akron football Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Arrogance to the tenth degree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxZIP Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 I just wish we could line up in a normal extra point formation and kick them through on a regular basis. Leaving the decision about whether we go for 2 points or 1 point up to a 19 year old doesn't make much sense to me. If we had just played it straight, we win 24-23 with no drama needed.The entire game is determined by 18-23 year olds. All players are called upon to make calls based on how they are coached. The decision to use the wacky formation shift is what should be questioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilltopper Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 I just wish we could line up in a normal extra point formation and kick them through on a regular basis. Leaving the decision about whether we go for 2 points or 1 point up to a 19 year old doesn't make much sense to me. If we had just played it straight, we win 24-23 with no drama needed.The entire game is determined by 18-23 year olds. All players are called upon to make calls based on how they are coached. The decision to use the wacky formation shift is what should be questioned.We agree then, the coaches should decide whether the team goes for a 2pt conversion, not the players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxZIP Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 I just wish we could line up in a normal extra point formation and kick them through on a regular basis. Leaving the decision about whether we go for 2 points or 1 point up to a 19 year old doesn't make much sense to me. If we had just played it straight, we win 24-23 with no drama needed.The entire game is determined by 18-23 year olds. All players are called upon to make calls based on how they are coached. The decision to use the wacky formation shift is what should be questioned.We agree then, the coaches should decide whether the team goes for a 2pt conversion, not the players.The coaches "made" the decision to go for two by making it a optional read on each extra point play. I was just pointing out that many decisions are left up to 19 year old players. You seem to be saying that 19 year olds are not capable of making reads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Kangaroo Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 We've been clamoring for some time for iCoach to be aggressive and try to get the win... Now that he was and came up just short in the process, we're blasting him for not playing smart. WHICH IS IT? It cant be both ways."Aggressive?" No. "Stupid?" Yes. He played that last 4 seconds like he's never been in that position before. Which is understandable, because he's never been so close to a win before.He didn't have the faith in his guys to win in OT, so he took the 1-in-3 gamble to go for 2 in regulation. He rolled snake eyes.iCoach blew the game. Stupid play call. Time to get waxed by Miami. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Snyder Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 We've been clamoring for some time for iCoach to be aggressive and try to get the win... Now that he was and came up just short in the process, we're blasting him for not playing smart. WHICH IS IT? It cant be both ways."Aggressive?" No. "Stupid?" Yes. He played that last 4 seconds like he's never been in that position before. Which is understandable, because he's never been so close to a win before.He didn't have the faith in his guys to win in OT, so he took the 1-in-3 gamble to go for 2 in regulation. He rolled snake eyes.iCoach blew the game. Stupid play call. Time to get waxed by Miami.Assumptions The NCAA and the NFL have similar statistics for the success rate of two-point conversions and extra points. In the NFL the figures are 43% for the two-point conversion and 94% for the extra point, while in the NCAA the figures are 43.5% and 93.8% http://www.thesportjournal.org/article/pla...-two-touchdownsBrad Detwiler on Zips radio said he could not criticize the play call. He believed that either decision was defendable and OK. He went on to say that if you polled the players (he was a player in late 90s) that 98% would say go for the 2. He also theorized that by going for 2, the decision was on him and not the players if they should lose in OT...inferring that he was taking on the responsibility intentionally. I think there are alternative views that are valid.I don't have a problem with the call because he was going for the win and building team aggressiveness and cohesiveness. My only issue is with who the primary target was...Price. It is debatable if he is a quality receiver at this time, but I think it is not debatable that he does not catch the ball in traffic well. I would have targeted Suel on the other side or the TE Ladrach in the back center of end zone. Price was double covered and I am sure Suel was blanketed as well….there had to be room for the TE to slip into the gap. Just my opinion... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave in Green Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Thanks for the calm and rational analysis, Doug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Kangaroo Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Brad Detwiler on Zips radio said he could not criticize the play call. He believed that either decision was defendable and OK. He went on to say that if you polled the players (he was a player in late 90s) that 98% would say go for the 2. He also theorized that by going for 2, the decision was on him and not the players if they should lose in OT...inferring that he was taking on the responsibility intentionally.I don't think Brad Detwiler's opinion is worth any more than anyone else's. It's probably worth less, since his pay check is signed Tom Wistercil. He's not going to question the coach. Would the players want to go for the 2-point conversion? Sure. But players are 19 years old. The players are hyper-emotional. That's why they have coaches. Every player wants to go for 2. Every player implores his coach to "go for it" on every 4th-and-1, or 4th-and-2. And every player begs their coach to throw the challenge flag on every almost-questionable, but obviously caught opponent's pass. The coach's job is to protect the players from themselves. Ianello didn't do that on Saturday.At 20-6, he let the players decide to go for 2*. What happened? What did it cost us?