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I never was arguing that the AAC isn't better than the MAC. I'm just stating the gap between them isn't nearly as significant as it once was. The conference is now about on par with the MVC IMO, which is a massive step down from what it was before. I feel you're underestimating the impact of them getting raided by the Big 12.

St. Louis men's soccer page...is previewing the big matchup.... it is cool that there are 3 watch parties that Billiken fans can attend. St. Louis and Furman are currently tied for having the longest current unbeaten streaks. Amazing that St. Louis won 10 national titles between 1959 and 1973. https://slubillikens.com/news/2025/12/4/mens-soccer-msoc-preview-billikens-zips-clash-for-college-cup-berth.aspx SERIES HISTORY -- SLU leads 8-5-1 in a series that dates back to 1960, though Akron is 4-0-1 in the last five meetings. -- The squads met earlier this year in Akron, with the Zips coming away with a 3-0 victory. Akron opened the scoring with a goal on a penalty kick at the 33:11 mark. The Zips tacked on two more in the second half, scoring in the 62nd and 67th minute for the 3-0 final. -- The last SLU win in the series came on Aug. 29, 2003, a 1-0 victory on a neutral field in Charlottesville, Va. -- The Billikens' last win against the Zips in Akron was in 1989, 1-0 on a game-winner by John Johnson.

You don't need to be a moderator to start a thread.

They still have 2 teams in the top 100 for NET, neither of which are any of Memphis, FAU, or Wichita St (Wichita St is 102). Completely agree they have not been a 3-4 bid league for a while, but their pathway to 2+ bids is much clearer than the MAC's or any other true mid major conference. I would easily rather player an in-conference schedule of AAC schools compared to MAC schools. Wichita St. is a solid CBB brand thanks to Gregg Marshall. Memphis is one of the top non P4 CBB brands thanks to Calipari and now Penny Hardaway. FAU is just 2 years removed from a trip to the Final Four. Their lowest rated team is 300 in NET right now. The MAC has 3 teams with 300+ NET and a 4th knocking on the door. Time will tell if the AAC continues to be a significant step up from the MAC as a whole, but as of today, it still remains true.

I agree this is a conversation for another place, but I will add I think this is also the new American. Wichita State was only relevant under Gregg Marshall and he was forced out two coaches ago because of scandal. Before him you have to go back to the 1980s to find the last time they were really relevant and before that the 1960s. Every 20 or so years they seem to have a decent stretch. Memphis could be better, but even then they would still most likely be a 1 bid conference. Their pathway to two bids is 1 team having a terrific season then that team losing in the conference tourney. The days of the American getting 3 or 4 bids are long gone.

I suspect not from his persistent whining.

