MAC Tournament Opinions

[NWAkron]

We have ZERO control or impact on this, but as we lock down during this long cold week (and await the Zips trip to Millett Hall) might be a good time to discuss how a MAC tourney could or will play out.  If COVID #s keep going down, vaccines ramp up, and the bottom 4 clearly remain the directional schools what will things look like in Cleveland.

 

A note, on the women's side the PCCC women sit atop the conference but only played 5 games.  BG is second and played 13 games.

 

If Akron and Toledo sit atop the men's side, and have split their games maybe one game to decide it all?

[clarkwgriswold]

With the likely differences in games played and teams played, I'd suggest that they poll the coaches and seed the top 8 from that poll.  As a safeguard, you eliminate the highest and lowest seedings from the vote to take out some coaches playing games with the system.

[LoyalZIP]

I'm very curious to see what the MAC has in regards to tie-breaking procedures as I think it's both pretty obvious and not surprising that not all games will end up being played. With that said, those losses to EMU and NIU really mask how much better than the pack Akron and Toledo are. I know Kent isn't at full strength, but remember they were when Akron came back to beat them and that was with significantly fewer games under the belt and Trimble on an off shooting night, which is worth at least 10 points itself.

 

I'm also glad that they Zips got that game at RMF in earlier this year. They're somewhat familiar to playing in an empty NBA arena which could be a slight advantage for things like creating energy and sight lines.

 

I really don't know what to expect, I wouldn't even be surprised if at the last second the MAC decided to play the games at campus sights or something like that. Wait to see. 

[RoyalBlu]

1 hour ago, LoyalZIP said:

I'm very curious to see what the MAC has in regards to tie-breaking procedures as I think it's both pretty obvious and not surprising that not all games will end up being played. With that said, those losses to EMU and NIU really mask how much better than the pack Akron and Toledo are. I know Kent isn't at full strength, but remember they were when Akron came back to beat them and that was with significantly fewer games under the belt and Trimble on an off shooting night, which is worth at least 10 points itself.

 

I'm also glad that they Zips got that game at RMF in earlier this year. They're somewhat familiar to playing in an empty NBA arena which could be a slight advantage for things like creating energy and sight lines.

 

I really don't know what to expect, I wouldn't even be surprised if at the last second the MAC decided to play the games at campus sights or something like that. Wait to see. 

 

Since the Cavs are playing with (limited) people in the stands, would guess the MAC Tournament will have at least family and administrators in the stands.

 

For argument sake, the seedings will be interesting, but in the grand scheme of things not that big of a deal. Just guessing, Miami and Ball State are tracking to be the last two teams. Akron and Toledo are at the top of the totem pole. Good (easy/winnable) games for both (discount BSU Saturday upset).

 

Good thing for Akron, in terms of wildcard  (semifinal) opponents who could pull upsets, they will likely play both Ohio and Buffalo twice. Toledo only plays them each once. Toledo's best MAC wins are Kent twice (at full strength) and Akron. Same for Akron.

 

2 UB and OU games for Akron are a plus in my mind. There has to be a ??? for Toledo about playing both of those teams in the tournament, especially OU a team they played and beat very early in the season but seems to be on the rise right now.

 

[kreed5120]

This was posted on a MAC sports thread. Apparently as of now the tournament is on, but seats will be limited.

 

[RowdyZip]

Per the MAC site, looks like some folks will have a shot at tickets for the semifinals and finals.  This will likely price tickets outside the range for most of us.

[NWAkron]

Someone mentioned a few years back that there's a guy at the Verizon in Macedonia who will hook you up for tix?

[clarkwgriswold]

36 minutes ago, NWAkron said:

Someone mentioned a few years back that there's a guy at the Verizon in Macedonia who will hook you up for tix?

 

Fake news.

[NWAkron]

1 hour ago, RowdyZip said:

Per the MAC site, looks like some folks will have a shot at tickets for the semifinals and finals.  This will likely price tickets outside the range for most of us.

those are good if you just want to see the game and don't care who is playing.

[ZippyRulz]

I'll take whatever comes but I would be happy with a NIT final four.

 

7-seed: https://www.dratings.com/predictor/bracketology/

 

PCCC and Hocking Tech. Inst. also in as 8-seeds.

