GP1

It was 1992. Gary Pinkel's first season at UT. It wasn't just the last second kick. Toledo made a great comeback and scored with little time remaining in the game to tie it. Back then there was no overtime. Akron was able to get just close enough to kick the FG with no time remaining. https://utrockets.com/sports/football/schedule/1992 If there are any journalists who read this and have a copy of an ABJ article or a news video, that would be awesome. It really was a great college football game. I would love to know how Toledo scored late. My memory says it was 20-17 and they kicked a late FG to tie it but were really close to scoring a TD, but my memory ain't what it used to be.

That's a pretty loose definition of a rivalry. If the series being competitive is the benchmark, then the OSU vs. Michigan rivalry is not really one. In fact, it's becoming the Tennessee vs. Vandy rivalry in terms of national relevance. Besides, I'm not really interested in debating what rivalry means. I want them to play because they are two schools within two hours of each other, at the same level and that allows students, fans, alumni and the general community (basically the taxpayers of Ohio) to enjoy a day of fun and football on a late summer day. If the mayors want to have some sort of trophy, I could really give a hoot. Akron won't always be this bad. We have been this bad before and have recovered to some level of respectability. Not that long ago we were in the MACC. The MAC is a pretty easy conference to get good in as long as you don't make catastrophic mistakes.

I don't know, but my guess is misplaced priorities by athletic directors followed closely by a lack of imagination. What is a rivalry? I have no idea. I would say that UNC and Wake have no rivalry. Wake really has no rival. UNC has Duke and NC State to hate. UNC and Wake have decided that playing each other in OOC games when they are not scheduled for an ACC match up is good for the players, students, alumni, fans and general community. The last time they played it was a beautiful 6 PM, Friday night kick off in W-S. It was a great game with Wake having to hold off a desperate second half comeback by UNC. After the game, the bars and restaurants in uptown W-S were packed with smiling fans from both schools. Isn't that what Toledo and Akron should be trying to accomplish with an annual game. What is in it for Toledo some ask?.?. Some snark there would be an easy win. Maybe, maybe not. The all time record between the schools is 12-9 in Toledo's favor. Two of the best games I have ever saw at the Rubber Bowl involved Akron kicking the longest FG in school history for a last second win and Toledo Tom's final season when the Zips won a well played game by both teams. Maybe the question isn't, what's in it for the Universities of Toledo and Akron, but what is in it for the taxpayers who support these programs? What is in it for the players, students, fans, alumni and general communities for these two schools? Are they not intertwined? I would bet there is a lot more in it for these two schools playing each other than a game against a school like Troy or UNCC or ECU or Purdue or some other school people in Ohio have almost zero interest.

I would love it also. However, it isn't how WF schedules OOC games. They know who they are and they compete at their level. Basically, they are an ACC school for brainy kids and try to compete against other brainy schools. G5 schools could learn a lot from this type of "know your identity" scheduling. Upcoming Wake OOC games include: 2021 - @Army, @UNC (Not an ACC game, but smartly contracted so fans can have some fun. I'll probably go. Can't beat a first weekend of November weather in Chapel Hill. Why don't we play Toledo every year regardless of the MAC schedule first or second week of the season?) 2022 - @Vandy, Army 2023 - Vandy, Air Force 2024 - @Army, Mississippi (low level SEC school with good academic standards) 2025 - Army, @Mississippi 2026 - @Purdue (excellent academic school), @Army, They also have NIU which is unusual...this game may never happen. 2027 - Tulane In recent years they have also played Rice, Baylor, Stanford, Tulane and Navy. I know they throw in some bottom feeders, but that is the nature of P5 schedules. Although, ODU is not a program to sneeze at next year. Lots of good talent in the Virginia Beach area. I don't think it is crazy for MAC schools to play 10 conference games, one cupcake and one G5 school. Maybe 9 conference games, two G5 schools and one cupcake. Either would be better than what is currently being shoveled out for fans to watch/endure. Early season college football is mildly interesting at best the way it is currently scheduled.

