Staying Close to the Vest - Ex Coach Groce-related News and Views

[Captain Kangaroo]

16 minutes ago, VAZip said:

What does fb do for UA as whole?

 

There is no amount of success they could have in fb that is remotely as beneficial as tournament run. 

1.) It allows us to stay in MAC and avoid the Horizon League.

 

2.) We will never have a tournament run. Those days are over. That's a big reason why Groce left. He'll have more money to retain players like Nate Johnson...money that Bud Wentz and his supporters could only dream of generating.

 

Every upperclassman capable of leading the Zips to an NCAA tournament victory as a Junior or Senior will have left UA for greener pastures during their final 1 or 2 years of eligibility.

[kreed5120]

6 minutes ago, VAZip said:

If even part of the reason is the football program is hampering the success of bb and the other successful sports programs I have to ask..what does fb do for UA as whole? Even if they managed to when the MAC and went on to win a potato, tangerine, or fruitcake bowl, who would really notice and how would that add to the prestige of UA? There is no amount of success they could have in fb that is remotely as beneficial as tournament run. 

 

That was one of the things that stuck out to me about Goodrich's interview. He pointed out Duke's basketball program needed football to remain in the ACC. That makes sense as at that level only the Big East could provide a comparable alternative if they scrapped football and even then that could be a step down.

 

Akron will never get an AAC, let alone ACC invite so that makes it an invalid comparison. The A10 and MVC are non-FBS conferences in our own footprint that would be a step up in competition compared to the MAC for hoops.

 

10 years ago I wouldn't seriously considered canceling the FBS program, but with NIL and our well documented financial troubles I just don't see how we can keep up in both sports. It's reported the NIL spend in basketball is projected to be up 35% compared to last year. With that kind of growth it's just a matter of time before our basketball program decays over time. If we continue down this path I fear we will have 2 programs struggling. Maybe not now, but in 5-10 years out.

[VAZip]

3 hours ago, Captain Kangaroo said:

1.) It allows us to stay in MAC and avoid the Horizon League.

 

2.) We will never have a tournament run. Those days are over. That's a big reason why Groce left. He'll have more money to retain players like Nate Johnson...money that Bud Wentz and his supporters could only dream of generating.

 

Every upperclassman capable of leading the Zips to an NCAA tournament victory as a Junior or Senior will have left UA for greener pastures during their final 1 or 2 years of eligibility.

I’m not sure how UA benefits as a whole by staying in the MAC just for football …maybe the pay games provide some money but hard to see it balances out salary, scholarships, stadium management, etc

Won’t Gross have more NIL money at coc because they don’t have a football team..I thought that was kind of the argument 

the university is in financial straits…I’m not sure they have the luxury of continuing to fund a losing enterprise that in the best of times wouldn’t provide a meaningful benefit 

[Hilltopper]

13 minutes ago, VAZip said:

I’m not sure how UA benefits as a whole by staying in the MAC just for football …maybe the pay games provide some money but hard to see it balances out salary, scholarships, stadium management, etc

Won’t Gross have more NIL money at coc because they don’t have a football team..I thought that was kind of the argument 

the university is in financial straits…I’m not sure they have the luxury of continuing to fund a losing enterprise that in the best of times wouldn’t provide a meaningful benefit 

Football itself is not a money losing proposition. It's the 85 other scholarships and costs to field the women's sports needed to comply with title 9.

[LZIp]

12 minutes ago, Hilltopper said:

Football itself is not a money losing proposition. It's the 85 other scholarships and costs to field the women's sports needed to comply with title 9.

Thank you. Tired of everyone attacking football. A respectable football program is a great asset to a University. Why does nobody ever talking about cutting any of the non-revenue generating sports that nobody pays attention to?