 

Edited February 9, 2021 by ZippyRulz

[NWAkron]

48 minutes ago, ZippyRulz said:

I'll take whatever comes but I would be happy with a NIT final four.

 

7-seed: https://www.dratings.com/predictor/bracketology/

 

PCCC and Hocking Tech. Inst. also in as 8-seeds.

 

Nelsonville Junior College.  the NIT bracket seems strange.  i can't imagine 3 MAC schools getting in/

[kreed5120]

10 hours ago, NWAkron said:

Nelsonville Junior College.  the NIT bracket seems strange.  i can't imagine 3 MAC schools getting in/

 

That bracket has the 3 MAC schools as 7 & 8  seeds, which means really none of them would get in. The NIT gives auto bids to regular season conference winners who fail to win their conference tournament. There is usually 8-10 of those per year from 1 bid conferences. Those teams get the 7 & 8 seeds in the NIT.

[Zipmeister]

22 hours ago, clarkwgriswold said:

With the likely differences in games played and teams played, I'd suggest that they poll the coaches and seed the top 8 from that poll.  As a safeguard, you eliminate the highest and lowest seedings from the vote to take out some coaches playing games with the system.

 

That's kind of what they do in the Olympics to try to control those pesky Russians.

[zippyfan34]

I checked ticket prices for the championship game and they had tickets as low as $22 and a lot of $38 as well.  I thought about jumping on the $22 for my family of 4 (which would be $88) but then there was almost $50 of fees on top of that (Total of $137).  I am cheap so I will wait until I know for sure they are paying before I would purchase

[NWAkron]

MAC tourney article from GT.  I think he could have left out the dig (even though true) against the Zips, but anyway.

 

"This is why the Zips, who’ve not played their best basketball in their past two games, need to just take care of their business the rest of the way. It’s what has the potential to happen in slots four and five where Ohio and Buffalo both stand at 7-4

 

"What remains clear is the conference tournament will dictate who receives the MAC’s automatic qualifier for the NCAA Tournament. That organizing body issued a statement at the end of last week regarding tournament play.

“Due to the challenges presented by the pandemic, conferences have until February 26 to submit their automatic qualifier form that details whether their AQ is based on the conference tournament or regular season champion. Conference championship format, field size and dates are under the auspices of the conferences,” according to a statement from the NCAA.

“That was the plan all along. It was never a plan to not have a conference tournament,” Steinbrecher said of the MAC’s annual event which will take place in Cleveland at Rocket Mortgage FieldHouse March 11-13. “And I think especially in a year where you think there’s a strong likelihood of an uneven number of games being played, I can’t think of a more fair way to test that AQ than having a tournament where everybody has that same chance.”

[LZIp]

3 hours ago, NWAkron said:

MAC tourney article from GT.  I think he could have left out the dig (even though true) against the Zips, but anyway.

 

"This is why the Zips, who’ve not played their best basketball in their past two games, need to just take care of their business the rest of the way. It’s what has the potential to happen in slots four and five where Ohio and Buffalo both stand at 7-4

 

I haven't read the article, but what was his point here? Honestly I see no real difference between Miami and Ball St in the 7 or 8 seed, nor do I see much difference in BG, Owho, Canada, and Rootstown CC in the 3-6 seeds, and at this point, I'd bet against any of those scenarios changing.

Edited February 17, 2021 by LZIp

[RoyalBlu]

On 2/17/2021 at 6:16 PM, LZIp said:

I haven't read the article, but what was his point here? Honestly I see no real difference between Miami and Ball St in the 7 or 8 seed, nor do I see much difference in BG, Owho, Canada, and Rootstown CC in the 3-6 seeds, and at this point, I'd bet against any of those scenarios changing.

 

Here is what I don't understand: By current head-to-head and overall MAC measures to date, Akron and Toledo are clearly the top two teams. Perhaps not significant, but clear. Yet all the top metrics have Toledo as a clear No. 1 team in the league and Akron trailing teams they have beaten. 

 

Kenpom           NET              RPI

64 Toledo       71 Toledo     60 Toledo

85 Buffalo       84 Kent        72 Kent

91 Kent            85 Buffalo   97 Akron

99 Akron          90 Akron      120 Ohio

104 Ohio          109 Ohio      138 Bowling Green  (169 Buffalo)

 

Looking at this, the MAC Tournament belongs to Toledo with all others as solid underdogs. I suspect the Zips (and all the rest) would take those odds just the same.