It's funny you bring this up. I'm going to assume you may be discussing things such as masks and social distancing. My wife and I discussed this last weekend and decided if Wake Forest or the State of North Carolina is going to require masks at games, we are not buying tickets. They still have some of our money from last year. We will get that refunded and do something else with it. Last year we went to two games and had to sit there for 3 hours with a mask on when there was not another person within 20 feet. We simply are not going to spend our money to participate this year given the high level of vaccinations and increased knowledge of the virus. Given their attendance, I am confident I will be able to repurchase my existing tickets on the 50 yard line relatively easily. Heck, maybe we will find something else to do with our recreational time in the fall. The beach is a fun place to go in the fall.

I wouldn't say that. “Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one.” - Charles Mackay

Yes, but that comes after they answer a simple question. What do they want their identity to be? To me, it is a very simple answer. G5 schools should strive to make their athletic departments benefit the athletes, students, alumni, fans and surrounding communities to the best of their abilities. For the next 15-20 years, G5 schools need to live in the moment and knock off the wanderlust they are endlessly engaged. Find a new direction with different kinds of leaders than the ones we find graduating from the Sports Management programs universities now offer. I believe that world exists somewhere between FCS and P5 schools. “A Jedi must have the deepest commitment, the most serious mind. This one a long time have I watched. All his life has he looked away…to the future, to the horizon. Never his mind on where he was. Hmm? What he was doing.” - Yoda, The Empire Strikes Back

Thanks for your response. In terms of the base product, G5 schools are more entertaining now than they have ever been so I wouldn't use the word decline. Except for at the very top where there are 3-5 teams that win every week in lopsided blowouts, college football is more entertaining than it has ever been. G5 schools just don't have the resources and are never going to have the resources to keep up with the P5 schools. I'm not concerned about the lack of commitment. I think they are doing all they can do with the available money. My problem is their chronic bad decision making. You can have all of the resources in the world and when your decision making is as bad as ours the results are plainly and painfully visible. Mix all of this in with endless negative publicity they seem to generate on their own, it is a bad look. Arth? He seems like a nice enough guy and I hope he does well. He will be fine regardless of what happens at Akron. I neither like nor dislike his coaching. I would rather hate a coach than be this indifferent. Heck, I don't even watch much of the games because I just can't stand to watch football that is as bad as it is. At least you can hate someone who is actually doing something. The problem Arth has now is his dance with the Chargers. His lack of commitment to UofA was plainly on display and was the beginning of the end of his time at Akron. Arth is what guys like Larry Williams and average participants on boards of corporations/universities believe a coach/manager should look like. There was nothing in his resume that would suggest he would be successful at UTC, let alone Akron, but the geniuses at the top thought differently. You could make a case for every coach from Faust through Bowden (except for Coach I) was a decent hire at the time. Faust came from ND. Owens had some time at OSU and was a known guy around Ohio who might be able to get recruits to rebuild a program nobody wanted. JD was a nationally known, hot name in the coaching ranks when he was at Pitt. Bowden was a Bowden. What was the case for Arth? Good looking?....So what? Played in the NFL?....So what? From NE Ohio?...So what? Coached at JC and UTC?....So what? Went to St. I?....So what? I could do this all day. His hollow resume was obvious.

This doesn't have to be the fate of Akron or G5 football. It can be better...much better. G5 schools can use football to have a positive impact on the athletes, students, alumni, fans and the greater communities where they exist. At some point they have to stop tilting at windmills and develop a reality based plan that allows the schools to be impactful in these areas. People will say that this line of thinking isn't "dreaming big". Really? What have G5 schools gotten for dreaming big over the past 25 years? Stadiums they can't afford? Salaries they can't afford? One incompetent AD after another delivering another broken "building process"? Weeknight games in front of empty stadiums? Dwindling community support? Apathetic alumni? Fans that can't even muster enough enthusiasm to at least show up at the stadium to tailgate, play some cornhole and get drunk with friends? When someone says, "Dream big", they normally mean they want what someone else has. It's called envy. Envy is one of the seven deadly sins and not something you want to base your decisions around. How is this envy working out for G5 schools? Are G5 closer or further away from the P5 schools in football right now? G5 schools need to go on the pursuit of what is best for them in lieu of what someone else has. When we do that, schools can be more impactful to the athletes, students, alumni, fans and greater communities.

