Zip_ME87

Mistakes happen sometimes. Awesome when you can and care enough to make up for them almost immediately!

This should be fun. I'm looking forward to an afternoon and evening of Football (American and Association). GO ZIPS!

Soccer fans, wherever they are, don't even come close to the conceit of American football, basketball and baseball fans in this country. MLB Baseball: "World" Series...potentially Canada and the United States ; small World; League and fans full of themselves. At least Little League knows what a "World" series is. NBA Basketball: "World" Champions on their rings...again, potentially Canada and the United States ; small World; League and fans full of themselves NFL Football: "World" Champions on their rings...solely teams in the United States; League and fans FULL of themselves Soccer/Football World Cup: countries from North America, South America, Europe, Asia, Africa, and Australia. WORLD championship If I follow your logic, the Zips Football team should still be playing in the Rubber Bowl with no problem. What's a little adversity? I seem to recall TB and assistants saying they visited Akron before agreeing to sign contacts here. Once they saw the facilities, they felt UA was serious about football and wanting a winner. UA's football facilities are a great recruiting tool, if properly used by a competent coach like we now have and he has been doing. Why does the same not apply to our soccer team in some of your minds? Yeah, Louisville has better facilities just like Ohio State has better football facilities. But, our current soccer stadium is better than a significant number of others in Division 1 and is a recruiting tool for soccer. UA Mens Soccer shouldn't have to suffer because someone thinks that Browns Training Camp is good for UA. Does anyone have some evidence of the great things that Browns Training Camp did for Can't State when it was there in 1975-81, I believe? Can't State sucked in the 70's and it still sucks today. Please dispute that, with evidence.

I guess that depends on whose dorms they're using. A little worn carpet might be a good trade for a cheesy pick up line, "Come back to my place baby. Johnny Manziel slept naked in my bed and washed his most private parts in my shower."

Hmmmm, GP1 interested in soccer, at least enough to find these articles. Another example of how totally unexpected results can so easily occur.

Bear in mind also that since this map is based on Facebook likes, it's demographics lean toward younger generations. There are a significant number of Browns fans who are older, and although they may have a Facebook account, they're not as likely to hit the "like" button as often. There are significant Browns Backers organizations thoughout Ohio and the world. Many of their members likely aren't counting for much on this map.

+614, I'm a conspiracy theorist. in addition to being a ranter; actually, probably more obsessive (but not compulsive) than ranting.

The Horseshoe has turf. Infocision has turf. I never said anything against the Browns or any other football team, concert, .... using Infocision Stadium-Summa Field. I live in Brunswick. Brunswick High School graduates at the JAR. I've been to the JAR for Zips Basketball EOY Celebration on the covered floor. LeBron James accepted an MVP award at the JAR. The 2010 National Champion Zips Mens Soccer Team held their celebration at the JAR. I had PE golf in the JAR when I attended UA. The floor was protected. The Akron Summit Assault used FES-CCF in 2011. The Columbus Crew played a USOC2014 match there, too. Soccer should be played on a grass pitch, especially one that rivals an MLS-recognized, well-kept pitch like that at Columbus Crew Stadium. I didn't argue against any of this, and I doubt that UA lost any donors over any of the above. Take the risk of damaging CCF without a plan in place to repair it and an actual plan in place to accommodate the Browns elsewhere in Years 2 and beyond without bleeding funds from UA's budget...yes I will fight that. And, yes Can't or Columbus can have the Browns based upon their hand waving of how they will accommodate them and profit. BTW...Ohio State has an actual arena. Akron has a glorified high-school gymnasium thanks to poor planning. Let's concentrate on building an actual arena and market it as an entertainment venue for Akron, Summit County, Stark County, Portage County, Medina County, Tuscarawas County.

I didn't have RI's resume. I never interviewed him. But, when I first met him in the JAR in Spring 2010, he did not come across as a leader nor was he interested in talking with me about Zips Football. Tom was unknown at the time to me. He hadn't done anything positive or negative or made a major decision. I was worried about the Notre Dame connections, their lack of success with Charlie Weiss and the same assistants RI brought to Akron. I was skeptical. but hopeful. There's that word hope. I convinced a friend/UA Alumnus to buy season tickets. He did so for 2010 and 2011, the 2 worst years for Zips Football. My friend continues to be one of those Ohio State fans that never went there. Now his kid goes there. He hasn't returned to Zips Football. Thanks Tom. Give me another.

