Game #11 UMass

[GP1]

Only way that stupid play is halfway decent, is if you fake it, and get one on one coverage, or no coverage on the receiver next to the WR faking. This works because EVERY defense is aware of this dumb play.

You can't fake it if you don't set up the fake.

Here is a great primer on the bubble screen.

Good teams can run any play in their book. Average teams are good at running some plays. Bad teams aren't good at running any plays. We are a bad team right now. Struggling with the basics of football. Run, catch, throw, tackle, block, get off of blocks, cover, etc. We can change formations and try to trick our way to victory all day long. If we can't do those basic things, we can't win.

[Dave in Green]

Thanks for sharing that primer, GP1. Assuming you have all the right players with the physical skills who are properly coached to do it right, it all comes down to the QB making the proper bubble zone read and then everyone properly executing. The Zips are lacking in one or more elements of the required chain -- player abilities, coaching, QB able to consistently make the proper read and execution. I suspect it's probably at least some of each.

[GP1]

The Zips are lacking in one or more elements of the required chain

I would say they are lacking in 11 elements to run anything successfully right now.

[Dr Z]

Assuming you have all the right players with the physical skills who are properly coached to do it right, it all comes down to the QB making the proper bubble zone read and then everyone properly executing

For the love of gawd, the Steelers have the best WR in the league and a top QB, and the stupid play resulted in a turnover against the lowly Jets. It's a stupid play that I can't wait until the NFL adapts out. T minus whenever and counting...

[Dr Z]

You can't fake it if you don't set up the fake.

Is two years running it enough of a setup? If not, how many years do we have to unsuccessfully run it before we can fake it?

[GP1]

Is two years running it enough of a setup? If not, how many years do we have to unsuccessfully run it before we can fake it?

OK then, what is our base play?

[Dr Z]

OK then, what is our base play?

One back spread. Lock on incomplete pass behind the receiver.

[GP1]

One back spread. Lock on incomplete pass behind the receiver.

Agreed it is usually our first play, but that is not the base play of the modern offense. The base play is the first play in the playbook. It's the play that all other plays revolve around.

I'm going to the VA Tech vs. Duke game today....not sure why, but I am. Tomorrow I'll be back with a full explanation as to why our offense is so offensive. Hint: It has to do with our inability to do the most basic of tasks that make up Bowden Ball and might even give some insight as to why Bowden Ball has lost its identity.

[zippy5]

I'll be at Pitt @ UNC. Excited to see some offense today.

[Dr Z]

Agreed it is usually our first play, but that is not the base play of the modern offense. The base play is the first play in the playbook. It's the play that all other plays revolve around.

We run 10, and 11 as our base. we run some 12, but not enough. Once in a while we line up with 01 personnel, but not often enough to even mention. I've covered this multiple times over the course of the season. We need a talent upgrade at the offensive skill positions in the worst way if we are going to continue on this personnel path.

[skip-zip]

The only decent half of offensive football I've seen in a month was from Woodson at Ball State.

It's probably the best first half of offense that we played all year.

[Balsy]

The only decent half of offensive football I've seen in a month was from Woodson at Ball State. When he came in at game's end @ Buffalo, he played with a purpose and a tempo that at least made the Buffalo defense think (instead of easily reading everything and teeing-off).

Play Woodson against UMass. Post-concussion Pohl is like the old gray mare...he ain't what he yousta' be.

I agree with this, however with one slight modification: I don't think Pohl usta be anything special to begin with. Pohl was never the game manager, field general that some on this forum have touted him to be (throwing around the 9-3 in the last 11 stat). We're not seeing a Pohl that was radically changed by a concussion, we're seeing the same Pohl as before, there's really no difference. Forcing the ball to a receiver who isn't open, not going through all the reads, not taking command of the offense. He's never been the fearless leader the Zips need on the QB.

It's probably the best first half of offense that we played all year.

Coming from a red-shirt freshman no less.

[Blue & Gold]

Then what happened in the 2nd half of the Ball State game? I believe I remember someone mentioning BSU switched into a zone defense in the 2nd half & Tommy just couldn't adjust. Was it really that simple?

[Dave in Green]

For the love of gawd, the Steelers have the best WR in the league and a top QB, and the stupid play resulted in a turnover against the lowly Jets. It's a stupid play that I can't wait until the NFL adapts out. T minus whenever and counting...

I hate to further burst your bubble after the Steelers have already done so by falling behind the Browns. But the NFL is not always relevant to what works in college football. That stupid play works pretty well for Oregon and other college teams that have the personnel and coaching expertise to properly execute it. We'd all be ecstatic if the Zips ran the Ducks' plays and got similar results.

[Dr Z]

We'd all be ecstatic if the Zips ran the Ducks' plays and got similar results.

If we had half of the talent they have on that side of the ball we could run it all they want. Play is made for when the talent level is so much more skilled on the outside than the opponent. That is pretty far from the case right now. My bubble would have to have air to be "burst."

[Dr Z]

I believe I remember someone mentioning BSU switched into a zone defense in the 2nd half & Tommy just couldn't adjust. Was it really that simple?

Yes, the play calling should have adjusted too. It did not. Hard to fly like an eagle...

[Balsy]

Then what happened in the 2nd half of the Ball State game? I believe I remember someone mentioning BSU switched into a zone defense in the 2nd half & Tommy just couldn't adjust. Was it really that simple?

Yes. And I'd say that Woodson doesn't have the experience to orchestrate the offense with a lead: the experience to throw the ball out of bounds when the play clearly isn't there...to live another day...something Pohl does some of the time.

[lance99]

OK then, what is our base play?

