the trick play. They have a couple of other receivers that had respectable offer lists, but for the most part, their prolific offense is filled with guys that not too many other schools were looking at.

The guy pulling the trigger, Matt Johnson has an offer sheet like Tommy Woodson's. He was offered by BG, Miami & Temple. Woody was offered by BG, Akron & Arizona. Their RB, Roger Greene? BG, only offer. It is the system that is producing the numbers. James Knapke, a 2 star out of Fort Wayne, Indiana with exactly 1 offer threw for 3173 yards last year when Johnson went down.

It's not the talent. Comparing the talent on BG's offense with the talent on Akron's defense is no more than a wash. Akron probably even wins that comparison. It's the scheme. If BG had better talent on offense they would be undefeated and totally unstoppable.

Edited October 19, 2015 by Keener'92

[skip-zip]

Keener. Fantastic analysis. I believe in your findings.

But, it does makes you have to ask an obvious question.

Why don't we have a scheme in place that maximizes our offensive talent, and therefore maximize our point output as well, if there really isn't much of a difference between the two teams, talent wise ?

[zippyman23]

The guy pulling the trigger, Matt Johnson has an offer sheet like Tommy Woodson's. He was offered by BG, Miami & Temple. Woody was offered by BG, Akron & Arizona. Their RB, Roger Greene? BG, only offer. It is the system that is producing the numbers. James Knapke, a 2 star out of Fort Wayne, Indiana with exactly 1 offer threw for 3173 yards last year when Johnson went down.

It's not the talent. Comparing the talent on BG's offense with the talent on Akron's defense is no more than a wash. Akron probably even wins that comparison. It's the scheme. If BG had better talent on offense they would be undefeated and totally unstoppable.

It's more than just scheme. Johnson and Greene, along with a couple receivers/lineman, were starters two years ago when they won the MAC under Clawson. They've got talent and experience.

[K92]

Keener. Fantastic analysis. I believe in your findings.

But, it does makes you have to ask an obvious question.

Why don't we have a scheme in place that maximizes our offensive talent, and therefore maximize our point output as well, if there really isn't much of a difference between the two teams, talent wise ?

I am thoroughly convinced that running the spread is the first ingredient for any team that wants to maximize their offensive talent. The second ingredient is tempo.

You saw what happened when the Zips followed the recipe in 2012. Our offensive talent was maximized and there wasn't an overabundance of it.

In 2013 & 2014 part of the recipe was left out. Tempo. You know how you can leave out an ingredient in one of your favorite dishes and the result tastes like shit? That's kind of what happened to the Zips offense.

This year, initially, the baby was thrown out with the bath water and we changed the offense. As the year has progressed we have used the old offense a little more and even ran tempo a little bit. When we ran tempo good things happen. If you want to run the ball more, you can run the ball more out of the air raid. You don't need to change the offense to run more. That is why my head nearly exploded when I actually watched the Zips offense at the start of the season.

Now, as for why the offense was changed, you would have to ask Bowden. Initially he was quoted as saying he didn't want a running qb because it was more important for the qb to look back to the sideline for the next play to get right back up to the line. I think it was called "Bowden Ball". I thought that was what we were hanging our hat on. I have no earthly idea why the philosophy changed, but I gotta think it was the flawed logic that our defense was getting good enough to win games. Akron's defense will never be good enough to depend on it to win games. My God, Alabama's defense is littered with future NFL players and they have a real challenge defending the spread at times. Remember when they were supposed to walk all over WVU a couple of years ago? That Mountaineer offense made it interesting for a while until talent finally took over. In MAC football, the best defense is a good offense. You can scheme on offense. Defensive success is much more based talent available. Defense is all about the Jimmies and Joes. Offense is more about the Xs & Os.

I'm done ranting. I've already been labeled a Drano chugger.

[K92]

It's more than just scheme. Johnson and Greene, along with a couple receivers/lineman, were starters two years ago when they won the MAC under Clawson. They've got talent and experience.

They do have talent and experience. So do the Zips. How many seniors are playing this year? A whole lot more than will be playing next year.

[Balsy]

They do have talent and experience. So do the Zips. How many seniors are playing this year? A whole lot more than will be playing next year.

But the Zips haven't won more than 5 games since those guys have been here. Comparing apples and chuncks of granite.

[Jrship35]

I am thoroughly convinced that running the spread is the first ingredient for any team that wants to maximize their offensive talent. The second ingredient is tempo.

You saw what happened when the Zips followed the recipe in 2012. Our offensive talent was maximized and there wasn't an overabundance of it.

In 2013 & 2014 part of the recipe was left out. Tempo. You know how you can leave out an ingredient in one of your favorite dishes and the result tastes like shit? That's kind of what happened to the Zips offense.

This year, initially, the baby was thrown out with the bath water and we changed the offense. As the year has progressed we have used the old offense a little more and even ran tempo a little bit. When we ran tempo good things happen. If you want to run the ball more, you can run the ball more out of the air raid. You don't need to change the offense to run more. That is why my head nearly exploded when I actually watched the Zips offense at the start of the season.

Now, as for why the offense was changed, you would have to ask Bowden. Initially he was quoted as saying he didn't want a running qb because it was more important for the qb to look back to the sideline for the next play to get right back up to the line. I think it was called "Bowden Ball". I thought that was what we were hanging our hat on. I have no earthly idea why the philosophy changed, but I gotta think it was the flawed logic that our defense was getting good enough to win games. Akron's defense will never be good enough to depend on it to win games. My God, Alabama's defense is littered with future NFL players and they have a real challenge defending the spread at times. Remember when they were supposed to walk all over WVU a couple of years ago? That Mountaineer offense made it interesting for a while until talent finally took over. In MAC football, the best defense is a good offense. You can scheme on offense. Defensive success is much more based talent available. Defense is all about the Jimmies and Joes. Offense is more about the Xs & Os.

I'm done ranting. I've already been labeled a Drano chugger.

So let's say that the missing ingredient is tempo (which I would tend to agree with) ......... What is the root cause inhibiting the tempo ? Is it the personnel ? Is it the speed of play calling ? What is the main difference from 2012 ?

My thought is that the play calling seems to be a bit slow to run an uptempo style.

[zippyman23]

They do have talent and experience. So do the Zips. How many seniors are playing this year? A whole lot more than will be playing next year.

The point is that they had success (MAC title) their sophomore year, under a different coach and different scheme. To dismiss their success over us this year as seniors as a product of a scheme is just being short-sighted. That team has talent and winning experience.

Edited October 19, 2015 by zippyman23

[zipsoutsider]

Quit making excuses. There is no reason Bowling Green should have players so much better that they beat us by 49. The sad part is that they could have beaten us by 69 had they wanted to.

You sound like a complete apologist.

By pointing out that BG has put up 500+ yards in every game, including top 20 ranked teams?????? Get real.

To say that BG has a couple of more talented players is just plain ridiculous. Their QB is nothing short of incredible and they have receivers who consistently make catches.

[K92]

So let's say that the missing ingredient is tempo (which I would tend to agree with) ......... What is the root cause inhibiting the tempo ? Is it the personnel ? Is it the speed of play calling ? What is the main difference from 2012 ?

My thought is that the play calling seems to be a bit slow to run an uptempo style.

I would think it was a coaching decision.