The high school playoffs should be done regionally, then rotated among areas of Ohio from year to year so that everyone gets an opportunity to attend. I always thought the move to C-bus was more about making them more readily accessible from any area of the state by "centrally" locating them. As far as the Browns, if I followed the logic that some on this board do, I'd say Columbus is perfect for them. It gives them yearly exposure in Ohio's largest city for 20 days and the rest of the year they're at home in Ohio's second larget city. No-brainer. yeah, right. I'm sure Jimmy has his people running the numbers before he makes any decisions and will likely put together a contract with an out clause in his favor if things aren't working out. The NFL and Browns are all about money. They're going to do whatever is best for them, and they're not going to do it blindly.

Yeah, I imagine Bowden called him up and Tom said something like 'I need to save my butt. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You're a God send. How soon can you get here.' Hope and luck aren't good strategies, but it's awesome when they work out.

The equivalent of Los Angeles' Stub Hub Center in Columbus, Ohio. @Crew8 @fknbuflobo ... can you imagine having youth soccer development so close to Akron? Yeah, Ohio State might be right next door, but UA has better soccer facilities, connections, and history than tOSU. Could be a recruiters dream. We could have more US Soccer activity in Columbus, too if a facility like that existed there. I like it.

Notice "Ohio Dominican University is one place under consideration. Another possibility is eventually building a facility, which also could be used by the Columbus Crew, the city's MLS entry, and area youth soccer organizations." Ohio Dominican, not Ohio State, hmmm. Thanks. I'd love to have an equivalent of Los Angeles' Stub Hub Center in Columbus, Ohio. That would be AWESOME! Go Columbus!!! Better deal for the Browns, too. Gets them far enough away from Cleveland to have little to no distractions from the normal routine.

DiG, I totally agree with you about people making mistakes, learning, and getting better. Also, I really don't like bringing up the Rob Ianello hire over and over, but I've also read in numerous studies that often people have to hear something 6 times before they really get it. I don't know whether that exact number holds true, but I do know that because people often don't really listen, that repitition does help make a point. The other thing that I would say is that yes, I'm sure you've made mistakes as have I, but I'll bet you've done a lot of great things, too. People probably overlook your mistakes because you've also had numerous successes that show you know what you're doing. I think we have yet to see that from our AD. Some might point to the hiring of Terry Bowden as evidence of Tom's success. I don't know if Tom made the decision to actually ink him to a contract, but I do know from what I have read that "According to a source with knowledge of contract talks, Bowden reached out to Akron." Really, Tom didn't know Terry Bowden was a possibility even though numerous ZN.o members raised his name during the search that yielded RI? ZN.o members have better connections than our AD. Maybe, or maybe ZN.o members care more than Tom because UA is theirs forever, not temporarily. Apparently, TB fell into Tom's lap, and we now have a great coach from a great coaching family, and the Athletic Department still can't market Zips FB well. They have to grasp for help from the Cleveland Browns and at the same time possibly ruin something else that they've already built based apparently on little but gut feel? That's too much of a stretch for me without some real, hard evidence of proper forethought and openness on this proposal. Please provide me an example of what Tom has done to start me down the road of trusting and/or respecting him. EDIT: This ZN.o member, UA alumnus, and fan cares enough about his alma mater that I have reserved a seat at this Friday's Investiture of President Scarborough. I can't think of anything that I'd rather do less than sit through such a boring event on a Friday afternoon. But, I'm willing to do it just for the chance to ask our new President and any other of the powers that be about this proposal and other "great" plans they have for UA. The likelihood of my actually getting to talk with any of them is probably quite low, but UA matters enough to me to take the chance.

This alumnus has football season tickets as well as soccer season tickets. Both carry significant donations to the Z fund in addition to the cost of the seats. I also donate to the educational side of the university. I turned away from pro sports a number of years ago and to college sports because of how f'd up pro sports are, but our society accepts it and continues to pay for ever increasing prices with no logic to it whatsoever. College sports are f'd up, now, too as GP1 loves to tell us and they are well on their way to being just as f'd up as the pro's. Ohio State and the B1G are great examples of big time college sports run amok. How many UA donors are there like me whom you will turn away if the deal with the Browns turns out badly for the things we love about UA? How does that figure into the bottom line? Your "make money" assumption is not as simple as you think it is. There is no burden of proof on you because you don't care enough to find out what's really in play with this proposal. If it were so easy to "make money", UA's endowment would be a lot larger than it currently is, and UA wouldn't have the debt that it does. Go on, live your life on hope. I've always found that a thoughtful plan works out better than hope most of the time. My argument has never been that the Browns won't bring people to UA's campus. My problem with this idea continues to be that there was little thought put into the total equation and the risks involved.