If anyone is interested.... I really thought Dall, Gant, and Laventure should have been higher... and I'm surprised Dewalt didn't get mentioned (PFF had Dewalt and Reed has the second and third rated CB's in the MAC) they didn't get mentioned at all. Laventure is the second rated interior lineman in the MAC, Summers the 7th rated linebacker, and Dall the 9th rated Edge rusher AHEAD of Voorhies. White from UMASS is the seventh rated edge rusher in the ENTIRE country and somehow gets second team MAC, make that make sense???) Can't argue about Heldman and Trick though... 2025 MAC Football Postseason Specialty Awards & All-Conference Teams Coach of the Year: Lance Taylor, Western Michigan Vern Smith Leadership Award Winner: Nadame Tucker, DE, Western Michigan Offensive Player of the Year: Broc Lowry, QB, Western Michigan Defensive Player of the Year: Nadame Tucker, DE, Western Michigan Special Teams Player of the Year: Da’Realyst Clark, KOR, Kent State Freshman of the Year: Cameron Pettaway, RB/KOR, Bowling Green 2025 All-MAC First Team Offense Quarterback – Broc Lowry, Western Michigan Offensive Lineman – Trevor Brock, Buffalo Offensive Lineman – Davion Weatherspoon, Ohio Offensive Lineman – Anthony Boswell, Toledo Offensive Lineman – Raheem Anderson, Western Michigan Offensive Lineman – Chad Schuster, Western Michigan Tight End – Jyrin Johnson, Bowling Green Wide Receiver – Nik McMillan, Buffalo Wide Receiver – Victor Snow, Buffalo Wide Receiver – Kam Perry, Miami Wide Receiver – Junior Vandeross III, Toledo Running Back – Sieh Bangura, Ohio Running Back – Chip Trayanum, Toledo Placekicker – Dom Dzioban, Miami 2025 All-MAC First Team Defense Defensive Lineman – Nathan Voorhis, Ball State Defensive Lineman – Michael Heldman, Central Michigan Defensive Lineman – Adam Trick, Miami Defensive Lineman – Nadame Tucker, Western Michigan Linebacker – Gideon Lampron, Bowling Green Linebacker – Red Murdock, Buffalo Linebacker – Jordan Kwiatkowski, Central Michigan Linebacker – K’Von Sherman, Toledo Defensive Back – Eli Blakey, Miami Defensive Back – Emmanuel McNeil-Warren, Toledo Defensive Back – Andre Fuller, Toledo Defensive Back – Braden Awls, Toledo Punter – Keegan Andrews, UMass 2025 All-MAC First Team Specialists Kickoff Return Specialist – Cameron Pettaway, Bowling Green Kickoff Return Specialist – Da’Realyst Clark, Kent State 2025 All-MAC Second Team Offense Quarterback – Parker Navarro, Ohio Offensive Lineman – Nate Pabst, Bowling Green Offensive Lineman – Tyler Doty, Buffalo Offensive Lineman – Drew Terrill, Miami Offensive Lineman – Jordon Jones, Ohio Offensive Lineman – Ethan Spoth, Toledo Tight End – Joshua Long, Eastern Michigan Wide Receiver – Israel Polk, Akron Wide Receiver – Marcel Williams, Akron Wide Receiver – Chase Hendricks, Ohio Wide Receiver – Trayvon Rudolph, Toledo Running Back – Jordan Gant, Akron Running Back – Dontae McMillan, Eastern Michigan Placekicker – Jackson Kleather, Bowling Green 2025 All-MAC Second Team Defense Defensive Lineman – Julien Laventure, Akron Defensive Lineman – Jamond Mathis, Kent State Defensive Lineman – Marques White, UMass Defensive Lineman – Jay Crable, Ohio Defensive Lineman – Martez Poynter, Toledo Linebacker – Dakota Cochran, Central Michigan Linebacker – CJ Young, Kent State Linebacker – Corban Hondru, Miami Linebacker – Quinton Urwiler, Northern Illinois Defensive Back – Bryce Llewellyn, Eastern Michigan Defensive Back – Silas Walters, Miami Defensive Back – Avery Smith, Toledo Defensive Back – Tate Hallock, Western Michigan Punter – Dylan Drennan, Buffalo 2025 All-MAC Second Team Specialists Kickoff Return Specialist – Victor Snow, Buffalo Kickoff Return Specialist – Trayvon Rudolph, Toledo 2025 All-MAC Third Team Offense Quarterback – Tucker Gleason, Toledo Offensive Lineman – Keylen Davis, Akron Offensive Lineman – Mickey Rewolinski, Eastern Michigan Offensive Lineman – Eric Smith, Miami Offensive Lineman – Evan Malcore, Northern Illinois Offensive Lineman – Nick Marinaro, Ohio Tight End – Mason Williams, Ohio Wide Receiver – Langston Lewis, Central Michigan Wide Receiver – Nick Devereaux, Eastern Michigan Wide Receiver – Cade Wolford, Kent State Wide Receiver – Jacquon Gibson, UMass Running Back – Chavon Wright, Northern Illinois Running Back – Jalen Buckley, Western Michigan Placekicker – Jack Howes, Buffalo Placekicker - Cade Graham, Central Michigan 2025 All-MAC Third Team Defense Defensive Lineman – Bruno Dall, Akron Defensive Lineman – Junior Poyser, Buffalo Defensive Lineman – Malachi Davis, Toledo Defensive Lineman – Esean Carter, Toledo Linebacker – Mason Woods, Kent State Linebacker – Tyler Martin, UMass Linebacker – Jackson Kuwatch, Miami Linebacker – Chris D’Appolonia, Toledo Defensive Back – MJ Cannon, Bowling Green Defensive Back – Jalen McClendon, Bowling Green Defensive Back – Tank Pearson, Ohio Defensive Back – Josh Franklin, Western Michigan Punter – Mitchell Tomasek, Eastern Michigan 2025 All-MAC Third Team Specialists Kickoff Return Specialist – Dev’ion Reynolds, Northern Illinois Kickoff Return Specialist – Bryson Hammer, Toledo