 

 

[LZIp]

2 minutes ago, RoyalBlu said:

 

Here is what I don't understand: By current head-to-head and overall MAC measures to date, Akron and Toledo are clearly the top two teams. Perhaps not significant, but clear. Yet all the top metrics have Toledo as a clear No. 1 team in the league and Akron trailing teams they have beaten. 

 

Kenpom           NET              RPI

64 Toledo       71 Toledo     60 Toledo

85 Buffalo       84 Kent        72 Kent

91 Kent            85 Buffalo   97 Akron

99 Akron          90 Akron      120 Ohio

104 Ohio          109 Ohio      138 Bowling Green  (169 Buffalo)

 

Looking at this, the MAC Tournament belongs to Toledo with all others as solid underdogs. I suspect the Zips (and all the rest) would take those odds just the same.

 

 

They must really hold those two losses to EMU and NIU against us. Context is important. Outside of those two games, we're clearly a top 2 MAC team IMO.

[NWAkron]

3 hours ago, LZIp said:

They must really hold those two losses to EMU and NIU against us. Context is important. Outside of those two games, we're clearly a top 2 MAC team IMO.

Canada is slightly favored over Toledo tomorrow night.  PCCC didn't have "bad" losses per se.   But, yeah, losing to 1 and 2 win teams isn't going to spin out of the computer well as opposed to PCCCs losses to UVA, Akron, and Toledo.  

[NWAkron]

https://getsomemaction.com/news/2021/2/23/mens-basketball-seeding-aq-policy.aspx

 

MAC tourney rules.  Clear as mud.

[MDZip]

Simulator for MAC tournament seeding. They don't account for only having 8 seeds but pretty easy to figure it out for yourself. Zips can finish anywhere from 2nd to 4th. Can't find a single scenario where they drop out of the top four. And if all of the games are played and they at least beat Miami they don't finish lower than 3. Is there anyone in the top six you don't think could win the whole thing?

Edited March 1, 2021 by MDZip

[NWAkron]

29 minutes ago, MDZip said:

Simulator for MAC tournament seeding. They don't account for only having 8 seeds but pretty easy to figure it out for yourself. Zips can finish anywhere from 2nd to 4th. Can't find a single scenario where they drop out of the top four. And if all of the games are played and they at least beat Miami they don't finish lower than 3. Is there anyone in the top six you don't think could win the whole thing?

Thanks for finding that.  If BG wins both of their games and Akron loses both, then Akron can move down to 5th.   Ideally, Zips get the #2 or #3 seed and have Buffalo and Toledo in the upper bracket.  Kent winning 3 games in a row will depend on how Pippen's knees hold out.  What if Akron finishes 12-6 and Ohio 11-5?  Are they considered tied?

Edited March 1, 2021 by NWAkron

[zippy5]

our best draw would be getting 2 or 3 and KSU getting the other side of the 2/3 I think. 

[MDZip]

21 minutes ago, NWAkron said:

Thanks for finding that.  If BG wins both of their games and Akron loses both, then Akron can move down to 5th.   Ideally, Zips get the #2 or #3 seed and have Buffalo and Toledo in the upper bracket.  Kent winning 3 games in a row will depend on how Pippen's knees hold out.  What if Akron finishes 12-6 and Ohio 11-5?  Are they considered tied?

Ah I missed that one - thanks - if the Zips finish the season by losing their last four they would deserve the fifth seed. Although even in that scenario they could also be saved if Kent ties with both of them. But if not all games get played and Akron finishes 12-6 and Ohio 11-5 Ohio gets the higher seed based on win percentage.

[zippy5]

26 minutes ago, NWAkron said:

Thanks for finding that.  If BG wins both of their games and Akron loses both, then Akron can move down to 5th.   Ideally, Zips get the #2 or #3 seed and have Buffalo and Toledo in the upper bracket.  Kent winning 3 games in a row will depend on how Pippen's knees hold out.  What if Akron finishes 12-6 and Ohio 11-5?  Are they considered tied?

Win percentage. OU would be above us in that instance