Dave in Green

I'd like to think that knowing this is KD's strategy would put an end to the endlessly repeated criticism of McNees for dribbling so much around mid court. If a player is following the directions of the coach, and the coach directs him to dribble around a lot, then the player cannot be legitimately blamed. It's a coaching decision, pure and simple.We know for a fact that KD is not slow to pull a player off the court for not doing everything the player has been coached to do. So by his long minutes on the floor, it should be obvious that McNees is doing exactly what KD wants him to do.Not that McNees doesn't make mistakes. All players do. But the dribbling around is not a McNees mistake, and blaming a player for a coaching strategy that some fans may not like is misguided at best.

Good topic for Off Topic, Smack & Jokes.

Amen on Pomeroy. The Zips don't get any more respect on Pomeroy than on RPI, but I think it's more accurate on Can't and Buffalo. 86. Can't 113. Akron128. Ohio146. Western Mich154. Miami165. Buffalo189. Central Mich202. Eastern Mich215. Bowling Green224. Ball State252. Northern Ill323. ToledoEDIT: Forgot to say I thought it would be easier to read the Pomeroy ratings by splitting them out separately.

I'm in. I've been posting a lot about Dakotah Euton, and haven't been looking as much for info on the other two forwards coming in next year. So it will be great to have a chance to actually see one of them play instead of just reading about them.Egner is rated in the second 12 of Rick Bolus' list of the top 75+ seniors in Ohio HS basketball, which puts him among about the top dozen senior frontcourt players in the state, while Michael Green is rated in the second 25:Rick Bolus OH RatingsBy comparison, Bolus ranks Euton in the top 12 of the 75+ top seniors in Kentucky, which puts him among the top half dozen senior frontcourt players in that state:Rick Bolus KY RatingsThe more I learn about these three players, the better I like the Zips' 2010 recruiting class.

So it's either "stats" or "emotion?" How about "stats," and "having a free-thinking bone in your head to decide on one's own what one just witnessed?" If games were played by computers, then reading stats would be the perfect way to follow a team. Hell...there'd be no need to watch a game. The stats would be a 100% perfect representation of the competiton. But...sadly for Stat Guy...the games are played by human beings. Coaching decisions are made by human beings. Fatigue comes into play. Mental toughness comes into play. Crowd noise effects the game. Referees decisions affect the outcome. Things occur late in a game that don't occur at the 10-minute mark of the first half. Hustle-plays can win games, but cannot be quantified by statistics. And on and on and on...Some fans have the ability to blindly trust every move a player or coaching staff makes, accept those moves, applaud them and walk away from the game with no desire to kibitz about how the game played-out. To take the game at face value.Other fans value the human element of the games over statistics. Which team competed harder...which player shined over the others...which coaching decisions were puzzling and which were dead-nutz on, which player obviously didn't come to play on a given day...etc. They enjoy discussion of the game's ebb & flow. Of speculating how things may have turned out differently under alternate scenarios.I learn WAY more from reading this board and seeing how other human beings viewed the game I just witnessed than I ever could by evaluating a +/- sheet. People who need such stats to tell them what they just witnessed first-hand wasted their money on a game ticket.Viva the post-game kibitz - be it @ BW-3's, or the Internet!If I trusted my eyes or your eyes, I would have thought McNees just threw the ball away. In my case, someone next to me happened to see Roberts fall. Unfortunately, you left the game believing what your eyes told you. Your eyes also apparently failed to see Rasor's comment about Roberts fall resulting in the McNees pass out of bounds.That's a great example of why it pays not to base one's opinion completely on what one has seen with one's own eyes, or in this case, not seen. Relying only on stats can also lead one astray. But considering as much empirical and statistical data as possible, taking the results of one's own analysis with a grain of salt and not jumping to conclusions will generally lead to more educated and accurate observations.There's a pretty good discussion on this going on in the Nav's Hoops Stats thread.

The JAR was blessed last night by the presence of none other than Sam Lickliter, Supervisor of Officials for the Mid-American Conference.Based on what he saw on the court and heard from the fans, do you think he will side with the officials on the way they officiated the game or with the fans who found the game virtually unwatchable at times?If he's on the side of having MAC games officiated this way, then he's on the side of having diminishing fan interest in attending MAC games.