Again, if your sources are reliable, it's not hearsay. Why are Tom's quotes in the ABJ about this only affecting the soccer pitch for 1 year if at all not hearsay? Ok, so you know who the source is. The same source who told us all the great things that Rob Ianello would do and the outstanding community member he would be. Ask Terry Bowden about the relations he had to build and damage he had to mend to be able to recruit locally thanks to Rob Ianello's good relationship/standing in the community. I don't recall saying that people coming to campus wouldn't convince some of them to come to UA. I'm sure it will. But, the thing that would really bring increased enrollment would be lower tuition than competitors while still providing a quality education that rivals your higher priced competitors. You don't lower tuition if you put yourself in a bad position. "(and makes money is the process)" & "a BIG NAME tenant is willing to pay to use them" are assumptions and are only no brainers if you're guaranteed to not lose money. There will never be any evidence to change your logic. If A & B & C happen, then D. IF A. we make money and B. bring people to campus and C. in the process some of them choose to enroll at UA then D. it's good. No way would I argue that IF your A, B, and C occur, that it's not D. good for UA. The problem with your logic is that A is unknown, even if the proposal includes payments from the Browns. You don't know the effect on the soccer field and costs of proper repairs, the effect on mens soccer attendance, or the effect on donations from the soccer alumni and donors. The mens soccer program has some significant donors who were there even before the Mens Soccer National Championship. Pissing off a known source of funding isn't very logical.

Not sure to what you're referring. Who's skating around what?

DeAndre Yedlin and the Seattle Sounders take on the Philadelphia Union tonight at 7:30 pm ET/4:30 pm PT for the US Open Cup. Broadcast on Soundersfc.com http://www.soundersfc.com//content/2014-us-open-cup-final-vs-philadelphia-union

Thanks. That's what I thought you were saying. Good to have a tangible piece of evidence, whichever way it leans. I wonder if UA officials ever bothered to poll the current student population about this among other demographics. It would be interesting to have some sense of the impact of the look/feel of the campus on student selection of UA. It's interesting that when I attended UA, it was an "urban" campus with Buchtel and Carroll Streets open, yet enrollment was 26k - 28k. Spring 2014 shows 23,342 at Akron main campus. I'm trying to verify my figure for 1987, but the page won't load from UA's website. EDIT: Of course, when I started at Akron in 1982, the cost was ~$37/credit hour with open enrollment. I think the tuition cost was the lowest in the state. That would trump a lot of factors especially with local commuting students who didn't have to add room and board. Gasoline was also in the $1/gallon range. Can't compare enrollment then vs now. Data is skewed.

Reading Marla's article, track, yes...indoor & outdoor. Baseball & Softball aren't mentioned unless I somehow overlooked them. The Browns used to play in Municipal Stadium where they shared the field with the Indians for several weeks a year. I don't see why they couldn't do that for practice for Year 1. If you're going to wreck one field, wreck them all. Since all those local politicians signed on, the Browns should use Canal Park, too. Spread those Browns fans out all over the city. They'll see so much more it will add to our profits!

We don't have to wait on GT. The University of Akron is a public institution and as such, they have to make public records available to the residents of the State of Ohio. Ask for the data yourself. Because the people in that room are not only donors, but taxpayers and residents of the State of Ohio. The University of Akron is a public institution. They have to make public records viewable by the public. The Administration is supposed to be "transparent". Why does everyone seems to be so timid about asking for public records? Oh, I have to have the ABJ do it for me. I got my degree at The University of Akron. I don't have to have a PhD to know who to trust and who to question and when 1+1 isn't adding to 2 as in this case. Yours is a fallacy of believing that because the new president and Tom Wistrcill say it's good and you love the Browns and want it to be good, then it must be good. The UA President and AD are public employees who have to answer to us. Ask them. I certainly was prepared to ask Tom at the Soccer match Sunday afternoon, but he chose not to show up. Do you bother to read all of the posts here? I gave of the soccer pitch thing up a number of posts back. Bad me in the way I started this debate. It still bothers me about the soccer pitch, and I still don't want them to use it, but that's not the REAL issue. The REAL issue is what are the potential outcomes and pitfalls of this deal and what is the likelihood UA will realize a benefit or bleed more red ink. Follow the advice implied by Spin's signature. It applies to written as well as verbal communication.

