Around the MAC

[exit322]

26 minutes ago, Zippy87 said:

 

This is odd to me after Steinbrecher basically stated Saturday night that what the Big Ten told them added up. I'm guessing they received some pushback from WMU and/or other member schools and wanted to at least look like they are fighting this. 

 

Steinbrecher can't possibly be happy that the MAC schools are finally starting to make him try to be useful.  Between BG and Toledo getting their nonsense midweek game moved to a much-more-palatable Friday, and now (who knows how many schools) making him say "well actually, now I have to stand up and say something that might make the Big Ten give me a poo poo face."

[UAZipster0305]

1 hour ago, Hilltopper said:

It looks like the MAC has finally grown a set.

 

It would have been nice to have this level of advocacy from the conference with MSOC vs. NW'ern in the NCAAT ~20 years ago, MBBALL vs. UCLA in the NCAAT, and FOOTBALL at Michigan in 2014.

 

I think what the MAC member schools see is that WMU has a strong potential to otherwise go 13-0 and be the playoff seed for the lower level schools. If this loss stands, the MAC's best opportunity for that slot diminishes greatly, and each member school potentially loses out on hundreds of thousands of dollars of additional revenue.

Edited Tuesday at 08:03 PM by UAZipster0305

[Zippy87]

14 minutes ago, UAZipster0305 said:

It would have been nice to have this level of advocacy from the conference with MSOC vs. NW'ern in the NCAAT ~20 years ago, MBBALL vs. UCLA in the NCAAT, and FOOTBALL at Michigan in 2014.

 

I think what the MAC member schools see is that WMU has a strong potential to otherwise go 13-0 and be the playoff seed for the lower level schools. If this loss stands, the MAC's best opportunity for that slot diminishes greatly, and each member school potentially loses out on hundreds of thousands of dollars of additional revenue.

 

I actually think there's a world where Western Michigan losing that game helps them in the long run. Say they go 12-1, with their only loss being Michigan. The committee is going to put them in, even if another team has an arguably better resume, as a way to try to right a "wrong". The human element and subjectivity of how they rank teams could actually help a smaller school for once. 

 

[kreed5120]

4 minutes ago, Zippy87 said:

 

I actually think there's a world where Western Michigan losing that game helps them in the long run. Say they go 12-1, with their only loss being Michigan. The committee is going to put them in, even if another team has an arguably better resume, as a way to try to right a "wrong". The human element and subjectivity of how they rank teams could actually help a smaller school for once. 

In your hypothetical they would otherwise be 13-0 and in irregardless. That doesn't help them.

[exit322]

21 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

In your hypothetical they would otherwise be 13-0 and in irregardless. That doesn't help them.

 

In the real world they'd be 13-0 and hoping the AAC/P12/SBC/MWC champs all have 3+ losses to give them a shot.

[Zippy87]

28 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

In your hypothetical they would otherwise be 13-0 and in irregardless. That doesn't help them.

 

I don't know if I agree, especially if Michigan ends up not being a Top 25 team. The committee would discount that as a signature win and they wouldn't have one otherwise. Now, even if Michigan ends up not being a Top 25 team, they'll have the sentimental backing of a lot of voters. Look no further than the AP vs Coaches polls today. 

[Let'sGoZips94]

2 hours ago, Hilltopper said:

It looks like the MAC has finally grown a set.

 

 

Pathetic.

[UAZipster0305]

5 minutes ago, Let'sGoZips94 said:

 

Pathetic.

I think it is a reasonable response. What did you expect?

[kreed5120]

6 minutes ago, Zippy87 said:

 

I don't know if I agree, especially if Michigan ends up not being a Top 25 team. The committee would discount that as a signature win and they wouldn't have one otherwise. Now, even if Michigan ends up not being a Top 25 team, they'll have the sentimental backing of a lot of voters. Look no further than the AP vs Coaches polls today. 

 

If JMU could make it at 12-1 with their best win against a 9-4 Louisville in a very weak ACC, WMU would surely make it at 13-0 with a wins over both Michigan and Boise State. Boise State just lost by 1 TD to a top 10 Oregon team and is likely one of the best G6 programs.