* allegedly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilltopper Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 The coaches "made" the decision to go for two by making it a optional read on each extra point play. I was just pointing out that many decisions are left up to 19 year old players. You seem to be saying that 19 year olds are not capable of making reads.I employ quite a few 19 year olds, but I don't let them make decisions that might effect my future employment. It's called situational awareness. You don't go for 2 when 1 is appropriate considering the circumstances. I guess it's not surprising from a coach who attempts a field goal when down by 3 touchdowns late in the 4th Qtr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Adams Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 The figure of 43% of 2 point conversions being successful in college is the same figure I saw at least 3 different places. Whether Ianello knew that or took it into consideration,who knows? We know coaches don't always make decisions based on statistics. There is knowledge of the game(or lack thereof),emotion,the ebb and flow of the game etc,etc. Without making it a personal issue with this coach, the fans where I was sitting were reacting to the decision to attempt a relatively low percentage play as opposed to giving the team the opportunity to continue playing against a team they had been handling in the second half. There was no second guessing. We reacted when we realized that they were going for 2 not afterward. I thought the guy wearing the Wagner jersey in 210 was going to jump over the rail. Anyway,lets at least hope that the changes that were made on the offensive side of the ball continue the rest of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueandgold Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Kick two PATs and you win. Kick the second PAT and you go to OT with a huge amount of momentum and likely win. Go for a TD instead of a FG when you're down by 2 scores and a FG doesn't change that fact and you win. Coach doesn't want to win. He also is pretty terrible at math.The first TD, you're down by 20. What does going for 2 do in that situation? If you make it, nothing. If you miss, you're down 14 instead of 13 for the extra point. Then, down by 14, you go for a FG instead of a TD, so you're still down by 2 scores. A FG does nothing there. Then at the end, you go for 2 again (with a really stupid play) and lose the game instead of sending it to OT at home with all the momentum. But it wouldn't have been neccesary if you weren't stupid earlier on in the game. Lol. Question the FG over Trying for TD? If we don't have the 3 there we are down 4 at end of game.For the rest. You Always question him not going for it and punting or like Zach picking the sure 3 over a chance TD, but then get mad he goes aggressive when we have chance to win the game? You are idiots. We are playing for wins now. You have a team confused, no confidence and wounded. You go for the kill!!! If we are 4-2 you go for OT, we are 1-6 so you go for the kill.Most of you need to attend the football 101 (I know it's for ladies that's my point).I agree. When you are struggling as bad as this team, you go for the win when you have the chance. In all probability, if we kicked the extra point, we would've still lost the game in overtime. That's just the kind of season we are having. We all want our team to win. I was glad to see he actually "tried" to win instead of continuing the "process" into overtime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Kangaroo Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 In all probability, if we kicked the extra point, we would've still lost the game in overtime. You gotta explain how the probability of losing in OT was better than 43%. I need to see that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueandgold Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 In all probability, if we kicked the extra point, we would've still lost the game in overtime. You gotta explain how the probability of losing in OT was better than 43%. I need to see that one.That's an easy one. We have lost 87% of the time this year and 90% of the time since ICoach has been here. So, whether we went for two at the end or kicked the extra point to go to OT, we most likely would still lose the game. I'm just saying that it was nice to see us playing aggressive to "try" to win at the end of the game. Let's be honest...how many other games did it look like we were trying to win? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Kangaroo Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 We have lost 87% of the time this year and 90% of the time since ICoach has been here. So, whether we went for two at the end or kicked the extra point to go to OT, we most likely would still lose the game. I'm just saying that it was nice to see us playing aggressive to "try" to win at the end of the game. Let's be honest...how many other games did it look like we were trying to win? Fair-enough answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyzip84 Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 I notice Rob won't be joining the Zips Live show tonight. Which of the following explains this best?1) short practice week2) the beginning of hoops3) not wanting to talk about any 2-PT conversion decisions ever again4) something else Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mes102 Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 I notice Rob won't be joining the Zips Live show tonight. Which of the following explains this best?1) short practice week2) the beginning of hoops3) not wanting to talk about any 2-PT conversion decisions ever again4) something else5) All of the Above Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zipmeister Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 We have lost 87% of the time this year and 90% of the time since ICoach has been here. So, whether we went for two at the end or kicked the extra point to go to OT, we most likely would still lose the game. I'm just saying that it was nice to see us playing aggressive to "try" to win at the end of the game. Let's be honest...how many other games did it look like we were trying to win? Fair-enough answer.Is it? I think we are undefeated in overtime over the last 1 and 2/3 seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip-zip Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 We have lost 87% of the time this year and 90% of the time since ICoach has been here. So, whether we went for two at the end or kicked the extra point to go to OT, we most likely would still lose the game. I'm just saying that it was nice to see us playing aggressive to "try" to win at the end of the game. Let's be honest...how many other games did it look like we were trying to win? Fair-enough answer.Is it? I think we are undefeated in overtime over the last 1 and 2/3 seasons.I'm sure you're thinking "since Gardner Webb". But, I am pretty sure the Ball State loss late last year was an overtime game as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Snyder Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 In all probability, if we kicked the extra point, we would've still lost the game in overtime. You gotta explain how the probability of losing in OT was better than 43%. I need to see that one.I am indifferent to the decision on this play. I really don't have a problem that they went for the win....although I probably would have taken the game to OT. Here is why I think it is not a bad idea:1. If you do not like the defense you are going against you can let the play clock run out and take 5 yards and kick the extra point.2. If you get a penalty...even a 15 yard version...you can kick the extra point.3. If you go into overtime and have a penalty you will probably lose. Tough to pick up an extra 10 or 15 yards near the goal line.4. If you lose the coin toss in OT...you may have to take the ball first. Way more pressure with having the ball 1st.If I was sure to get the ball second in OT...I would choose to go to OT. Otherwise, I am OK with this decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Z Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 If you lose the coin toss in OT...you may have to take the ball first.With i"Coach", I'm happy to get the ball at least once after a coin toss.You can put me in the camp of kicking an extra point and tying it up and trying to win in OT. Momentum is an awesome thing in football.Plus we get a "free" practice out of the OT, good for a young team and an inexperienced coach. Going for two was a lazy way to make dinner time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UAZipster0305 Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 If you lose the coin toss in OT...you may have to take the ball first.With i"Coach", I'm happy to get the ball at least once after a coin toss.You can put me in the camp of kicking an extra point and tying it up and trying to win in OT. Momentum is an awesome thing in football.Plus we get a "free" practice out of the OT, good for a young team and an inexperienced coach. Going for two was a lazy way to make dinner time. Interesting take. I don't know of any coach who would consider this as a factor. At this level, all it should come down to is which scenario the coach feels his team has the best chance of winning. Period! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Z Posted November 1, 2011 Report Share Posted November 1, 2011 Interesting take.The last part was supposed to be in jest. I tried using a smiling emoticon to imply that, but I guess I missed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyzip84 Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 No second guessing from Ianello in Gaffney's column.He also confirms why Meriwether left the team. One thing I'll say about Rob is that he's proven to be a straight shooter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Z Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 No second guessing from Ianello in Gaffney's column.“I had a bunch of players, which I appreciate, after the game come right up to me and say they liked the call, good call,” said IanelloIf this is true, this is the best thing that has come out of it. I wish a W come out of it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Kangaroo Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 No second guessing from Ianello in Gaffney's column.“I had a bunch of players, which I appreciate, after the game come right up to me and say they liked the call, good call,” said IanelloIf this is true, this is the best thing that has come out of it. I wish a W come out of it though.Wow...I'd have thought the players would have told their Coach he was a moron? Who knew? (emoticon inserted for the sarcastically-impaired)Click here to understand why players like going for the 2-point conversion, and why a Coach shouldn't listen to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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