I've said many times on this forum that I think McNees could be a much higher percentage shooter if he didn't have the responsibility of running the point. I've said I hoped that the other Zips point guards would step up and win point time away from McNees so he could spend more time at shooting guard and focus more on getting open looks.Only KD knows for sure why this hasn't happened. He's the one who makes the calls on who's best at each position in each circumstance. From watching and evaluating all the Zips practices and game play, KD obviously believes that no one has stepped forward and proven they can do a better job at the point in most situations than McNees.Whether that's the responsibility of the other guards for not proving themselves when given the opportunity or the responsibility of the coach for not giving them enough opportunity is pure speculation.Some notion can be found in the stats, though they don't always tell the whole story. Thanks to Nav, we now have the benefit of yet another measuring tool for player performance. Nav's +/- analysis of last night's game shows McNees at +18. The next closest Zips player was B. McKnight at +8.But for those who don't trust stats, the option is always there to let your emotions be your guide and continue to rag on the coaches and players for every perceived imperfection you think you saw and think you understand better than the coaches and players.The most popular sport on the planet, after all, is second-guessing sports decisions. It's the single biggest generator of message volume on sports forums around the world.

I was also mystified by the McNees pass to nowhere until the person sitting next to me explained that he had been watching Roberts, and Roberts had fallen to the floor just as McNees was launching a pass him.If McNees had a major problem with turnovers, it would show up in the stats. It doesn't.

Yes we got lucky they traveled, but we deserved to win that game we led for most of it...just had some poor play calling and shot choices at the endTo say nothing of that insane call by the refs that blew the whistle for no reason, that was game over at that point if that didn't happen.I love how the ref that was 40 feet away made the call but that slick back dark haired ref couldn't make the call when it was right in front of him.That guy is a joke. The North side rowdies were booing him and he went to the police officer during a timeout in the first half and told her that he would have a few of us thrown out if we continued. I know this because an usher came over and spoke with me about it. I actually spoke with that officer following the game and she said that he actually wanted the entire section cleared if they couldnt calm us down. Now THAT is getting in a refs head.From our perspective upstairs, the "slick back dark haired ref" was the one who was making all the bad calls against the Zips and swallowing his whistle at the other end of the court. He's the one who should be removed from the court by the police officer for impersonating an impartial ref.

I suppose I could say I was disappointed that the Zips didn't simply demolish the last place team in the MAC east on the Zips' home court. But, as I said before the game, the Bobcats deserve respect. They started the season slow, but have been much improved in recent games. Bobcats fans should be proud of their team for playing so well. They will be a force to be reckoned with in the future. I knew this was going to be a tough game.It's always tempting to focus on the things that the Zips did wrong. But since other posters here handle that aspect so well, I'd like to focus on a good feeling I had sitting through that marathon. As good as the Bobcats were shooting, and as many mistakes as the Zips made, I never got that sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach that the Zips were going to throw it away. Even though I knew there was a possibility that the Bobcats might shoot the lights out and the Zips might not be able to match them shot for shot, I never felt the Zips gave up or thought they weren't going to win. They continued to play aggressively and with confidence, even when they misfired. They kept coming back for more.Regardless of what went right and what went wrong in this game, I liked the Zips' attitude. I'd like to see some aspects of their execution improve. But I have no doubt they have it within them to do it.Bottom line is, Can't lost, Miami lost and the Zips won. That's all that really matters right now. The Zips have moved into a really good position with just 4 regular season conference games left, and I think they have more in them to show when it's needed.

The Bobkitties can score in bunches in select games. Over their last 7 games, they've scored big in 4 -- 89, 90, 99 & 99. All but 1 of those was against the MAC west. But one of those 99s was against Buffalo. So the Zips will need to be prepared on both defense and offense, and treat this team with respect even though they're at the bottom of the MAC east.

Sure, TV is one of several important factors in attracting recruits. So is winning. Note that he selected the winning team from that TV broadcast, not the loser. Wonder what his thoughts would have been if the Zips had smashed BG in that game?

Zips now control their own destiny again. If they win their last 5 conference games, they're undisputed regular season champs and #1 seed in the MAC tournament. But going undefeated in the last 5 MAC conference games won't be easy for anyone, as Can't learned today. Just take them 1 game at a time. Start off by not taking Ohio lightly.