 

A 13-0 WMU would have had an incredible resume.

[kreed5120]

23 minutes ago, exit322 said:

 

In the real world they'd be 13-0 and hoping the AAC/P12/SBC/MWC champs all have 3+ losses to give them a shot.

 

Good chance Boise State wins the P12 and 13-0 would imply WMU would have the H2H win.

[exit322]

22 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

 

Good chance Boise State wins the P12 and 13-0 would imply WMU would have the H2H win.

Fair.  Still doesn't help against a 11-2 James Madison or 11-2 Memphis, unfortunately 

[Let'sGoZips94]

32 minutes ago, UAZipster0305 said:

I think it is a reasonable response. What did you expect?

 

That's the statement - or at least tone - that should've been set Saturday night/Sunday morning. Steinbrecher pretty much agreeing with the Big Ten out of the gate was weak & pathetic, but changing tune now that the court of public opinion is against their initial statement makes them look wishy washy at best without getting into any of the probable smokey back room deals that Steinbrecher has made with the Big Ten. If you're going to be a corrupt suit, at least have the cajones to own said corruption. He is by far the WORST commissioner in college athletics and nobody should let him evade that title just because he's "fighting" this now. 

Edited Tuesday at 09:35 PM by Let'sGoZips94

[kreed5120]

9 minutes ago, exit322 said:

Fair.  Still doesn't help against a 11-2 James Madison or 11-2 Memphis, unfortunately 

 

WMU in this hypothetical would have 2 wins better than James Madison best win. I think the best team JMU has on their schedule is Liberty.

 

An argument could be made that a 1 loss Memphis would get in over WMU, but at 2 losses that would probably mean they lost to Boise St. who WMU would have beat.

 

WMU actually went out and scheduled a tough OOC to be in a position to have a chance to secure a G6 bid. This isn't a Miami Ohio basketball situation where they went undefeated largely by scheduling programs like Saint Mary's School for the Blind.

Edited Tuesday at 09:38 PM by kreed5120

[Let'sGoZips94]

1 minute ago, kreed5120 said:

This isn't a Miami Ohio basketball situation where they went undefeated largely by playing Saint Mary's School for the Blind.

 

Great shout. NEVER let people forget that Miami OH's fluke season was as fraudulent as they come. 

[Zippy87]

1 hour ago, kreed5120 said:

 

If JMU could make it at 12-1 with their best win against a 9-4 Louisville in a very weak ACC, WMU would surely make it at 13-0 with a wins over both Michigan and Boise State. Boise State just lost by 1 TD to a top 10 Oregon team and is likely one of the best G6 programs.

 

A 13-0 WMU would have had an incredible resume.

 

So would a 12-1 WMU team with just one controversial loss that built a ton of favor toward them in terms of public opinion/support. I won't compare to JMU last year because each year is so unique. 

[kreed5120]

1 minute ago, Zippy87 said:

 

So would a 12-1 WMU team with just one controversial loss that built a ton of favor toward them in terms of public opinion/support. I won't compare to JMU last year because each year is so unique. 

 

The premise of your argument was the loss helps their chances. A 13-0 WMU has immensely better odds of making the playoffs than a 12-1 version with a controversial loss. Not saying the 12-1 team couldn't make it, but it would need more help than a 13-0.

[Zippy87]

16 minutes ago, kreed5120 said:

 

The premise of your argument was the loss helps their chances. A 13-0 WMU has immensely better odds of making the playoffs than a 12-1 version with a controversial loss. Not saying the 12-1 team couldn't make it, but it would need more help than a 13-0.

 

I think you're underrating how much the media is riding against Michigan and for Western Michigan here. Michigan won the game and dropped completely from the AP Poll. This has turned WMU into a darling underdog and that will follow them the rest of the season, including when they're considered for the Playoff. Hell, I think they could make it at 11-2. 