Great article from the Beacon Journal previewing Saturday's match and drawing some similarities to the 2018 Zips team. https://www.beaconjournal.com/story/sports/college/soccer/2025/12/04/akron-zips-soccer-saint-louis-ncaa-tournament-college-cup-jared-embick/87558472007/

I view the last few years as the new standard for the MAC, due to poor vision and leadership. What has the MAC done to make anyone believe they are anything more than a bottom half mid major conference? Probably a conversation for a different thread, though.

Rowdies should be expanded to include alumni.

Two reasons: He would have taken a large pay cut and a family event that he didn't want to disrupt.

Then root for Indiana football at 8.

And probably the model arena for a MAC school, one that we would probably like to have. But as we are aware, facilities are just one piece of the puzzle.

I have a request for the moderator. Can we move all the discussions about Groce leaving into its own thread like we have in football, "Coach Joe Rumor Page" I have no problems with people posting about rumors 4 weeks into the season but this thread is about Mac basketball 2025-2026, not about decisons Groce will makes 4 months from now.

But could he be a serviceable backup big? 😉

Honestly, no thanks. He can't get up and down the court like we need in Groce's style of play. Nor is he good enough, like a Freeman, to work our offense around to work through.

Hmmm. Do you think he enjoyed his visit to Akron? (other than losing the game)

The MAC was a bit of an anomaly as well for the past several seasons. Prior to covid it was pretty consistently in or around the top 15 conferences. Last year in particular the bottom fell out.

Correct, although right now is an anomaly with Memphis, Wichita St., etc. struggling. Last year, the AAC finished as the 11th best conference in NET (the MAC was 23rd for comparison). It is still closer to that Next 5 tier than it is a bottom half/one-bid conference.

It's easier to win in the American now, but it's also very much a mid-major. Before it was in an awkward position where it wasn't a power conference school, but still clearly a step above the rest. If you actually look at the top 2/3 of both conferences they're pretty much the same now. Those top 8 teams in AAC have an average NET of 122.5 while the top 8 in the MAC are 122. The only thing that separates the 2 conferences is the handful of teams at the bottom of the conference. The MAC has more dead weight.

Friday 12/5 at 7pm EST. Rematch of last year's 5A title game where Semaj's team was a runner up.

Try this

Big time, which is a little surprising considering a few of the OGs are still involved with the University.

He has had 2 winning seasons in his first 6 years at the helm. Now, Tulane was an absolute train wreck under their previous HC, Mike Dunleavy, and they did not have much success prior to him, either. Tough spot to win it looks like and I'm sure the fan base is tired of seeing the program struggle to get over any sort of consistently successful hump. Also a tough conference to win in with Memphis, Wichita St., etc., but it's much easier than it used to be with Cincy, Houston, and others departing in recent years.

Pretty sad how far the rowdies have fallen off, used to be a ruthless environment, even the first few years out of covid.