Can't dominating the boards, and doing nothing else right. Terrible field goal and free throw shooting, 13 turnovers and 0 assists. It's not often that a D1 team plays an entire half without a single assist! Would be fun to have a hidden camera in their locker room at halftime.Could Can't be falling back to earth after their mini invincible streak?

GP1, I'll omit the long quote of the above conversation and just say that I agree with a lot of what you say here. I'm sure that UA does have a multifaceted business plan for all sports, including men's basketball. We just don't have access to it, so we can never really know whether or not they are progressing as planned. We're all just guessing.I think we all agree that the program has been moving up since KD took over as head coach, and that we generally like the direction the program has gone. But a taste of success always makes fans hungrier for more.The schedule is fair game to call out because it does not appear to have changed much in recent years. Here, too, I think we have a lot of agreement that a small increase in SOS would not hurt the team in any way, and may have some positive benefits. You'd think at least some improvement in SOS would have been part of an overall plan to grow the program, and that it would have happened by now. But KD has been on record that he hasn't seen the benefit in playing a stronger schedule given the reality that the MAC is a 1-bid conference. There are other reasons, however, to consider a stronger schedule, and I think from recent statements that KD may be more open to considering an increase in SOS than he has been in the past. If the athletic department needs more money generated by the men's basketball program, part of their overall plan should have consideration of all the available options to accomplish that. ATM games would be one of those options. Investing in more team marketing is another, as is the whole question of facilities to try to draw more fans. Again, there are many factors, and they all interact with each other. The overall plan must arrange the interlocking pieces so that they are in harmony and not at odds with each other.Ultimate responsibility for the direction of the men's BB program is more in Tom Wistrcill's court than KD's. Is TW running with the old BB plan or is he developing a new one? Do any of those responsible for developing the program read forums like this to see what the fans want? Would they be able to interpret what the fans want after reading some of our conflicting viewpoints? ;)I definitely agree that trying to be Gonzaga of the East is totally unrealistic without a huge budget increase. And it's unrealistic to imagine UA increasing its BB budget by several hundred percent unless there's a total commitment at UA that becoming a consistent national BB power is worth such a huge investment.Right now, I'm pretty happy with where men's BB is now from where the Zips were before KD. The Zips are now consistently near the top of the MAC and in contention for the championship. That's something that tens of millions of college basketball fans across the country can only dream of as their teams annually battle to stay out of their conference cellars.For the near future, I'd be satisfied if UA could simply move ahead of Can't as the MAC's perennial power. I want to see the Zips favored to win the MAC championship every year, not just in the years after they won the previous year's championship. I'd support any legal, ethical and morally responsible path to follow to get there. But I doubt there will ever be total agreement on the exact path to take, because there is no single proven formula. If there were, it would be pretty simple to get a copy of that blueprint and follow it step by step.One thing to keep in mind is the old physician's first rule of "do no harm." As much as we fans want the Zips BB program to continue moving up, I don't think we'd be very tolerant of a misstep that set the program back. So whatever changes are made must be well thought out and executed. We can throw out all the brilliant ideas we want here at absolutely no cost. But someone at UA is going to have to buy into a plan and live with its success or failure.

+1The last time I went to the Diamond Grille, I was really disappointed to spend so much money on slow service and tough steaks.I can't go more than a few weeks without an Ido Cafe Strip California (14 oz. strip marinated in Steve's "secret blend" of soy sauce, red wine, garlic, olive oil & spices) at half the price of a similar steak dinner at Diamond Grille.But a party of 30 might be pushing it at such a small restaurant.