A 2nd reliable source tells me there are no "rent' (payments) from the Browns in the proposal. Will funding from parking and concessions be enough to make this a worthwhile venture? Crickets chirping from the records officer thus far. Not even a response stating he received my e-mail and will get back with me. Plenty of logical reasons why hasn't responded for me not to question his motives, and I do mean that. He could be on vacation or swamped with other things and my request is waiting in his queue for him to get to it. I will give him more time, and then call tomorrow to ensure he received it and find out if he needs clarficiation as to what I want. As far as the AD, President, and others, even the best people can make mistakes when they don't give due diligence to what they're doing. Sometimes, they make mistakes even if they do, but at least they went into it with eyes wide open. The purpose of my quotes from the AD was to point out that he is often wrong and has been BIG TIME wrong in the past. The things he stated about Rob Ianello were so far off the mark, I can't believe Tom still has his job. It also points out that it is completely possible to have a resume that may paint of picture of a person in one light, yet their actions prove otherwise. Trust and respect are earned. The new UA president may have an outstanding resume, but he has to earn my trust through his actions. I'm not giving it away so easily as some would just from reading a piece of paper. This president has already earned a demerit by saying one thing "We told Moody’s and Fitch that we would be a disciplined organization, with disciplined people engaged in disciplined thought and actions." and doing another ... having Tom put together a proposal in 2 weeks. Two weeks is not enough time for diligence, and Tom Wistricill has not demonstrated the leadership necessary to understand what he's putting together and all of it's potential repercussions. Another well-meaning, Texas-born president of UA told us back in the 1980's that we were getting a great, new arena for the University of Akron. The result was the JAR. He also said that our first football coach from Notre Dame would bring glory to the Zips. Yeah, that turned out well. Took the Zips 23 years to return to the NCAA Basketball Tournament after Bob Huggins went to Cincinnati following that great decision. Keener'92 had a good point. I don't want to join the illustrious ranks of the institutions that he listed. That group indicates this not to be the helpful venture it's thought to be. I suggest that members on this board heed the advice implied in Spin's signature line from Steven Covey. "Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply." It could also be said that "Many people do not read with the intent to understand; they read with the intent to reply." I sincerely thank everyone who has responded positively or negatively to my posts and I do mean that. It took me awhile, as I said in an earlier post, to understand that I started this thread over the wrong issue. The real issue is the effect of the Browns Training Camp on UA as a whole. That is the point I will continue to make to university officials in any correspondence I have with them. I believe UA is on the verge of entering into an agreement of which they have not diligently explored all of the possible outcomes/repercussions. UA could get into an agreement with the Browns that doesn't fulfill the administratrations hopes and further strains an already overly constrained budget. How often have we seen politicans enact something, and it has an effect they didn't expect. Business owners have a real stake in their business because it is their livelihood, and they make decision based on business models, risk asessments, cost-benefit analyses, etc. Politicans, including university presidents, don't have the same motivation. If they make a mistake one place, they can move on to another. As fknbuflobo stated, UA students and alumni are the ones left with the mess. I made the mistake of being satirical along the way and pissing off Browns fans and others with incendiary remarks. I apologize for that. I think most of us can agree that we love UA, or we wouldn't even be on this forum. I encourage all of you to demand more of UA's leaders than just assumptions and hope. Those of us who pay tuition or make donations to UA deserve it. That answers the question of why the president and AD should have brought this subject to light at Saturday night's soccer alumni event. There were many donors in that room who give significant yearly donations to UA. They deserve proper respect from the UA Administration who are only with UA temporarily. EDIT: I bolded things not for emphasis or to shout them out but rather to point them out since this turned out to be "a novel". I think you can read the bold print and get most of my points if you don't want to read everything.

it's not hearsay if it comes from a good source. Watergate is a good example. You know what they say about assumptions...

Isn't there a receiver for the San Diego Chargers in the NFL who chose to play basketball in college? Yeah, Antonio Gates, I believe. There may be others with similar backgrounds, but I'm not well versed on NFL players. My point is that choosing soccer today at one level doesn't necessarily preclude football tomorrow at another level if one is a great athlete. Also, perhaps this guy is a good student, too. That could make him eligible for an academic scholarship. Soccer scholarships are limited, but other possibilities sometimes present themselves.

I also think #9 Holthusen has potential up front. Nice to have viable options.