[kreed5120]

23 minutes ago, Zippy87 said:

 

I think you're underrating how much the media is riding against Michigan and for Western Michigan here. Michigan won the game and dropped completely from the AP Poll. This has turned WMU into a darling underdog and that will follow them the rest of the season, including when they're considered for the Playoff. Hell, I think they could make it at 11-2. 

 

UM should drop from the poll. Even clock controversy aside the QB play was terrible and many other teams had more impressive week 1 results. They aren't the first team to fall in the rankings despite winning. They won't be the last either.

 

You can maybe make the argument that some won't penalize WMU for the loss, but they're certainly not getting the same treatment as if they won. This is evident by the fact voters still have them behind UM in the AP poll. UM is currently 28th while WMU is 32nd. Without that clock mishap and WMU winning WMU would surely be ahead of UM in today's AP poll (probably #20-#25 since it would be one of the most impressive wins of the young season) and UM would have few to no AP votes.

 

 

Edited Tuesday at 11:01 PM by kreed5120

[Zippy87]

1 hour ago, kreed5120 said:

 

UM should drop from the poll. Even clock controversy aside the QB play was terrible and many other teams had more impressive week 1 results. They aren't the first team to fall in the rankings despite winning. They won't be the last either.

 

You can maybe make the argument that some won't penalize WMU for the loss, but they're certainly not getting the same treatment as if they won. This is evident by the fact voters still have them behind UM in the AP poll. UM is currently 28th while WMU is 32nd. Without that clock mishap and WMU winning WMU would surely be ahead of UM in today's AP poll (probably #20-#25 since it would be one of the most impressive wins of the young season) and UM would have few to no AP votes.

 

 

 

Didn't say they shouldn't fall, but falling from 16 to unranked after a win is pretty unprecedented.  

[GP1]

The assumption here that WMU is just going to waltz through their MAC schedule is interesting. They have a trip to the Glass Bowl to play Toledo. Toledo is almost always at the top of the MAC and is the best program in the conference. It isn't an easy place to win for anyone. In fact, it's a difficult place to win. They have fans that actually turn out and make some noise. 

 

I predict that at the end of the season, WMU will have three losses. 

[LZIp]

UMASS might have a better chance of going undefeated than Western.

[kreed5120]

18 minutes ago, GP1 said:

The assumption here that WMU is just going to waltz through their MAC schedule is interesting. They have a trip to the Glass Bowl to play Toledo. Toledo is almost always at the top of the MAC and is the best program in the conference. It isn't an easy place to win for anyone. In fact, it's a difficult place to win. They have fans that actually turn out and make some noise. 

 

I predict that at the end of the season, WMU will have three losses. 

 

For what it's worth I don't think they're going to run the table moving forward. In fact, I think they will lose to Boise State who they play before MAC play even begins. I was just speaking to the hypothetical that someone else proposed.

[GP1]

1 hour ago, LZIp said:

UMASS might have a better chance of going undefeated than Western.

Watching UMass struggle to get four more wins is going to be funny in the way we like to make fun of the Big Ten. I can't remember a more humiliating loss for a B10 team. They didn't lose a close game against a lesser conference, they were easily beaten at home letting UMass score more than 35 points. In an act of athletic director desperation, they fired Schiano the next day. 

[exit322]

20 minutes ago, GP1 said:

In an act of athletic director desperation, they fired Schiano the next day. 

 

Well sure, if Rutgers had money they would have...

[kreed5120]

If we look back at the last ~15 years the B1G really screwed up with realignment. At least from a competitive stand point. The SEC completely out gained them with the programs they plucked.

 

The only program added that consistently competes at a top level is Oregon. I will say at some point it's likely USC gets their crap together. As for Nebraska, Washington, UCLA, Maryland, and Rutgers they don't make the B1G better. In fact, UCLA, Rutgers, and Maryland have all made the B1G weaker competitively. Nebraska an Washington are probably middle B1G quality programs.

 

Save me the talk about how great Nebraska was in the 90s. Unless we get a time machine to wind the clocks back 30 years we won't see Nebraska have that level of success again in our life times.