I respectfully disagree and would submit this is a dodge. I've been reading the "building process" dodge on this board for how many years now and it is sickening. The fact of the matter is there is much better talent on the team now than when KD took over the program. The schedule is the same. One could argue that Malone AND St. Francis makes the schedule worse. As far as waiting to get a new arena before a better schedule, how freaking long will that take and why should they get a new arena?...Only 3.500 people show up and the state of Ohio is broke. They're so boring nobody will pay to watch and the most exciting thing that happened this week was a player getting suspended. The Rubber Bowl was falling down...the JAR is in fine condition.The issue nobody is discussing and CK brought it up in his original post is the BB program, while winning a lot of games, is not contributing as much as they could to the financial well being of the athletic department. This has to stop. The football team plays 75% of their games against BCS teams...that has to stop also and the BB program should not adopt that strategy. If the basketball team loses a few more games a year and the football team adopts a sane schedule and wins a couple more games while playing at home, the athletic department will be better off. The greatest opportunity for revenue generation is through the football program and the 25,000 seat stadium they play in, not the 3,500 per game crowds the basketball team plays in front of. The basketball team has maxed out it's revenue generation. They played an abnormally large number of home ooc games this year and they seem to be maxed out at 3,500 per game the year after a MAC Championship. If they play fewer home ooc games next year and crowds remain the same (if they don't win the MAC, the risk of a smaller average exists), they are actually in a worse financial situation than this season unless they can get a price increase in tickets. Basically, the Zips NEED to play higher level teams if they are going to contribute fully to the athletic department.The basketball team would be in no different position right now if they played UNC in lieu of Malone. They could also dump one other mid major and play a Pitt or some other Big East team. I thought Mack was a good AD, but one criticism of him I will make is he allowed the BB program to get away with not holding up their financial end. We'll see if the TW makes some changes...he needs to for the sake of the entire athletic department.Sorry, but with all due respect, Zips basketball isn't going anywhere without a complete plan that is well-conceived, well-executed and addresses all areas of the program. Simply dropping a few weak opponents from the schedule and adding a few strong ones is a bandage.The real dodge is to say you can throw a bandage on one area of the program and magically make it successful. No successful major business -- and UA is certainly a successful major business in the field of higher education -- would ever consider conducting business in such a haphazard manner.What's the complete business plan that goes along with increasing SOS?

I can't find anything about a special deal for people moving to work in the Toyota plant. But KHSAA Bylaw 6 clearly has a number of exceptions, including the following obvious one:Sec. 2) Discretionary Exceptions for Waivera) BONA FIDE CHANGE IN RESIDENCE - The period of ineligibility may be waived if there has been a bonafide change in residence by the parents and student that precedes a student’s change of schools.For purposes of this bylaw, a bonafide change of residence means the moving of the permanent residence of the entire family of the student and the student’s parents from one school district or defined school attendance area into another school district or defined school attendance area prior to a change in enrollment of the student. A student who becomes emancipated does not have a bonafide change of residence by virtue of his or her emancipation and change of residence for purposes of this bylaw.KHSAA Bylaw 6 LinkIn fact, the Eutons ran into a problem with this. The father (Clay Euton) left one company when it closed its Kentucky office, took another job with another company in the Scott County school district and moved his family there to a new home after selling the old home. But the KHSAA initially refused to waive the 1-year period of ineligibility because Clay Euton was quoted as saying in a newspaper interview that part of his reason for taking the new job in Scott County was that they had a great basketball program that would be good for his son. The KHSAA apparently believed that violated the following:Sec. 3) Specific Restrictions Resulting in Denial of WaiverSatisfying of one of the exceptions (a through i) shall not be considered valid and a waiver of the period of ineligibility shall not be granted:c) If the change in schools is motivated in whole or part by a desire to participate in athletics at the new school;Here's the Louisville Courier-Journal story with the Clay Euton quote:Louisville Courier-Journal LinkThe Lexington Herald-Leader covered all of the above in the following story:Lexington Herald-Leader LinkThe Eutons won their appeal, and Dakotah was allowed to play immediately at Scott County. This was covered in the following story in the Lexington Herald-Leader:Lexington Herald-Leader LinkSome insight into what was going on is provided in this interesting commentary on a Kentucky sports site. I find the following to be extremely well thought-out and written, and well worth reading. It asks the simple question of whether the intent of the KHSAA Bylaws is to prevent families from giving any thought to the sports programs in which their children will be playing when they are forced to move due to a job change:Euton Commentary LinkAll in all, a really convoluted but interesting story to follow, and a happy ending.