I wouldn't say they have given up. Maybe they made a rational choice. I would say that with games at OSU and Auburn they probably met their budgetary "goals" for the upcoming 21-22 school year. Why blow money trying to convince people to come to Tuesday night games in November? Or, try to convince people to come to their only home ooc game against.... what's that teams name again? Or trying to sell another 1-3 start with two games being complete blow outs. There will be a cleaning of the house with a new AD. Is the fact that the MAC is Hell bent on destroying their football programs going to change? Probably not. I would say that what goes on in the MAC offices is sinister, but I don't think the leadership of the MAC is smart enough to be sinister. The ADs on the other hand.... they are just sinister enough in their resume development to destroy the schools they work for while blaming the MAC offices.

A school can come by a national ranking in a lot of different ways: easy schedule, name recognition (ie: Michigan), lazy journalists voting lazily, top team in a G5 conference, media darling, etc. It is true that Cincy is a good program (great G5 program...currently) with an excellent coach. Take that same program and drop them in a P5 conference and they are .500 at best. Let's take a TCU for example. They were a much better program when they jumped to the Big 12 than Cincy is right now. They are something like 58-44 since joining the Big 12. The luster is completely off of the program and their buffoonish coach. Some day Texas will get their act together and as Texas AM continues to expand their recruiting possibilities with their entrance into the SEC, TCU stands a better chance of becoming a cautionary tale rather than a beacon of hope. There are a handful of G5 schools like Cincy. The rest of the G5 schools need to decide if they want to remain on the current track to nowhere or go on another track and force the handful of really good G5 schools decide where they really want to be. The current direction of college football tells us G5 schools should really look at another track.

How come? Because we participate in a league that is not interested in competing at the highest level. BYU is a unique institution that has a history of competing at the highest levels. Boise State is a cute story, but put them in the PAC12 and they are .500 team. We are inferior to almost every P5 school. To pretend differently is delusional. It doesn't mean we can't be really good at our own level. Cincinnati is another good story. They are their coach leaving away from being very average again. If the P5 schools break away on their own, Cincinnati, Boise State and BYU will have tough decisions to make. I don't think anyone would want them. They bring no value to a P5 conference.

Burt Reynolds" performance as ex-jock who played football while in prison was enjoyable and fun to watch. Adam Sandler's performance as ex-jock who played football while in prison made you wish you were in prison to avoid having to watch it.

Will he be playing the part of Paul Crewe?.... I couldn't resist.....

You should never hate to say the truth. If we cannot admit the truth, we can never solve problems. You use the word "consistently". It's the correct word. I have grown to be much less interested in the odd win every few years against the likes of Northwestern, Syracuse or Pittsburgh than I am more interested in consistent winning, watching good football, going to bowl games, making the MAC Championship and winning the MAC. This thread is about our schedule. Our OOC schedule is not set up for us to develop a winning program. It is set up for us to hoard money and pad the athletic director's resume. Being competitive is not a consideration. It's as if they took the famous quote from Apollo 13, "Failure is not an option." and turned it into "Failure is our only option. Aim it straight towards the sun and go full thrusters.". If we have learned anything about college football, it is that the more you win, the more you win. It is no accident Clemson, OSU and Alabama are in the invitational tournament every year. Are the OOC schedules for these teams set up for them to compete or win? Have a look at them. There is little risk in their OOC scheduling. The only real threat to any of these teams is the first Clemson game against Georgia in Charlotte. Georgia is like Oregon...big name that never comes through in big games. I want the Zips to be consistently competitive against not only the MAC schools, but schools like UNCC, Utah State, North Texas State, Appalachian State, etc. Let's get good where we can get consistently competitive. Our current schedule is a distraction from that.

He should. He has to be 30 years old by now.