[LZIp]

33 minutes ago, VAZip said:

I’m not sure how UA benefits as a whole by staying in the MAC just for football …maybe the pay games provide some money but hard to see it balances out salary, scholarships, stadium management, etc

Won’t Gross have more NIL money at coc because they don’t have a football team..I thought that was kind of the argument 

the university is in financial straits…I’m not sure they have the luxury of continuing to fund a losing enterprise that in the best of times wouldn’t provide a meaningful benefit 

The math has been done on this board many times. The U comes out ahead staying in FBS compared to dropping to FCS. The A10 and MVC are basically 1 bid leagues anymore. Don’t see the benefit of joining a tougher bball conference when there aren’t going to be anymore spots available.

[VAZip]

16 minutes ago, LZIp said:

The math has been done on this board many times. The U comes out ahead staying in FBS compared to dropping to FCS. The A10 and MVC are basically 1 bid leagues anymore. Don’t see the benefit of joining a tougher bball conference when there aren’t going to be anymore spots available.

Just curious…has it been done where you just drop it all together

[kreed5120]

4 minutes ago, LZIp said:

Thank you. Tired of everyone attacking football. A respectable football program is a great asset to a University. Why does nobody ever talking about cutting any of the non-revenue generating sports that nobody pays attention to?

 

What's the pathway to respectable? Miami (OH) will have a $6M-$8M roster at a time that we can't even afford a training table. Where are we going to come up with the money like that? Is Kaulig going to bankroll the roster?

 

I don't think we can cut anymore sports. We shaved off all the sports we could during covid. FBS schools are required to support 16 sports. Non-FBS 14. I'm pretty sure we're at 16. Unless we added any since our last cuts. If so, I wouldn't be opposed to slashing to get back down to 16.

 

Revenue share and NIL has widened the gap. The math has changed and the amount needed to compete, at least at a respectable level, has considerably increased. In fact, it's going to continue to increase as more and more schools are contributing to revenue share at levels Akron can't keep up with.

 

If there was a good plan in place to make Akron football competitive and relevant I wouldn't have such a harsh look. I just don't see light at the end of the tunnel that leads me to believe we can consistently win 6+ games under the current circumstances.

[HoopsFan03]

21 minutes ago, LZIp said:

Thank you. Tired of everyone attacking football. A respectable football program is a great asset to a University. Why does nobody ever talking about cutting any of the non-revenue generating sports that nobody pays attention to?

Can't drop women's sports. Baseball was dropped and just came back. 

[LZIp]

1 minute ago, kreed5120 said:

 

What's the pathway to respectable? Miami (OH) will have a $6M-$8M roster at a time that we can't even afford a training table. Where are we going to come up with the money like that? Is Kaulig going to bankroll the roster?

 

I don't think we can cut anymore sports. We shaved off all the sports we could during covid. FBS schools are required to support 16 sports. Non-FBS 14. I'm pretty sure we're at 16. Unless we added any since our last cuts. If so, I wouldn't be opposed to slashing to get back down to 16.

 

Revenue share and NIL has widened the gap. The math has changed and the amount needed to compete, at least at a respectable level, has considerably increased. In fact, it's going to continue to increase as more and more schools are contributing to revenue share at levels Akron can't keep up with.

 

If there was a good plan in place to make Akron football competitive and relevant I wouldn't have such a harsh look. I just don't see light at the end of the tunnel that leads me to believe we can consistently win 6+ games under the current circumstances.

I believe we brought baseball back after being cut and also started a women’s lacrosse program.

[kreed5120]

9 minutes ago, LZIp said:

I believe we brought baseball back after being cut and also started a women’s lacrosse program.

We brought baseball back, but axed cross country so that was a wash. Although baseball is one of the biggest money losers in D1 sports so that probably still wasn't a wise decision. Should have probably just left baseball dead.

 

With women's lacrosse I think that would put us at 17. We might be able to eliminate 1 women's sport. Not sure which would generate the most savings.

Edited 50 minutes ago by kreed5120

[ZipForNow]

Women’s lacrosse is a net revenue generator I believe. Many are on only partial scholarships.

[zippy5]

Surprised no thank you message/post from Groce

[infofan]

baseball was brought back courtesy of a big donation from the Skeeles family who also support other athletic programs at UA.  Still probably the lowest budget in the MAC but a repectable 13-14 so far this season (5-7) in  conference 

[ZipsBBjunkie]