Pick your playbook:http://www.footballxos.com/free-football-playbooks/offense-playbooks/nfl-playbooks/

[johnnyzip84]

Frohnapfel not ruled out for the game on Tuesday.

"He's gotten better every day. So we'll just see," he (Coach Whipple) said, describing the right leg injury Frohnapfel suffered in Wednesday's win over Ball State as a "bone bruise."

"We're holding out hope, but we're not going to risk it if anything worse can happen. We'd never do anything to put him in harm's way. It'll be a doctor and the trainer (making the call)."

[K92]

Wha????? Information about a quarterback's health?????

[Zipgrad01]

Wha????? Information about a quarterback's health?????

For shame!!!!!

[zippy5]

Doesn't that violate HIPPA?

[Lee Adams]

He was the one guy that looked like he wanted to win the game. I wish Capi or Brown had his heart, instead of quitting in the second half (when the game was still well in reach).

It reminded me of a quote from Lee Owens years ago regarding his lethargic defense - "I might put Charlie Frye out there (on D)...at least he'd try to make a play!"

I am tired of Pohl's touch-passes too. Everything out of his hand is a floater. Even his short passes look like someone trying to throw a dart at a dart board rocking back and forth trying to float one into the bulls-eye.

The only decent half of offensive football I've seen in a month was from Woodson at Ball State. When he came in at game's end @ Buffalo, he played with a purpose and a tempo that at least made the Buffalo defense think (instead of easily reading everything and teeing-off).

Play Woodson against UMass. Post-concussion Pohl is like the old gray mare...he ain't what he yousta' be.

Good observation about Pohl's passes. I was a Pohl fan couple of years ago. But it has become obvious he,like many others can not throw the short/intermediate passes with any authority or accuracy. And,when he presents no credible running threat and the

offense revolves around rhythm passing, AND, the coaches do not seem willing to adjust to personnel available on a consistent basis it becomes apparent why the offense has struggled. Whether Woodson is the 'answer' or it is going to take 'breaking in' another new QB next season remains to be seen. Gonna be tough if Bowden has to play an inexperienced QB next season.

[GP1]

We run 10, and 11 as our base. we run some 12, but not enough. Once in a while we line up with 01 personnel, but not often enough to even mention. I've covered this multiple times over the course of the season. We need a talent upgrade at the offensive skill positions in the worst way if we are going to continue on this personnel path.

I know that, but what is the base play, not formation? The base play is the first in the playbook and must be executed out of different formations. It is the identity of the offense. We can't run simple plays because of talent. Until that is resolved, we will continue to not be able to execute the playbook.

The base play of the triple option is the triple option. The base play of pro style is power running off tackle. The base play of the spread is the bubble screen/zone read which is a running play where the stats show up as pass yards. What is the base play of Bowden Ball? Not sure any of us can answer. I hope Milwee and Bowden go back and look at the first play they teach and start there when game planning and forming identity.

[GP1]

But the NFL is not always relevant to what works in college football. That stupid play works pretty well for Oregon and other college teams that have the personnel and coaching expertise to properly execute it. We'd all be ecstatic if the Zips ran the Ducks' plays and got similar results.

Good point Dave. What goes on in college has nothing to do with what goes on in the NFL. Most NFL teams have 11 really good guys starting. College teams have 2-3 really good guys starting and you have to get the rest to execute and believe in what they are doing. If a kid between the ages of 18 and 22 doesn't believe in what he is doing, he can't execute.

The reason the bubble screen works for Oregon is that they commit to making it work. They run it 8 times a game. I mentioned earlier that all the bubble screen is actually a running play where the statistics end up on the passing categories. It is blocked like a run from sideline to sideline and the ball is received by the receiver behind the line just like a running back does. Oregon doesn't have 11 NFL guys on the field. They have one great one and 10 good ones. They have a coaching staff committed to that play and they use it as the base of all other plays. They have a QB who can throw a simple pass to a guy wide open and they have a guy wide open who can magically catch a pass thrown directly to him. It really isn't a hard play, but somehow we can't seem to do the simplest things like throwing a catching. George Thomas wrote this a couple of years ago now. In it, he references Bowden wanted to do the basics of football...throw, catch, run, etc. We have been getting worse at doing those things as this season has progressed. My aggravation with this season has nothing to do with play calling or formation or whatever people want to dig into. My aggravation has to do with us after mid season not being able to do the basics like running, catching, throwing, tackling, etc.

Back to identity and fans not understanding the progression of play calling..... Years ago now, people would go to college games when they were running pro style offenses and people called the off tackle play "stupid" when it didn't work. If you couldn't run it successfully, you didn't have play action so your big plays were limited so your opportunities for scoring were limited. If you couldn't run it, then you didn't have a counter run when the defense adjusted. If you couldn't run it, you couldn't milk a lead against a team you have beaten up all day. They probably said the same thing at Oklahoma games when they lost a couple of yards on a triple option play. I say the same thing when I see a failed bubble screen play even though I know it is necessary.

I would love to know what the first play in our playbook is, how often they have run it in the first five plays of the game this and how well that play has performed. If that play has not done well, it explains the condition of our offense because if you can't run your base play, you can't set up other plays. My concern about Bowden Ball is it is one of those new offense we see now where they are just trying to play the match-up game. Some call the "match-up game" throwing poop at the wall and hoping something sticks. I prefer an identity and a base play that all other plays flow from. I'd like to get away from throwing poop at the wall, which is what I think we are doing. In order to do that, we need to run better, catch better, throw better, block better, etc. It really isn't a difficult game. Unfortunately, we are two weeks away from the end of the season and those problems are hard to correct mid season.