Name a MAC school that could consistently compete against the likes of Auburn and OSU in the same season. NC State was awesome. I was there. I also remember getting beaten badly by CMU the following week. G5 schools need to stop giving espn credit for being more important than it is. Recent years have produced cratering viewership and ratings for the network. The MAC has been getting a lot of espn exposure though....Tuesday and Wednesday night games starting at 8 PM in front of empty stadiums. That is the type of exposure we need to avoid like the plague. Why the Conference has prostituted itself like this is a complete mystery to me. The revenues shouldn't be that hard to make-up elsewhere. There is not a scenario in which even a Cincinnati playing the likes of Auburn and OSU in the same season is good exposure for their program. These two schools aren't like the terrible UCLA program they beat two years in a row recently. They are national championship contenders dripping with future NFL players. Our ooc schedule next year is a loser on multiple levels. First, we are going to get destroyed by OSU and Auburn unless these schools absolutely call off the dogs against an undertalented MAC school with a coach who would rather be somewhere else. Second, one of the opponents is so obscure I can't even think of their name as I didn't know they had a football team. Lastly, Temple...I'll leave it at that... Winning, and a lot of winning, brings exposure. If we can't at least win, the only exposure we are going to get is negative. We need to stop finding ways to lose in the name of exposure or money. It simply isn't working. Are there any adults in the room when these decisions are made?

You live and die with three point shooting. This was the story of the game. The Zips played well overall, but only shot 25% from 3 point range. If that was their yearly average, they would rank at the bottom of college basketball with Chicago State. Buffalo is a tough team. The Zips had their chances early in the game with a lot of relatively open 3 point looks and didn't convert. In fact, many missed badly to the point you have to wonder if tournament fatigue was taking over. To beat team like Buffalo you need a complete 40 minute game and the Zips fell short.

Kansas is a big job?

Yikes. One seven win season preceded by a two, two win seasons and a 3-1 record in a fluke of a season. Maybe they "seem" to be improving, but the jury isn't even in the deliberation room yet.

I understand it's the conference. The conference is wrong. It isn't easy money. It's destructive money that is destroying the league and the member schools. It's an extremely small amount of money compared to what the taxpayers could pay for. The espn deal amounts to approximately $833,000 per school. There are 8.4 mill people in ohio of taxpaying age. An extra $10 per person would be the cost to taxpayers to make up the difference. It's not like it would be impossible to watch a Zips game. Almost every college football game is on line. Espn viewership is actually in steep decline. This contract is not as valuable as it may appear. The value is actually in decline for the schools in many ways. Make the taxpayers pay for Mac athletics and give out free tickets to taxpayers for one Mac athletics event a year. The budget of Ohio is roughly $64 BILLION per year. The Mac athletics budgets are a drop in the bucket. The espn revenues are even less. It should be treated as a service provided by the state because that's what it actually is. Give the citizens what they are already paying for.

Agree. NE Ohioans love group behaviors more than other parts of the country. People are closely tied together. They love football. It's cultural. People are looking for things to do and things to do together. Put a decent product on the field and capitalize on this cultural behavior. Start with Summit Co. and work out from there. There are four groups of people UofA should be attracting to games: students, alumni, fans and the general community (people who are not one of the first 3). The football is never going to be perfect. It never is in the MAC. The experience is what people want and that is what will attract the lost fans and community. There is no reason for a fan to go to a poopy Tuesday night game and if that person isn't going to go, the person from the general community sure as poop isn't going to go. The MAC is committing suicide with these games and for the life of me I can't figure out why....OK, that's not true. It's because ADs are padding their resumes with this stupidity. IT NEEDS TO STOP!!!!!. The money simply isn't worth it and if that means G5 schools have to move to some other type of division, then so be it.

More of what is becoming obviously bad for college football, the annual invitational tournament (it isn't a playoff), is the last thing college football needs.

Or, with any luck, G5 schools will come to their senses and do something different. The times are right for big change. Will we continue down the same road?..... Probably.

I remember consistently bigger crowds and better football at the Rubber Bowl. It really isn't that hard.