I agree that the Zips schedule should be strengthened. But it has to be part of a bigger plan, including higher level players and a better facility. It should be done incrementally at about the same rate that better new recruits are brought in. The level of recruiting has been slowly going up under KD, and took a bigger step up with Zeke. I'm also impressed with Dakotah Euton coming to UA next season. Players of this caliber have the potential to play a tougher schedule and be competitive. The Zips are getting stronger as a team, and could handle a tougher OOC schedule.I would like to see the Zips transition from their current level OOC schedule to one closer to what Miami and CSU schedule, but over a period of 2 or 3 years. We need another tough opponent or two added next year to make sure that next year's OOC schedule is at least a little tougher than this year's, and then make the following year a little tougher still.

One of the reasons I find it interesting to follow Euton's senior HS season is because his team, Scott County, plays at a very high level, with many games against highly ranked HS teams from other states. It's similar to the schedule St. V-M played when LeBron was there. Scott County is ranked the #1 HS team in Kentucky despite 5 losses this season because it's recognized that they play such a high level of competition compared with other Kentucky HS teams.Last night, Scott County played the #1, and only unbeaten, HS team from West Virginia, George Washington (Charleston). I should say previously unbeaten, because Scott County demolished them. The score was 28-6 after the first quarter and 51-20 at halftime, and Scott Country coasted from there to a 77-58 win after sitting all the starters.Despite playing short minutes, Euton just missed a double-double with 15 points and 9 rebounds. In almost every other Scott County box score I've seen, Euton has posted a double-double. He doesn't do it by himself. Scott County has several good players. But Euton is the tallest player in Scott County's starting lineup, and is usually matched up against the other team's best big man. Because his team plays so many nationally ranked teams, he gets his numbers against tough competition, not a bunch of weaklings.I think playing at such a high level of competition in HS may give Euton an edge over the Zips' other two recruits when the three new forwards report in at UA. I don't think their teams play at anywhere near Scott County's level of competition. The transition to D1 basketball should be a little easier for a player from a HS team that plays on more of a national stage than just normal in-state competition.

I don't think that Rasor is really predicting the Can't-BG-Zips scenario. He's just reporting what his formula spits out, after which he points out all the flaws in his formula. Sounds a lot like RPI. ;)Most of the teams in the MAC have had major up and down swings, so it all depends on which end of the swing you're catching someone. For example, we caught Buffalo at Buffalo at the absolute worst time. Will the Buffalo visiting Akron be the same bellowing bulls we faced then, or the docile steers of recent weeks?

I've been to all the home games and watched the road games on video. Most of Zeke's missed shots have not been dunks, though he did miss a few dunks early in the season. More lately he has been relying on a sweet hook shot and some medium range jumpers in addition to the layups and dunks.You might want to check the stats before jumping to conclusions. The highest field goal percentage of any D1 7-footer in the country is 62.9% by 7-1 Mike Tisdale, University of Illinois. That's not much better than Zeke has shot in MAC play. Being 7-feet tall doesn't mean you get a free pass on close-in shots.D1 Shooting Percentage Leaders

I believe there were two definitive tailgating threads on ZN last year, one before the first home game and one after, that have some useful info. I'll include both links below, and if anyone knows of any other useful tailgating threads, they can add to these:Pre Home Opener Tailgating ThreadPost Home Opener Tailgating Thread

Well, yes, we did discuss this and apparently still see it a bit differently, or maybe we just describe it a little differently. How about we take a look at the stats this time:Overall, Zeke is currently shooting field goals at a fair .462 percentage for the season, including conference and non-conference games.If we look only at conference games, which represent the 11 most recent games the Zips have played this season, Zeke's field goal shooting average is a much better .541. That means that Zeke has the Zips second highest field goal shooting percentage in conference play behind only Bardo's .571. But Bardo has only taken 7 field goal attempts in conference play. So, in reality, Zeke is leading all Zips in field goal shooting percentage in MAC play.Yes, I see every player occasionally rushing shots and showing shaky shot selection, including Zeke.Yes, I see that Zeke rushed more shots and showed more shaky shot selection than many of his teammates earlier in the season (non-conference games).No, I no longer see Zeke's rushed shots and shaky shot selection as glaringly greater than many of his teammates, as demonstrated by his .541 shooting percentage over the last 11 games. The most important thing right now is that he is shooting at a consistently high percentage.I think that Zeke will continue to improve in this area as he will in all other areas. But I no longer see it as a special area of concern.

Under the category of It's Never Too Early ......Rasor Link